Lord Sausage Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 [quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1470480213' post='3106274'] I'm sure that most won't argue with this. Amazing technical bass playing is one thing. Most people would not deny Jaco's skills here. Playing music that touches people, and "talks" to them, is an entirely different matter. [/quote] Sometimes amazing technical playing and musicianship touches people or talks to them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coilte Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 [quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1470504758' post='3106471'] Sometimes amazing technical playing and musicianship touches people or talks to them! [/quote] I agree. I was just giving my opinion that Jaco's amazing technical playing does not "talk" to [i]me.[/i] Going by some of the posts in this thread, I am not alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sausage Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 [quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1470508924' post='3106493'] I agree. I was just giving my opinion that Jaco's amazing technical playing does not "talk" to [i]me.[/i] Going by some of the posts in this thread, I am not alone. [/quote] It's a fair point and most people don't like technical playing. I don't a lot of the time. But i also feel it's ignorant to not like something just because its's technical or musical. It always depends on the requirements of the music. Even The Stranglers have shredding on No more heroes for example. I also dislike the idea stuff has to be simple to be real and worthwhile, the Indie/punk mentality. I really like Indie/punk. I like most forms of music, even bloody Country now which i used to hate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julesb Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 (edited) [quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1470508924' post='3106493'] I agree. I was just giving my opinion that Jaco's amazing technical playing does not "talk" to [i]me.[/i] Going by some of the posts in this thread, I am not alone. [/quote] http://youtu.be/OGkAOURhLdw Edited August 7, 2016 by julesb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timhiggins Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1470502088' post='3106450'] I really like some of his playing and he was definitely unsurpassed at this style... you could probably say he defined it. I can't listen to Rocco but Jaco was something else. Still a very tricky and accomplished style or technique to this day... some many things need to come together to carry it off. The track itself doesn't really do it for me, but Jaco was THE guy in his day. [/quote] Each to his own i always find Roco one of the best and tightest groove players ,and probably the biggest influence on Jaco's groove ! https://youtu.be/puY2_cRLMbQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coilte Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 (edited) [quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1470510205' post='3106509'] It's a fair point and most people don't like technical playing. I don't a lot of the time. But i also feel it's ignorant to not like something just because its's technical or musical. It always depends on the requirements of the music. Even The Stranglers have shredding on No more heroes for example. I also dislike the idea stuff has to be simple to be real and worthwhile, the Indie/punk mentality. I really like Indie/punk. I like most forms of music, even bloody Country now which i used to hate. [/quote] I agree with what you say. Perhaps I was a bit vague in my earlier post. The point I was making was that just because a player is technical, complex, and flashy (talking generally here) does not necessarily mean that what he/she plays communicates with the listener. It may communicate with fellow bass players alright. Yes, it is possible, but for me, not in Jaco's case. The OP makes my point for me in post #11 when he talks about the bass playing [u]around[/u]...rather than being the music. I do like some of his work with Joni Mitchell. Edited August 6, 2016 by Coilte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sausage Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 [quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1470517089' post='3106548'] I agree with what you say. Perhaps I was a bit vague in my earlier post. The point I was making was that just because a player is technical, complex, and flashy (talking generally here) does not necessarily mean that what he/she plays communicates with the listener. It may communicate with fellow bass players alright. Yes, it is possible, but for me, not in Jaco's case. The OP makes my point for me in post #11 when he talks about the bass playing [u]around[/u]...rather than being the music. I do like some of his work with Joni Mitchell. [/quote] I agree, more often than not it won't connect! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted August 6, 2016 Author Share Posted August 6, 2016 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1470502159' post='3106451'] For me, I think so still. [/quote]I don't want to force an opinion. But to listen to this bass from Jaco Pastorius and not get something from it is just alien to me. Each to there own of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 (edited) ... and I find it strange that there are folks that don't seem to appreciate Phil Lesh, too... [url="https://archive.org/details/gd73-05-26.sbd.cribbs.17076.sbeok.shnf"]Box of Rain ...[/url] Funny ol' world, isn't it..? Edited August 7, 2016 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='bubinga5' timestamp='1470524438' post='3106574'] I don't want to force an opinion. But to listen to this bass from Jaco Pastorius and not get something from it is just alien to me. Each to there own of course. [/quote] Im sure there are many basslines you like that I don't and basslines I like that you don't, I wouldn't find it alien for you not to like everything I do. Just tastes aren't they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1470510205' post='3106509'] It's a fair point and most people don't like technical playing. I don't a lot of the time. But i also feel it's ignorant to not like something just because its's technical or musical. It always depends on the requirements of the music. Even The Stranglers have shredding on No more heroes for example. I also dislike the idea stuff has to be simple to be real and worthwhile, the Indie/punk mentality. I really like Indie/punk. I like most forms of music, even bloody Country now which i used to hate. [/quote] This always gets thrown back worded in a similar way (normally by blue ),the old "if you dont like Jaco you are probably crap at playing and only like rock music in straight 8ths" kind of response, for me it's not that I don't like technical playing, I don't like Jaco's technical playing!