Count Bassy

[quote name='Jacqueslemac' timestamp='1351498725' post='1851694'] I was once listening to a band playing Paranoid and noticed the bassist stuck to root notes throughout, not playing a single one of the runs. I asked a few of the people I was with what they thought of the song and they all thought the band played it well. Most people mix what they're hearing with the version that's being replayed on their own heads, I think. [/quote] IMHO most people don't care as long as long as it's done well, and 'done well' does not necessarily mean being true to the original. They are generally there to have a good time, which is generally more to do with the band creating atmosphere and enjoying themselves. And let's face it, except in specific places, what average (non bass playing) punter pays anything more than cursory attention to the bass line?

My scale of choice would be 32", based on one I built myself years ago, which led to a Fender urge MK1s, which is beautiful. However I'm mostly playing 5 string these days, and 32" 5 strings tend to be too expensive for me to justify (given by level and frequency of playing) . 32" just makes everything easier for my little hands. Especially if wanting to fret two notes at once.

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1351010302' post='1846197'] Sir Isaac and myself are in complete agreement. When the cone moves back and forth it alternately pressurizes and de-pressurizes the surrounding air. Said pressurization and de-pressurization causes your eardrums to move back and forth in reaction; that's how we hear. [b]Said pressurization and de-pressurization also causes the floor to move,[/b] [b]how much being a property of the stiffness and mass of the floor[/b]. If the floor was vibrating in reaction to the walls of the speaker vibrating said cabinet walls would have to be moving as far as the cone does. [/quote] I agree with the bit I've put in bold. The bit before that is correct, but a bit patronizing, and the bit after that is wrong. Also, I did say that I wasn't sure how significant the direct inertia affect was, but to deny its existence dismisses three centuries of conventional physics. What I am describing has nothing to do with acoustic energy, other than the fact that any physical vibration is acoustic. If you put a speaker in a completely sealed and completely rigid, effectively sound proof, box, suspended on long strings (or floating on air), Then if you vibrate the speaker within the box the box itself will move. Indeed, remove the cone and replace with a weight of the same mass, so that the acoustic energy output is negligible, and the box will still move by the same amount. This is basic physics at a level far more fundamental than acoustic engineering. Some basic calcs - say the cone assembly weighs 0.5 Kg and moves at 10 M/S, and the rest of the assembly weighs 25 Kg, then that will move at 0.2 M/S in the opposite direction i.e. 0.5 x 10 = 25 * 0.2. In terms of energy distribution between the two: Energy in the cone would be 0.5 x 0.5 x 10 x 10 = 25 Joules Energy in the box would be 0.5 x 25 x 0.2 x 0.2 = 0.5 Joules It's been several decades since I did my physics degree. I've forgotten lots, and much has changed, but I believe that Newtons laws still hold for everyday life. Edited to say "I hope I've got the maths right - otherwise could be very embarrassing"

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1350996408' post='1845970'] Point of fact: Unless the cab is defectively constructed there's no such thing as mechanical coupling. That phenomenon can only occur if the cab walls flex, and the walls of good cabs don't flex. Even relatively flimsy cabs don't vibrate in the lows, they vibrate in the mids. If they vibrated in the lows they'd be unusable. All low frequency vibration of the floor is caused by the acoustic output of the cab. Therefore so-called isolation devices have absolutely no effect on floor or other room surface vibrations. However, if the floor is vibrating said vibrations can then be transferred back to the cab, and the head atop it, and stopping those vibrations can be worthwhile. But doing so doesn't require a high level of sophistication, let alone high cost. A bit of carpet will do the trick. [/quote] I (and I believe Sir Isaac Newton) disagree. Irrespective of the stiffness of the cabinet or whether the sides are vibrating, Newton's laws/conservation of momentum means that if you are moving the speaker cone forward then the rest of the cabinet will to move backwards by an amount inversely proportional to their relative weight of the two parts (i.e. the cone/coil and the rest of the cabinet), so that the net momentum change is zero. This would occur even if it were in a vacuum. On top of this is the fact that you are pushing air with the cone and the equal but opposite force again feeds back into the cabinet. - even if the cabinet is completely stiff. These forces and any consequent movement will be transferred into the supporting mechanism whether that is the floor or the isolating pad. How significant these are I have no idea, but they will be there.

