Manton Customs

Ah, I see what you were thinking ...basically using a Poly type product as a sanding sealer/wash coat. Depending on the product it'd probably work, but I wouldn't wipe anything onto a surface that's going to be sprayed as it will not be as level as a sprayed coat. And then there is the possible reaction the two finishes may have with each other. The conventional way of doing what you describe is applying either Nitro based sanding sealer or a few coats of thinned Nitro. As we are talking aerosols here, it'd be fine to just seal with a couple of coats of clear Nitro if you can't get a sanding sealer and the prep is good. Some will even spray their burst onto bare wood. I believe Fender are in the minority with spraying a Poly underneath as they are a company that sprays primarily Polyester and Urethane. Gibson certainly do it the "normal" way with only Nitro. You are correct, coloured Nitro or Poly is just clear with additives such as pigment or flatners (fine particles) for Satins and Mattes. But you need to protect those colours, which is where the clear coats come in. Otherwise minor scratches would actually remove colour. Nitro isn't too bad to spray, all finishes have their downsides, Nitro's is that it doesn't like damp when spraying and that it's extremely toxic. But it does lay down well compared to other products and repairs better than any other finish as it burns in, so mistakes during spraying can be fairly easy to correct if necessary. All that aside and sticking more closely to the original topic, it needs to be perfectly level before spraying, so stripping it back is the only way. Touching up or repairing a burst is a nightmare!

[quote name='PlungerModerno' timestamp='1453146372' post='2956868'] Not sure - Depends on what your working towards, and what you have to work with . . . If it's an open grained wood like oak, or ash for example, It would be advisable to fill the grain. Unless of course you want to keep the texture. If it's maple or another "ready to paint" woods - I'd just hit it with a few coats of poly clearcoat, then get the nitro colours for a final layer. AFAIK Fender did it for years for consistancy in their nitro finishes. Could be mistaken however. [/quote] Why the Poly coat? Fender do this on certain models due to mass production - spraying all instruments colour coats with Poly then clear coating Nitro on just the models which offer it (not many!). That way they get to offer a Nitro finish easily . It also helps with finish checking having the Poly basecoat. But you can't get Polyester/good urethane in rattle cans and it could introduce incompatibility issues depending on the brand, so it's not really a good idea. You're also missing a large very important part from that sequence....the clear coats! They go on last . You need to strip it if it is flaking, or no matter what you paint over it, it will end up lifting or chipping. You should be able to assess from there if it'll require grain filling (or posting a pic). Alder is probably a possibility, if so it won't need grain filling. Make sure your prep work is faultless, as the finish will magnify imperfections. Then you can spray your burst, here's a good article on the process to give you the order of things http://www.stewmac.com/How-To/Online_Resources/Learn_About_Instrument_Finishing_and_Finish_Repair/How_to_spray_a_sunburst_using_aerosol_cans.html

Micro Mesh . You can then work to a level you are happy with. It'll depend on the colour of the body for how fine you'll need to go. For example 1200 grit on a black bass will look pretty "scratchy" so you'd want to go higher, but the same 1200 used on a natural bass will look almost good enough. Two words of warning though, where your arms or fingers rest will gloss up pretty quickly again if the bass gets a great deal of use. The second warning being that in the right lighting conditions you will most likely see the scratches you have created. One way of making the scratches less noticeable is to apply a paste wax (I like Renaissance) after you're done rubbing, this will fill the fine scratches to some extent making them less obvious.

Ah, after googling it I now see how it should look like! That's a pretty flawed design having the grain running across such a short distance and at a curve! So its no wonder they get broken. Looks nice though . It would definitely best to take it to a luthier. First the two broken areas would need to be sawn square then planed perfectly flat (or routed). Then a matching piece of Maple would be glued in, before reshaping and then routing out that curved slot again. Obviously then the headstock face would need to be refinished. It's always going to be a weak area as it's a flawed design, but if done correctly it should be no weaker after the repair than it was when first constructed. It'd be pretty straight forward but take some balls .

Nice looking bass . What's the headstock damage like?

Yep, late 60s is when they moved on to Poly, though they didn't bother with the Nitro on top though, that's more of a recent thing so they can advertise a Nitro finish without the issues that come with it. So, yes it would be accurate if you're going for a late 60s/70s to have a Poly finish. But usually what people want with a relic type finish is a thin Nitro finish .