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sausage Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1470528407' post='3106583'] This always gets thrown back worded in a similar way (normally by blue ),the old "if you dont like Jaco you are probably crap at playing and only like rock music in straight 8ths" kind of response, for me it's not that I don't like technical playing, I don't like Jaco's technical playing!! [/quote] That's not what i was saying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 (edited) Remember getting that Brian Melvin album first time around. (Some good tracks on it). I still feel the same, loved the Bass playing on the OP track, but Lordy, that drum groove lets it all down, so mechanical. [quote name='timhiggins' timestamp='1470516623' post='3106542'] Each to his own i always find Rocco one of the best and tightest groove players ,and probably the biggest influence on Jaco's groove ! http://youtu.be/puY2_cRLMbQ [/quote] Agreed. Rocco is a groove monster. Edited August 7, 2016 by lowdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coilte Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 (edited) [quote name='bubinga5' timestamp='1470524438' post='3106574'] But to listen to this bass from Jaco Pastorius and not get something from it is just alien to me. [/quote] Just stop for a moment and consider how much of a sad and dismal old world this would be, if everyone liked the same things. I find it alien that a lot of my friends don't get something out of the music that I like. Thankfully, that's the way of the world. Did you really expect to post something on a forum and get everyone to agree ? Edited August 7, 2016 by Coilte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatboter Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 I remember that Melvin took care of Pastorius when he was in a mental hospital and had to vow that he would do all what was necessary before he could take Jaco home to Melvin's house and mother. The following months Jaco became better because of Brian and his mother and started to get grip of his life again and the mental issues seemed to have gone. Slowly Brian suggested that Jaco would play bass again and a band was formed. To make things less stressful Melvin launched a club tour in France to get Jaco familiar again with audiences etc. The first night as they went on stage Jaco immediately changed as dr Jekyll and Hyde and started insulting people in the audience, even started spitting. Melvin was so surprised that he tried to talk some sense to Jaco on stage to which Jaco said in the mike : "Who's the great musician here on stage, me or Brian ? who do you want to see leave the stage, me or him ?" to which the audience started shouting "Melvin !". Not a nice way to thank your friends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='bubinga5' timestamp='1470524438' post='3106574'] I don't want to force an opinion. But to listen to this bass from Jaco Pastorius and not get something from it is just alien to me. Each to there own of course. [/quote] I'm with you B5, the guy was a true 'great' whose playing surpassed fave of the month or was in my favourite bands type of status. The man had everything, and but if you can't see it, but then that is OK too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4stringslow Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1470561687' post='3106673'] Just stop for a moment and consider how much of a sad and dismal old world this would be, if everyone liked the same things. I find it alien that a lot of my friends don't get something out of the music that I like. Thankfully, that's the way of the world. [/quote] Agreed. Seems to me there can be two main reasons to admire a musician - their ability and their music - and they can be appreciated, or not, together or separately. There is no inherent link between them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1470531648' post='3106590'] That's not what i was saying [/quote] Well I'm not sure I like this idea that it's "ignorant", we've been here many times before, surely to be ignorant requires me to ignor his music and them claim to dislike like without hearing it? I have tried but I still do not connect with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sausage Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1470567800' post='3106737'] Well I'm not sure I like this idea that it's "ignorant", we've been here many times before, surely to be ignorant requires me to ignor his music and them claim to dislike like without hearing it? I have tried but I still do not connect with it. [/quote] Where did i say [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]"if you dont like Jaco you are probably crap at playing and only like rock music in straight 8ths" [/font][/color] , [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]What i said is that it is ignorant just to not like something just because it is technical or musical, just on that basis. I was refering to music in general. If you don't like any music that is technical and you don't like it for that reason, that it is technical, then i think without listening to or understanding it within it's context then you are being ignorant. [/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I also said in my most that i don't like most technical music, usually when it's for the sake of it![/font][/color] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Just had the kids dancing around the living room to it. Don't know what that says about musical integrity. But it says a lot about musical connection Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coilte Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='Skol303' timestamp='1470570645' post='3106765'] Just had the kids dancing around the living room to it. Don't know what that says about musical integrity. But it says a lot about musical connection [/quote] No one said that Jaco's playing/music does not connect with people...just not.. [u]ALL [/u] people. Same goes for all genres and artists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 ...and Marmite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sausage Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='SpondonBassed' timestamp='1470572625' post='3106773'] ...and Marmite [/quote] Look mate don't start on f***in Marmite. I can handle people not liking Music but if they start on yeast extracts I go f***in mental! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1470569905' post='3106753'] Where did i say [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]"if you dont like Jaco you are probably crap at playing and only like rock music in straight 8ths" [/font][/color] , [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]What i said is that it is ignorant just to not like something just because it is technical or musical, just on that basis. I was refering to music in general. If you don't like any music that is technical and you don't like it for that reason, that it is technical, then i think without listening to or understanding it within it's context then you are being ignorant. [/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I also said in my most that i don't like most technical music, usually when it's for the sake of it![/font][/color] [/quote] Has anyone said they didn't like it without listening to it though? That's what I struggle with when the monthly Jaco thread comes up, lol I listened to it and (for me) it sucks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 [quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1470573123' post='3106781'] Look mate... [/quote] Heeheehee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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