[quote name='crez5150' timestamp='1350470307' post='1839183'] Hi Marcus I'm with you on these... I've found them to be the perfect bass for me.... The sound is absolutely there in terms of punch, growl and clarity. Obviously if you play a lot of Slap (as I do) then they seem to come into there own. I've owned three Kingbass now and have finally settled on a Graphite 5 string artist model. It's the perfect bass as far as I can find... I had an S2 in the past also which was a superb instrument but it never really hung right around me. Prior to Status I played Warwick Thumb 5 string through neck and while this was a great bass, I found the Status blew it away in terms of clarity and tone. Also the weight factor was hugely different. For me the design of a small compact body with a headless neck works extremely well for a gigging instrument. As for the comments above regarding hot output.... well yes they do have a hotter than average output but you can adjust this on the pre-amp board quite easily yourself. Or use the Volume control on the bass Here's a piccy of mine [/quote] Yep, that's a bass that ticks all the boxes for me. Unfortunately with my frequency and standard of playing I'll never be able to justify one.

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1350907097' post='1844833'] I hope we're talking metres rather than feet for these sizes otherwise they seem a bit on the small side. The last time I was in a band with backdrops we had two approximately 3m x 2m and needed both of them at all but the smallest pub venues. [/quote] Actually I find that the 2 x 8 feet banner works really well. At that size, and in a typical pub/small club type venue, the top can be just below ceiling height, and the bottom is well clear of the drummers head. - so it doesn't get in the way on a small stage- and it rolls up to about the size of a small sleeping bag. Anything much deeper and it starts to get lost behind the back line and band members (ooer missus!). All IMHO of course.

[quote name='JapanAxe' timestamp='1350851380' post='1844343'] Banners are frequently a pain when it comes to finding somewhere to secure them - many happy hours balanced on top of speaker cabs and drum stools... [/quote] Microphone stands are your friend! - My lads band have a banner about 8 x 2 and a couple of boom mic stands adjusted to max height are just right. - and the pole through the top sits nicely in the mic clips.

I have an SR505 ( ab it of a funk machine by nature) which had rounds on it when I got it. I was constantly playing with the treble right down to try and tame it, which left now room for manoeuvre. Changed to status hotwire half flats and I now like the tone with everything flat, which gives me room to modify the tone either way for venue or the song as required.

[quote name='thebrig' timestamp='1350208604' post='1835711'] The only reason I ask is because just recently, I was offered a place in a band that is gigging at least twice a week, occasionally three times a week, and I would have been taking about £150 - £250 in my hand every week, that's around £7,800 - £13,000 per annum, and the first thing that struck me was that I will have to declare that amount of extra income. [/quote] But you could also claim any related expenses, and almost anything musical against that income. Obviously petrol/mileage, strings, rehearsal room costs, stage clothes, depreciation on capital costs (i.e. you're bass & rig, PC you use for musical things). Anything musical would also extend to CDs. If you practice at home could possibly claim for 'use of home as office' I have a friend who was was shopped (we think) to HMRC about his playing in a ceilidh band. After HMRC interviewed him and did some quick sums they told him that he had a very expensive hobby. On the original question raised, for myself, if it is a choice between playing for nothing or not playing at all then I'd play for nothing. It is a hobby after all, which I do for fun, and the whole aim is to get out and perform. Musicians are one of the professions where they try to make a living doing what other people do for a hobby. No point moaning about it .."Twas ever thus and ever thus will be".

[quote name='Big_Stu' timestamp='1349550124' post='1827703'] It's nearly as bad as doing a Hiwatt search and seeing ads for amp covers of all sizes (even if they are excellent) and cheap crap batteries of the same name. [/quote] So search "Hiwatt Bass -cover"

Not only is it not 1/4", it's not an input jack either!!

[quote name='paul_5' timestamp='1349072769' post='1821260'] Cool, my boys have got the exact same drum kit. They're not famous though. [/quote] You should always follow that line with "yet!"

Allen Key? (inspired by a trampoline we bought, where the instructions referred to an Allen Key as an "L shaped stick")

[quote name='BottomE' timestamp='1348240738' post='1811323'] Can i have one for the guitarist pls? [/quote] cue:...... "Sounds like a fair swap".

Martin Turner is great. I love the bass solo at the beginning of Handy (from the album "Wishbone Ash")

A fan fretted 5 string with a 34" B string , going down to 31 - 32" for the G string? (And 16mm spacing).

[quote name='q_of_doom' timestamp='1343895714' post='1756839'] For a long time I used a Boss ME-50B, but the Tascam GT-R1 is just so much more portable and versatile. [/quote] Yep, I used to use the Tascam MP-BT1 but bought a GT-R1 for the extra features (drum beats, recording, plays WAV files etc) and now use that almost exclusively. There's a few thing that the MP-BT1 did better, but not many.

