EBS_freak

UE900s are a good quad driver option for a sensible price (a few people I know have bought them for under 200 quid from eglobal - pretty decent as the rrp is closer to 400) - balanced armatures, dual lows and lots of tips to ensure a good fit. There are of course other options, things like the Westone W40s, Shure 846s, Sony XB40s etc... but for the money and the bass response, the UE900 hits the mark and as stated, there's always the option to put in a custom shell if you decide to go down that route... (I have to say a custom shell is really where you want to be at... but be aware you'll lose be left with something that has limited resale value - if that's important to you). The UE900s will be a night and day improvement over you consumer in-ears. If you are running IEMs and letting the PA do all the work, the justification is that your are buying Bergs/Vanderklay/<insert other boutique brand> for your ears.

[quote name='Gunsfreddy2003' timestamp='1479538273' post='3177288'] Has anyone reading this thread tried or bought this system from Posse Audio? www.posseaudio.com The option to blend in ambient sound is very appealing to me and be able to control the mix right in front of you also looks cool. I don't sing so perhaps it's an overkill solution but would be keen to know if the stuff is any good though. [/quote] Im sure I had posted about this before but the search brings up nothing. Looks a pretty good solution to me

[quote name='MrPring' timestamp='1479510127' post='3177235'] Which model of IEMs are you using, did I read correctly you have JHAudio Roxannes? [/quote] I have a number of IEMs - my go to IEMs are JH Audio Roxannes. [quote] Is this some 'broscience' designed to put you off other companies do you know? [/quote] Who knows for sure? The demonstrations certainly present a strong case for protecting your ears - although the miraculous results which are seen in the videos for the guys with severe hearing loss are using the active system, not the passive system which is in the IEMs. I don't think they always do a good job of making that fact clear. The tech has been mentioned in this thread before and is the brainchild of Steve Ambrose of Asius Technologies - It's called ADEL - although 64 have renamed/got their own version of it now which is called Apex. I don't know if there is some disagreement or shenanigans behind the scenes but the change was very quick and came as a surprise to everybody. My gut feeling with regards to the passive systems is that it will go some way to protecting your ears drums by reducing the pressure but I don't believe they will do much if you still run the volumes of your IEMs too high. At the end of the day, sound waves are sound waves and have to have an energy to make your ear drums vibrate. They also reduce the isolation that the moulds give you. Depending upon your view of isolation, that may be a good thing or a bad thing. I personally think it's a bad thing as I am a firm believer that you should ideally hear nothing apart from what you put into your mix. if you want ambient sound, capture it and put it into your mix. I don't believe in leaky IEMs or having one IEM out and one in. If you have high levels of isolation, you can run your mix much quieter and the result will be a much safer sound pressure in you inears. I'm sure guys will be saying that APEX/ADEL system goes further to reduce this level - but theres not really any independent evidence out there to support or disprove this statement. Again, these all my views, there will be loads of people that disagree with me. [quote] It's a bit of a ballache as well the pound being so weak as a quad set of customs from 64 will cost about £900 once customs have had their pound of flesh [/quote] Indeed, I bought my 64s before the rebranding and introduction of ADEL/APEX - and one of their big selling points was their competitive price point. As a bass player or a drummer, I would not recommend anything less than a quad driver with dual lows so you have enough headroom in the bass (although I seem to come across people who seem to disagree with me and say that a Shure 215 is comparable... funny they can make such statements when they clearer have no other IEM experience apart from those 215s) - and £900 is still a boat load of money. If money is a big concern, I believe the best cost efficient option is getting a set of UE900s and getting them reshelled via Inearz - http://www.custom-inearmonitors.co.uk/reshells-remoulds/reshelling-remoulding-service-for-in-ear-monitors.html - that way you'll get a quad driver for around the £400. The other £500 you can then put towards some decent radio if you want to go that route.

http://blog.rfvenue.com/iem-ultimate-guide-redux/ Some folk may find this of interest so I thought I'd drop it in here. Got a few Shure articles to post too when I find them out again.

