Happy Jack Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Given a 5-string Jazz bass with the usual pair of single coil pickups (in this instance, they happen to be EMG's), what's my best bet to get it to [i][b]sound [/b][/i]like a P/J without getting into the realm of irreversible mods? I'm thinking that the neck position needs an after-market 5-string J-shaped pickup, presumably a humbucker, presumably accompanied by an on-board pre-amp with a decent amount of bass boost. The bridge position isn't an issue since that is supposed to be a J anyway. I can just buy whatever pickup will be a decent match for the neck position. The reason I'm throwing this one out to the panel is that I've spent a couple of days searching, and I am really struggling to reach a shortlist with even three names on it. All I can come up with so far is the Nordstrand NJ5F and the Seymour Duncan AJB-5. Before people start chucking names out in a random fashion ("[i]Have you tried Wizards? Andy will sort you out![/i]" etc.) I repeat that I have already spent two days searching. It's been a bit of an eye-opener, just how few people actually cater for 5-string basses, especially in the after-market. In fact, by last night I was in an email exchange with Fred Hammon about maybe forgetting my aversion to irreversible mods and sticking in a pair of Dark Stars. Turns out he's cancelled his plans to make a 5-string Dark Star. I could use some help here, guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 How close do you think your Alleva LG4 gets to a P bass sound on the neck pickup? If close enough, then maybe an AC preamp and J pickups of your choice (which could then be Wizards, lol, Nordstrands, Lollars etc)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 The LG4 is my benchmark, Clarky. It's close, but try comparing it to the KBP5! If there's something out there that's more Precision-y then I'd like to find out about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) There's a rather lovely daphne blue NYC Sadowsky P/J on the FS forum that is neatly routed on the neck pickup for a J or a P pickup and has a pickguard for either eventually. How about that as a simple solution? Does of course require that the bass has (or could take stylistically) a pickguard Edit: this one [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=142539&hl=sadowsky+daphne"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...sadowsky+daphne[/url] Edited June 25, 2011 by Clarky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 No pickguard and probably wouldn't appreciate one. Besides - it's irreversible! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) OK, well I'm afraid I'm out of ideas here - I did once set up a thread about getting a Jazz bass to be flexible enough to sound like a P if needed and the consensus was (a) I should use a P bass if I want a P sound ( ) and (b ) while beefier J pickups (Quarter Pounders etc) and active circuitry might take you [i]closer[/i] to a P sound, its not possible to sound very close to a P due to pickup placement etc. Sorry! FWIW, I found the Audere preamp got close to a P sound (installed in a MIA Jazz) with the special knob (z switch?) engaged .... but probably not close enough for you if you think the AC preamp isn't close enough Edit: here it is [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=121004&hl="]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=121004&hl=[/url] Edited June 25, 2011 by Clarky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gafbass02 Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 I do have one that just nails it (imo) but ironically it's a wizard prototype. Only a few exist as Andy was unable to make it fit neatly enough into the casing. (Fixed mine by expanding the holes with scissors) It's called the gaffer and really is amazing. I used it on this recording (not the video, we mimed) [url="http://m.youtube.com/?client=mv-google&rdm=4n18m1gml#/watch?v=FnThxCeCJfg"]LAP IT UP[/url] Wether he's ready to knock up another I don't know, but it's truly the nuts!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassBod Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Off topic - but you actually got in touch with Fred H? I thought Darkstars were a thing of the past (well, obviously they were...but you know what I mean..) and he'd disappeared.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='Clarky' post='1281933' date='Jun 25 2011, 10:30 AM']FWIW, I found the Audere preamp got close to a P sound (installed in a MIA Jazz) with the special knob (z switch?) engaged .... but probably not close enough for you if you think the AC preamp isn't close enough Edit: here it is [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=121004&hl="]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=121004&hl=[/url][/quote] Clarky beat me to it. This is one of the very few occasions in which my stock solution isn't one of John East's products. Whilst the J-Retro can probably get any sound that the Audere can get, the latter's preset options make finding that sound very trouble free. If - perish the thought - I ever had to own a Jazz again, I would certainly put an Audere in it for that very reason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) [quote name='gafbass02' post='1281950' date='Jun 25 2011, 10:55 AM']I do have one that just nails it (imo) but ironically it's a wizard prototype. Only a few exist as Andy was unable to make it fit neatly enough into the casing.[/quote] 5-string? ps: Your link doesn't work, I'm afraid. Edited June 25, 2011 by Happy Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='BassBod' post='1281963' date='Jun 25 2011, 11:09 AM']Off topic - but you actually got in touch with Fred H? I thought Darkstars were a thing of the past (well, obviously they were...but you know what I mean..) and he'd disappeared....[/quote] I sent him an email (got the address from the Hammon Engineering website) and received a reply within an hour. Was it Fred? Well he said it was. Damfino. As to Darkstars being a thing of the past, you can still order 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='Beedster' post='1281967' date='Jun 25 2011, 11:15 AM']Clarky beat me to it. ... If - perish the thought - I ever had to own a Jazz again, I would certainly put an Audere in it for that very reason [/quote] That sounds promising, I wonder how an Audere would team up with the Nordy's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='Happy Jack' post='1281971' date='Jun 25 2011, 11:20 AM']That sounds promising, I wonder how an Audere would team up with the Nordy's.