New Hartke LH500 or used Genz Benz Shuttle 6.0

[Conan]

OK, maybe not a completely fair comparison, but if you could either of these amps for the same money, which one would you have?

Power-wise there is not much in it. Into 4 ohms, its 500w for the Hartke versus 600w for the GB. Both have valve pre-amps. Both are known for their "clear, biting tone".

Their new prices vary more. The Hartke is widely available at £299 inc. delivery, whereas the GB is closer to £600. Not even close - but is the GB worth twice the price? Well, that's not relevant in this case as you can have either amp for the same money remember?!

The GB appears to have more EQ-shaping capabilities as it has a four-band rather than three, and the mid-range is parametric...

The GB has a D-class power amp whereas the Hartke is class A. Does that make much difference?

If I get the GB and don't get on with it, I could sell it for what I got it for (or near enough). The second-hand value of the Hartke would presumably drop to around £200.

For me, the major down-side to the GB is that it will look slighly ridiculous perched on top of two 4x10 cabs!!

Decisions, decisions! Advice please?

Edited May 30, 2010 by Conan

[Musicman20]

Hmmm, for me, it would be the LH500. The Genz probably wouldnt sound half as massive. Nothing against GB, but they have very strange way of rating their wattages. I tried a 900W GB Shuttle 9.0 into a 4 ohm cab, and was no louder in reality than the TC RH450.

Very strange.

The Genz pre is also not as 'biting' and rock n roll as I required. I could get hardly any 'tube' sound out of it. Maybe I expected far too much.

If you want a very clean, hifi, precise tone, the GB Shuttle 9.0 will do it and save your back. But disregard the 600W, because it wont feel like it. Its loud, yes, but not 600W.

In your scenario, id go for the LH500. Well regarded amps. I used another bands through various cabs on tour which was used night after night. Sounded huge, and you can make it sound pretty growly. I must admit for the price I was impressed. Very loud, very durable. Through an 8x10 it sounded amazing!

Another option:

If you go secondhand, get a MB LM2/3 and get a Sansamp pedal like the VT or BDDI and you will have Ampeg like tube grind in a tiny lightweight loud amp.

In certain bands I like a quite a rock n roll tone, and the Markbass with those pedals is fantastic.

IMO, of course.

Edited May 30, 2010 by Musicman20

[rmshaw37]

i have a shuttle 6 - i found it to be awesome! i will agree with the preamp though

i use a sansamp rpm rackmount, plus tuner and soon wireless! the shuttle sits on top of these purely for a power amp and i havent found a situation where this aint powerful enough!

yes it does look a bit daft sat on top of a stack, but the shallow rack makes it look less so!

i've never got on with hartke stuff, but never really tested thoroughly!

as always, its down to personal preferance, but i find the weight savings worth soooooooo much!

best of luck with the choice!

[Conan]

Good calls about the weight, but as I will be carting around two 4x10s, I'm not sure the difference will make itself all that apparent!

Also, the terms "clean, hi-fi and precise" have never been used to describe my tone or playing!

Edited May 30, 2010 by Conan

[Merton]

The LH500 is a class ab power amp. The class a refers to the valve pre, tho in reality all valve pres are class a! Personally i rate the hartke very very highly indeed, i miss my old one but then i remember i have the trace v-type pre which is almost identical but has a few more bells and whistles The hartke power amp is a beast

[velvetkevorkian]

I would get the GB, since size/weight are issues for me since I go mainly by public transport. Since you're carrying big cabs anyway, I think you should save the pennies and the the Hartke.

[Doddy]

The Hartke stuff is really cool,but I prefer the Genz Benz. It's a more
'hi fi' sounding amp than the LH500 and I prefer the tone.
I actually stopped using my Hartke heads in favour of the Genz Benz.

If you are concerned about the price,you would still have a really good
head if you choose the Hartke. If the price is less important I'd go for the
Genz Benz.

[gillento]

+1 on the Hartke.

The GB is rather thin in the lows and doesn't move much air.

[gillento]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='852041' date='May 30 2010, 08:41 PM']Another option:

If you go secondhand, get a MB LM2/3 and get a Sansamp pedal like the VT or BDDI and you will have Ampeg like tube grind in a tiny lightweight loud amp.