[quote name='ambient' timestamp='1479218101' post='3174814'] Why are you so loud on stage that you need to wear ear plugs ? [/quote] Should be wearing earplugs regardless - theres a drummer on stage for a start.

From what you have said, I think the use of high pass filters will solve most of your issues. Next time you sound check, drop the bass drum in and out of the mix to see if that is where they majority of your mud is coming from. There's no reason why you shouldn't be able to get a decent sound with the gear that you have got by any means. I think it's been mentioned before, but make sure the monitor is as quiet as it can possibly be and again, don't swamp it with low frequencies. Good luck and keep us informed!

[quote name='largo' timestamp='1479204285' post='3174669'] I believe the FOH sound is great according to various reviews, it's just the volume/muddiness on stage that is an issue. For the record we use an analogue Allan & Heath Mixwizard 16:2 analogue desk and have QSC rig comprising of a KW112 top & K Sub each side. The desk definitely has HPF options and I'll be looking at using those on the next gig, especially on all vocal mics. We have no noise gate (AFAIK) for the drums, which are mic'ed on bass drum, snare/hi-hat & then overhead for rest of the kit. It's only in the last year or two that we've had problems with onstage volume, coincidentally since we changed to powered subs instead of passive driven from a power amp. I always put it down to the guitarists hearing going, he's the only one who has never worn earplugs in the 20 years we've been playing! [/quote] Not that I know you are using K Subs - I'm quite surprised because they aren't overly loud or deep - so you should be able to get the useful lows (around the 60 hz) fairly tight. I'm pretty convinced with what you are saying that your problems lie with not using the HPFs on your desk. The HPF on your desk is set at 80Hz, so I would be putting that switch in for pretty much every channel... but you may have to leave it disengaged for the bass - use your ears to listen if theres too much mud...but I would expect you to have to cut the lows on the channel if it's getting too muddy. I'm guessing that they are more efficient than what they have replaced... so it may be down to the fact that the same mix results in a lot more mud than what you would have got with your previous system. That desk also has a mono feed from aux 6 so you could experiment with an aux fed sub - but remember, you would be sending full signal to your tops - so they may get overwhelmed with bass... so you could try splitting the input into two channels, one EQed for the tops (with a HPF) and not sent to the subs (via aux) and one EQed specifically for the subs. If you aren't running a gate for your kick drum, that is the number one upgrade that you could do for your system. If you want to get more out of your system together, then consider adding a compressor to your kick also... but ideally, you'd want compressors on your mics to bring them under control also. (Keeping it cheap (100 quid ish), DBX compressor gate... Samson, Phonic , Alesis 1u rack units could sort your boomy kick drum and make it sound really tight)... however, before you start spending too much, remember that buying a 4 or 5 of these would get you a digital desk... and a lot less to carry. But certainly, if you wanted to make one change to your system to tighten up the sound, the gated bass drum is it - it will cut out all the reverb and mush that is bouncing around inside the drum that will be picked up by the mic. Besides that, I would wager it's also your bass to blame, so instead of looking to boost the lows, cut the lows and boost the mids... you'll be surpised how much low end rumble comes out of subs compared to a standard bass cab. Have you got any monitors (e.g. wedges, drum sidefills) on the go?

The sub fed aux is a good call - although I wager that largo should stick with his existing setup as if the concept of HPF hasn't been mastered, the problem is going to be transferred to the tops - which will cause it's own problems as those tops are suddenly going to start struggling... and yes, there would need to be a crossover in the setup - or at least a LPF and HPF situation - but if the OP is already struggling, I would suggest he he should get the basics down before complicating matters with an aux fed sub. I'm yet to see one of the cheaper digital desks best a decent inbuilt crossover where the slopes crossover nicely. Yeah, you can go down the external speaker management system - but I would argue thats more complexity. Should say though, aux fed sub systems are awesome... but conversely, there are loads of amazing sounding PAs out there, which aren't being driven by aux fed subs. In short, if the system sounds bad now, thinking that aux fed subs are going to improve things is wrong - there's something more fundamentally wrong at this stage.