[quote name='therealting' timestamp='1452850595' post='2954013'] I suppose I could get a Fender 5 and get it refinished in thin-skin nitro, but am wondering if anyone already does these. [/quote] That's probably a good idea if you buy an unfinished one - and it need not be Fender. A Nitro finish will naturally relic/age much nicer than the Poly on most of the alternatives. 90% of companies that offer a Nitro finish these days are actually Nitro sprayed over a Poly base coat, so they will not age and check in the same way old finishes do.

I could help, but I'm a good 2 hours from Bristol! So if you don't mind posting the bass feel free to send a PM or email (address on the website).

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1452128090' post='2946892'] I use autosol all the time when polishing metal and final polish of frets. You sure it's not too course?. [/quote] It's coarser than the Meguiars which I also use but not so coarse as to risk anything (if used properly) or so coarse as to leave visible swirls/scratches. It obviously depends on the finish you use it on though. Below is a job I used it on a while back. A client brought me this PRS guitar which he'd attacked with a pan scourer in an effort to remove a sticker, obviously this wrecked the finish something bad. This was also the worst finish for buffing out....gloss black ! However, under an hour later, plenty of elbow grease and only one product (Autosol) I was done . Before: [url="http://s1067.photobucket.com/user/Manton-Customs/media/before.jpg.html"][/url] Afters: [url="http://s1067.photobucket.com/user/Manton-Customs/media/after%202.jpg.html"][/url] [url="http://s1067.photobucket.com/user/Manton-Customs/media/after.jpg.html"][/url] So, yeah. I'm sure

Yeah, you really don't need one, but if you feel one would help by all means go for it. I don't own a notched straight edge and have never needed one....regular straight edge all the time though!! Here is a thread discussing their use here [url="http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/luthiers-corner/273746-notched-straightedge-love-leave.html"]http://www.mylespaul...love-leave.html[/url]

Yep looks like a minor mineral streak. Nothing detrimental, just character! Definitely not a repair .

Both Autosol metal polish and Meguiars Ultimate Compound work very well. I use both on scratch builds. The Autosol is coarser than the Meguiars. You can go finer than this with a swirl remover, but you might be at it a long time if trying to remove scratches. It should probably go without saying, but I'll say it anyway....these are abrasives, so will remove the top surface of your finish. Be especially careful around edges where the finish is thinner and you can buff through all too easily if you started with a thin finish! Also lot of earlier (cheaper) guitars actually did not come with a clear coat, so it's best not to buff these guitars. It was quite common back then to simply spray the colour and pronounce it done. No leveling of the finish, no buffing, no clear, just colour coats, so these are very easy to cut through down to the primer or wood. Having said that a lot of modern Poly finishes are so thick you couldn't buff through them if your life depended on it, making them quite safe to buff. So basically make sure you assess the finish first before having at it.

Wow that's terrible.

See the 8 string build in my sig for ultimate intonation . The Buzz Feitin system is good, but there are still compromises. Whereas the true temperament system gets perfect intonation on each and every fret...something which is not possible with regular straight frets. Despite what Buzz Feitin claim. I'm not 100% sure what kind of issue the OP is having. If it's that the tuning changes when you move the saddles when setting intonation then that's normal. If the bass is just generally not holding tune, then it's not really an intonation issue, as setting the intonation should not really effect the tuning stability of the bass. It could be the setup at the nut or old strings, have you recently changed string gauge? If you ever hear a 'ping' when tuning then the nut could be pinching the strings. Or if not, are the strings extremely old as suspected by others (and myself!)? If the intonation is not staying where it's set and the tuning is drifting then possibilities are the strings as already mentioned or the saddles are not holding firmly in place. If you cannot set the intonation correctly it could be the nut throwing things out, or again old strings (but less likely in this case). This is assuming the bridge is mounted in the correct place! So, changing strings is a good idea if they have been on for a while!

How bad is the fretboard...pics would be good . Unless it's literally falling apart, you shouldn't need a new fingerboard, simply defret and restore the old one . There are plenty of threads on defretting on google which may be helpful. You'll see some people using wood filler and others using veneer to fill the fret slots. I'd recommend filling the slots with veneer rather than wood filler.

It looks like you just have a little too much relief. If you'd like to find out the extent of the bow, try this. Capo the first fret and fret the last one of the E string, then get yourself either a feeler gauge or failing that a ruler which starts at 0. While capo'd at the first and fretted at the last, take a measurement between the bottom edge of the E string and the 8th fret crown (aka top). Make a note of that measurement and report back if you like . If you'd like to know if the neck is twisted you can repeat this process on the G string. You want that measurement to be the same or very close to the one from the E string. If it's considerably different then there is some element of twist present. Though I doubt that's the issue here .