...[/quote]

Best case scenario, indeed!

[BassBod]

Two things puzzle me about the Hartke. It only seems to have one volume knob, rather than input gain/output volume. With the fender-style valve preamp and passive eq I would think its important to match the input gain to the instrument? Also the DI seems to be pre-eq (ie flat) only, so you can't send your preamp sound as a DI.

Can anyone who's owned or used one comment?

[Bay Splayer]

Hartke LH500 ...... great amp

[Merton]

[quote name='BassBod' post='852878' date='May 31 2010, 07:59 PM']Two things puzzle me about the Hartke. It only seems to have one volume knob, rather than input gain/output volume. With the fender-style valve preamp and passive eq I would think its important to match the input gain to the instrument? Also the DI seems to be pre-eq (ie flat) only, so you can't send your preamp sound as a DI.

Can anyone who's owned or used one comment?[/quote]
There's a whole thread somewhere dedicated to the LH amps and this was a hot topic. Short answer, it works very very well indeed and makes a lot of sense. No farting about setting gain level as it is a very high headroom low noise preamp.

[johnnylager]

I was toying with the idea of getting a Shuttle or similar lightweight head to replace my LH-1000. Then I thought about why I got the LH - it's a classic bass players amp - simple & loud. I am toying no more. SVT-7 maybe...

Edited June 1, 2010 by johnnylager

[Prime_BASS]

I didn't get the LH500 because i got an ampeg svt-3 pro, but then sold that and got the OTB.

[Conan]

Well, after a lot of thought I've pretty much decided to go with the Hartke - especially as an even better deal has come to my attention and I can get one used for under £200!

The GB was offered as a swap for my Ampeg, or I could have asked for the cash which I was then going to spend on a brand new LH500. I took the latter option, but now that the second-hand LH500 has appeared on the horizon - I can get the best of both worlds!

Thanks for the opinions though guys. As I half expected, people are divided between the two amps! That speaks very loudly on behalf of the Hartke, as it retails at over twice the price of the GB!!

Will let you all know how I get on when all the deals are completed!!

[Stylon Pilson]

[quote name='BassBod' post='852878' date='May 31 2010, 07:59 PM']Also the DI seems to be pre-eq (ie flat) only, so you can't send your preamp sound as a DI.[/quote]

That is correct. Could be a dealbreaker to some, but it's no secret that if you're looking for piles of features in the LH500/LH1000, then you've come to the wrong place.

S.P.

[johnnylager]

[quote name='Conan' post='853306' date='Jun 1 2010, 09:28 AM']Well, after a lot of thought I've pretty much decided to go with the Hartke - especially as an even better deal has come to my attention and I can get one used for under £200![/quote]
Good man.

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=26831&hl=500w"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=26831&hl=500w[/url]

[thisnameistaken]

FWIW I've been gigging an LH500 for about a year, never had an issue with it, the 3-band tone stack is actually really nice, amp is noise-free and loud, absolutely no complaints from me. They are a real bargain.

[Conan]

Sounding increasingly like I might have made the right choice!

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='Conan' post='853759' date='Jun 1 2010, 04:41 PM']Sounding increasingly like I might have made the right choice! [/quote]

if you like the sound of you and your bass then it's a great amp.

[Dood]

I'm really pleased with the LH1000. I admit I am a self confessed 'tweaker' and love my buttons, switches and flashing lights. My old bass rigs used to look like something off a spaceship!! (I'll post a pic at some point for a good laugh) - but the simplicity of the LH, coupled with a great sound straight out the box is just brilliant - and quite refreshing for me! I took a bit of time to get used to the interactivity of each of the tone controls with each other - as I was so used to a graphic type EQ - but to be honest, onceI got the hang of it, it's like having a multiband on 3 knobs. I like a lot!

There's a lot of girth in there as well. The power amps are great modules - especially bridged ;O)

Finally - cost - well,what a genius move by Hartke - drop a proved industry valve preamp in to a box with a monsterous power section and then make sure it is affordable for everyone. Bass Gear Magazine did a full tech test on an LH head - and the review was really positive. They had the lid open and everything!

I love my Hydrive cabs too. I'd missed my previous cabs more than I realised and am finally settled with my rig! I do beleive I am free of GAS!