[quote name='bassjim' timestamp='1479141640' post='3174271'] Sometimes.......even if it seems like madness.......turn the subs off and just use the tops. Take everything out of the PA bar keys and vox and maybe just a tiny amount of kick drum. Just use the backline and turn it all down. [/quote] Get out. Ha ha.

If you are having problems like this, its probably the sub lows that are mushing everything up. HPF pretty much everything at least 50Hz as a starting point. If you are still getting swamped, then start increasing the point of the HPF until you can cope on stage. If you are getting swamped and you are playing in a fairly small compact environment, there's going to be a hell of a lot of reflections and bass traps to contend with. Just because your subs go low doesn't mean that you should chose to mix those lows in - the room may not thank you for it and punish you with mush. As long as you still have circa 60 hz in the frame for the kick drum, you can get away with HPFing the bass a bit higher... You may not get the fundamental but you'll get the overtones and you'll be heard a lot clearer and without the sub mush. In fact, your band may suddenly sound a lot tighter because of it. Most popular bass amps will actually shelve the lows for this exact reason - and the DI out will send the "unshelved" signal to the PA. If you are miking the kit... make sure you are using gates. This is CRITICAL. The bass drum is going to get everything muddy very quickly without using one... the shorter you can make the gate open and close without making the kick sound off, the cleaner your mix is going to be. Same applies to the toms but you'll need a longer gate... that floor tom mic is going to be adding mud to the mix and all of the tom mics are going to be picking up the bass drum... so if you can gate them off when they are not in use, perfect. I've started to use a drum trigger on the bass drum to help in this department because you can get an isolated kick sound without picking up a load of crap... however... if you are playing stuff where your drummer is playing a lot of ghost notes, the trigger isn't going to get the intricacies of this. To get around this, you may want to use both a mic and trigger... but you can be really be savage with the eq on this front as you don't particularly want mega sub lows on a ghost kick because it would get all mushed up and inaudible anyway. (so in short, you are miking the overtones of the kick, not the fundamental, so you can hear the ghost notes but not necessarily feel them out front - perfect). Having said all this, a bass mic and gate should be your first port of call. We could talk about cardioid sub arrays but I guess you haven't got three subs with this feature? You shouldn't need foam and the like... but you may want to try putting your subs on pallets if you think that you are getting too much coupling. You may need to spend a bit of time figuring out where you want to sit in the mix... for example, bass and kick will fight with each other unless you eq them both appropriately. Keys and bass will fight... Guitar and keys will fight... and of course once all that is good, your vocals have got to sit clearly on the top - which reminds me, make sure these are HPF pretty high - I tend to take vocals over 100Hz+ to keep the sub out of the vocal mics. Drums are a bitch - they seem to be picked up by every open mic going... as do sub bass frequencies (thats why HPF is so important) And if you are running your subs low and hard - it's no wonder your 1x10s can't keep up! PS - I am assuming you are either running a digital desk or have an analogue desk with appropriate outboard to do all this!

If you are looking for something like Warmoth... I know there's nothing on the site but it may be worth dropping [url="https://www.guitarbuild.co.uk/"]https://www.guitarbuild.co.uk/[/url] a line. Otherwise you may want to drop one of your local luthiers a line. Wenge is not going to be a common off the shelf neck - as you have probably discovered!

I would wager that the HPF has done the trick over the choice of mic. The mics are important but it's actually quite difficult to buy an unusable bass drum mic nowadays. Yes, something like the D6 will get you a desirable eq pretty much out the box... but with a digital desk with the powerful eqs available to you, you can make pretty much any mic and kick drum sound pretty fat and pleasing to the ear. You may have more issues if you are using an analogue desk where you haven't got as much flexibility in the EQ (e.g. fixed frequency point, fixed q :-/ )

Use a hairdryer to tighten the grill cloth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgGM781nR2M Masterful.