[/quote] Sounded great with stock US J pickups, so no obvious reason why it shouldn't sound even better with higher quality J pickups? Audere preamps generally go for about £100 or so s/h on BC so it's not the most expensive experiment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Happy Jack' post='1281971' date='Jun 25 2011, 11:20 AM']That sounds promising, I wonder how an Audere would team up with the Nordy's.[/quote] Edited June 25, 2011 by Beedster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Hey Jack, I've just started using a P bass again after about 12 years away and I'm surprised at how different it sounds. My memory was definitely playing up! I'm not sure that you'll get a J to sound like a P; the J pickups are in the wrong place. I think you're right to not route the body. If the P pickups use the J slot already there the P pickups will still not be in the right place for a "proper" Precicion sound anyway. You might get close (but no cigar) with a good off board preamp, but the only way is a P bass with a J bridge pickup. There's a Lakland PJ currently in the FS section. I reckon it would do the job perfectly, but I know that wasn't the question! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vibrating G String Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='Happy Jack' post='1281900' date='Jun 25 2011, 02:03 AM']Given a 5-string Jazz bass with the usual pair of single coil pickups (in this instance, they happen to be EMG's), what's my best bet to get it to [i][b]sound [/b][/i]like a P/J without getting into the realm of irreversible mods?[/quote] I've always felt that a split coil humbucker J wired in series should be the closest as it is the most similar electronically. And without routing is as close as you'll get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gafbass02 Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='Happy Jack' post='1281968' date='Jun 25 2011, 11:16 AM']5-string? ps: Your link doesn't work, I'm afraid.[/quote] That's weird, it's ok for me. Ah well type 'lap it up' 'loungefly' into YouTube and you'll hear it. my pickup is a four, but a five might be something he could do. If anyone clever knows how to embed the video for reference if people check out the subject please do. The band have split up so I'm not plugging anything other than the pickup lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escholl Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='gafbass02' post='1281950' date='Jun 25 2011, 10:55 AM']I do have one that just nails it (imo) but ironically it's a wizard prototype. Only a few exist as Andy was unable to make it fit neatly enough into the casing. (Fixed mine by expanding the holes with scissors) It's called the gaffer and really is amazing. I used it on this recording (not the video, we mimed) [url="http://m.youtube.com/?client=mv-google&rdm=4n18m1gml#/watch?v=FnThxCeCJfg"]LAP IT UP[/url] Wether he's ready to knock up another I don't know, but it's truly the nuts!![/quote] just fixing your video for you. nice bass sound by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gafbass02 Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) Bless ya. Thanks it does sound cool, I normally don't Favour the neck, but for this track it was exactly the sound I was after. Part of making a J sound like a P I find, is to play it like a P! So slowed down and over the neck pickup. Edited June 25, 2011 by gafbass02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='chris_b' post='1281989' date='Jun 25 2011, 11:30 AM']Hey Jack, I've just started using a P bass again after about 12 years away and I'm surprised at how different it sounds. My memory was definitely playing up! I'm not sure that you'll get a J to sound like a P; the J pickups are in the wrong place. I think you're right to not route the body. If the P pickups use the J slot already there the P pickups will still not be in the right place for a "proper" Precicion sound anyway. You might get close (but no cigar) with a good off board preamp, but the only way is a P bass with a J bridge pickup. There's a Lakland PJ currently in the FS section. I reckon it would do the job perfectly, but I know that wasn't the question![/quote] Correct, IMV... you can get close.but if that is not close enough, you are stuffed, IMV The J pickup is in the wrong place...that is all there is to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 You want one of those split coils that fit under the single coil cover, I forget who does it but I know there is a 5-string version. Also forget about active pre-amps. You just want a quality passive kit with a 250K tone knob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brensabre79 Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Just add a switch to wire the two J pickups in series Like the fender s-1 switch (completely reversible mod that will cost a couple of quid for the switch/pot). And play it over the neck pickup (as you would on a precision) Thats about as close as you'll get without routing and putting in a split P pickup. Adding any amount of active electronics will not a Precision make! I've done this to my Jazz and I use this setting for Stranglers/Blondie/Clash etc. covers - sounds pretty convincing to me and I'm a qualified sound engineer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LawrenceH Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 IMV the jazz position is close enough to the P, if you work out where harmonic peaks and nulls will be for the first few frets it's not very different at all. So any difference is likely mostly due to the pickup itself. I'd look for split-coil pickups that let you choose to wire series and go from there. I don't know how close a DiMarzio Model J wired series gets? A more old-school voiced pickup with the same option might be better though. I'd take a pre-amp with split series-wired single J pickup over s1 switching though...that bridge pickup is too radically different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telebass Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 [quote name='brensabre79' post='1287963' date='Jun 30 2011, 04:46 PM']Just add a switch to wire the two J pickups in series Like the fender s-1 switch (completely reversible mod that will cost a couple of quid for the switch/pot). And play it over the neck pickup (as you would on a precision) Thats about as close as you'll get without routing and putting in a split P pickup. Adding any amount of active electronics will not a Precision make! I've done this to my Jazz and I use this setting for Stranglers/Blondie/Clash etc. covers - sounds pretty convincing to me and I'm a qualified sound engineer![/quote] That's the closest you're gonna get. Do the S1 mod. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 Interesting ... sounds almost suspiciously easy. So I don't need to compensate for the relatively low output from a J pickup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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