Just couple of things that I've seen recently: A quite old 4 x 10 cabinet went up with a starting price of £400, which I thought was a bit silly, and unsurprisingly got no bids. Now re-listed with a buy it now price of £430!! WTF? What planet is the man on? Secondly a Marshal B150 combo came up. Starting price £300!! Now I like Marshall kit and have one of these, but £300?? - I got mine for £100! Just felt the need to share. Hope neither of them is anyone here, but if it is then I do believe you're pushing your luck a bit!

I don't know what all the fuss is about - it's only a cover version, so can be of any musical value!

[quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1347270366' post='1798537'] Another one bites the dust, Under pressure, summer nights, blues brothers tune (whatever its called), there's gotta be loads more [/quote] There probably are loads more, but still a tiny minority.

[quote name='steve-bbb' timestamp='1347188953' post='1797758'] i was 'criticised' last week for suggesting that average public person could tell when a tune wasnt faithful to the original script - people ( ie non muso types) are a lot more savvy than they are often given credit for - it doesnt take musical training/education for somebody to be able to spot small differences in performances and arrangement [/quote] If it was my 'Do you really think so ... ' comment then it wasn't meant to be a criticism in anyway, so please don't take it as such. I was just saying that that wasn't my experience, yours is obviously different. If it upset you in anyway then please accept my apologies. It doesn't take musical training etc. , but it does need someone who actually listens to / is aware of the bass line (Indeed any part other than the predominant theme at the time). Hence in some tunes, (All Right Now (parts of), Wherever I Lay My Hat etc.) a deviation in the bass line might be noticed but in many others I still believe that the average punter is pretty unaware of what the bass is doing. I made a point in yet another thread re Smoke On The Water. I suspect that if you asked a random collection of people how the bass line went most of them would sing the main theme - not the bass line. I repeat - all in my humble opinion/experience: I could be wrong - it did happen once.

[quote name='rOB' timestamp='1346870566' post='1794335'] There has been plenty of discussion around covers and tribute bands recently which is interesting no matter what kind of band you're in but sometimes things seem to differ in the world of original (as much as that term can ever be applied) music. Might be worth sharing some experiences and ideas? So recently I've put together a new band to play existing tunes (written by me for previous recording projects) and write new ones with the reasonably modest ambitions to play maybe a gig a month in our city and maybe travel to other cities once in a while, record some songs and perhaps self release an e.p. - What is your band aiming for? How are you going about it? Getting gigs has been reasonably simple so far through existing relationships with promoters and venue managers and/but they are all in local established music venues with PAs and engineers rather than pubs and clubs. - How are you approaching booking gigs? What types of venues are you playing? Are/how much are you getting paid? Promoting the band and gigs - we're focusing on social media (facebook and twitter) mostly at the moment. - How do you go about promoting? Recordings - we've struggled with finding a cheap way to record the band so far and are using some solo recordings I made at home to give promoters, venues and other bands an idea of what we sound like. - thoughts, experiences and ideas? Anything else you want to discuss relating to running your original bands? [/quote] Don't kid yourself. You may be playing original music, but the rest of the band didn't write any of it, so are mere cover players.

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1346955336' post='1795353'] ... and I guess good old Elton must be doing original music but only covering the lyrics. And that Frank SInatra, he must have been just another covers band. [/quote] There's hundreds of them!

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1346946099' post='1795187'] So what you are saying is that tunes that people don't know go down well even though they don't know them? I have to say that is my experience too. I see no reason to play other people's stuff other than as a path to quick gigging without having to write anything. If musos across the board worked as hard on the craft of composition/song writing as they seem to do on 'stagecraft', costunes and Swedish chuffin' accents, they may have material that is as good as or even better than the covers they play. And they can get royalties! I've got a go now; I have a gig. [/quote] How did you you get to your gig Bilbo? I hope that you didn't drive a car that someone else had designed. That's just taking a short cut to mobility, when with enough hard work you could design and build your own. Consider yourself lucky that you are able to compose. Lots of people are great players without being able to compose, others can compose without being particularly good players. I'm not much good at playing, but can't compose to save my life. Should that mean that I'm not allowed to play anything either?

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1346950595' post='1795288'] I still don't see the confusion, even if a famous person or band does a version of someone else's song it's a cover. It's black and white in my opinion [/quote] So to go back to the post above yours, - was Elvis just a covers a singer when he sang Heartbreak Hotel? He didn't write it so I guess he must have been. Does Elvis actually write anything? If a band does a song that was written by one of the members, does that mean that the rest of the band are playing a cover?