I know it may be against the DIY ethos... but have you tried sourcing a cheap airbrush (probably one of those aerosol powered ones) and flake attachment?

[quote name='mike257' timestamp='1478640793' post='3170604'] Only if they're d&b. [/quote] Thought as much.

[quote name='Higgie' timestamp='1478611044' post='3170265'] Can anyone with one of these tell me - If using with a MIDI Controller, do you have to use the MIDI output? Or can you plug a MIDI Keyboard into the input, then take the normal jack out and run through an amp? [/quote] The way I understand it, is that you use the midi controller to drive the synth and the output comes from the audio output that you would plug into the amp. In and out only need to be used when using the editor - this seems to be confirmed here - http://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/pandamidi-future-impact Annoyingly, the MIDI input doesn't seem to allow for patch changes, only note trigger and firmware update.

[quote name='Rik (ESA)' timestamp='1478556953' post='3169941'] I LOVE THIS FORUM! Thanks all for the tips, plenty to have a play about with here. I've been looking at an audix d6 for a while as it happens, but want to give the mic we have a shot before discarding it too hastily because of my lack of knowledge. That said though, it's one of those all in one cheapy drum mic sets, and tha gets what tha pays for more often than not! [/quote] You should be able to get some good results from the bass drum mic that you are using because you have some fairly powerful eq at your fingertips. The D6 is great because even through mixing consoles with limited EQ at your fingertips, it'll will get you in the ballpark with zero/minimal twiddling. It's defo worthwhile sticking with your exiting mic until you can at least get something in the ballpark - because you do have the flexible EQ available to you. The thing with kick drum though - is to nail that gate setting.

[quote name='Lw.' timestamp='1478540700' post='3169745'] Let's not even get started on the number of fish-fingers in a box! [/quote] I know!! Grr. I suspect downsizing package contents will become the norm!

I suspect a lot of companies are taking the opportunity for a spot of profiteering... even Walkers crisps are considering a price hike of 12% on good manufactured in the UK... but of course, Walkers is owned by Pepsico, so there's an argument about strength against the company's native currency... You can guarantee what ever happens re:europe and the value of the pound, any return to the strength of the pound will never be reflected in the price of goods in the UK. If only we grew the potatoes that they use for Walkers crisps in the UK... Their response? It's because they import the oil and seasoning... Can you imagine Apple reversing the price hikes on their Macs?

[quote name='JPJ' timestamp='1478538270' post='3169711'] I like the op look after our live sound, but I'm not a sound engineer. For a good drum sound, I've found a good hard gate to get rid of any after ring, followed by running the drums through a little bit of reverb just to warm them back up a little gives me the best result in 95% of the venues we play. As to crossover points, I prefer something in the 100-120 area, but as I use a pseudo crossover on our Behringer X-Air (combination of a high pass and a low pass on the mains and one aux, running the subs from the low passed aux out) I have the best control over the balance of the rig, much better imho than when we used a dedicated crossover. As with all these things, you have to first know what your gear can/cant do, and then experiment until you find something that works for you. [/quote] Reverb on snare is cool - but I would never advocate reverb on a bass drum! - one way ticket to mushville! Funnily enough - with most digital desks, you can see the higher and lower thresholds of reverb frequencies - so for example, on a snare, you'd get reverb on the mid to high end for the nice "airy" reverb, but can cut it so that the bassier elements of the snare don't get any 'verb applied. So yeah, same thoughts apply to floor tom with reverb - don't go mad! Hats especially, you actually want some definition in all those hits!

The best for what? Tone, volume, looks, ruggedness, weight, size, resale, bragging rights...? Given that a lot of the above are subjective, I wouldn't trust any answer that is given to you. I'm sure both camps have very happy customers.

[quote name='RockfordStone' timestamp='1478525985' post='3169603'] clearly he wasn't there to witness the impact they made [/quote] Not the whole "Paul is dead" thing...

http://yankee.com.pl/?lang=en

Even Paul is having second thoughts...