All the above answers are good ones. It might be something which gets too much thought (if that's possible) and there are an awful lot of opinions expressed as fact on the subject at various forums (I'm not referring to the good people here ). The reality is that it really doesn't matter too much as long as it's something safe (no silicone, no water). So seeing as you've got Lemon Oil, go with that. All the other products mentioned basically serve the same purpose. For the neck itself, you'll want to get your self a wiping varnish of some sort, unless you want a lacquer finish which is not so beginner friendly. Various options for the wiping varnish would be Danish Oil, Tru Oil, Liberon Finishing Oil, Tung Oil and probably quite a few others, but they are the ones I have used. You'll notice some of those names don't sound like a wiping varnish at all as they are given names with the word "oil" in. They are not really true oil finishes, but a varnish made up from oil, thinners and a resin such as polyurethane. If you want a gloss, you'd be best looking at Liberon or Tru.

Nitro is actually softer than the Poly you'll find on guitars. Lo-E is right, if it's 70s it won't be Nitro unless it has been refinished, but they continued to spray the headstock face with Nitro as compatibility issues were expected between the decal and Poly. If you could get the picture to show up we may be able to tell more. If this happens (bloom) during finishing the way of fixing it is to either spray lacquer thinner, or simply a new coat of Nitro. So the issue with the lacquer is anything like this the fix may need to be the same (more lacquer). Though if it's just on the surface you may be able to simply buff it out.

Glad to help and thank you

Meguiars ultimate compound should work for you, definitely ok on nitro though if the scratches are quite deep, you may need repeat applications. Keep in mind that all these products actually remove finish, or at least the top surface. So if the guy who refinished it didn't lay down enough lacquer, burn throughs are a possibility. Take it easy round the edges where burning through is most likely.

If you go for a grain filler, you may struggle a bit with the 'slurry' method on Ash. That method works fairly well on small pores like Walnut, but Ash usually has great big chasms which may be a bit too much for the slurry to achieve a 100% fill. You'd be better off buying a either a purpose made paste grain filler or Epoxy, it'd certainly be quicker! Though if I were you I'd probably leave the pores and have it feeling a bit more natural, that's supposed to be what an oil finish is all about anyway . Looks like a fun project, good luck! .

If you were to have it refinished, it'd be a fairly simple job for the luthier doing the refinish to fill that hole (with matching wood) before painting.

Feel free to send me a PM or email, I would be glad to advise .

[quote name='christofloffer' timestamp='1448793903' post='2918115'] well, thats a really kind offer but i have made a bit of a call. i asked my mum the very rude question of how much the bass cost in the first place and the whole caboodle was under £100 new. taking into account the fairly neglected life its had up until recently i dont think its worth messing about with it. instead i am just going to start looking at a better quality bass. this one can just go as a spare and a travelling hack. when i picked it up in earnest i was going to play for a while before deciding wether or not i was going to stick at it or not. i am enjoying it far too much to be dropping it so its worth a better bass. doesnt seem wise to me to spend anything on something that i am thinking of replacing in the near future anyway really. i may have you take a look at the new one once i get it to make sure i am starting with it set up properly. perhaps once i have a better one to hand i will strip this one down and use it as a learning experience. i am not lost on woodworking so it might be a chance to learn some new skills. [/quote] Ok, no problem. If you change your mind or need help with the new one let me know, hefty discount still applies ! While it's obviously a cheap bass, with the right setup it should still play well and in tune, so in the meantime you could try setting the intonation again yourself. Are the saddles maxed out as far as they will go back (E and A)? If not you can adjust it as Howie has suggested, bringing them further backwards and the D and G forward. Though I was assuming that you had ran out of travel, which could well be the nut as mentioned earlier.

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1448658866' post='2917307'] Any mileage in suggesting a meet-up with a more experiences BC member somewhere in your vicinity (around M[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]arket Drayton, Shropshire, I think..?)..? Someone who could have a look at your set-up and help out with intonation guidelines, truss rod, neck relief, nut..? I'm too far away, of course, but if you ask nicely (and could offer biscuits... ), there may be someone close by..? Just sayin'. [/font][/color] [/quote] Good thinking Batman. If that's correct and the location is Market Drayton then I pass through fairly often (next due 2 weeks ish), so I could collect it and deliver it back also . I haven't got quite so desperate as to accept biscuits as payment for services yet (next year maybe!) but I could definitely give a decent sized BC member discount. Send me a PM or email if you like, I'd be glad to help a basschatter out . Robin (that means I get to call people batman )