drTStingray

The thing to remember is a small change on bass goes a long way - simply doubling up the notes or changing the intensity of the line you're playing goes a long, long way in terms of dynamics - or introducing a root note an octave higher. However if you're already playing flat out there's nowhere to go - so you (and especially the guitarist) need to organise the song dynamics to account for this. A good lesson can be learned from Free - these tricks were used to great effect. Finally fat bass sound (without effects to create it) will generally come from your fingers, a bass guitar and amp set up with those characteristics - eg Free - Andy Fraser using an EB3 with a valve stack (Orange?). I find basses like Warwicks, Wals and Musicman create a fatter sound (to the extent you sometimes have to thin it out a little or play softer) - there's a good reason why Flea stopped using the Fender Jazz live - it was simply a thinner sound and wouldn't get that raunchy fat slightly driven sound so effective in a lot of RHCPs music.

My two band EQ Musicman basses - Neptune blue really pops in bright light. The Classic Sabre has a mahogany body.

I based the nomdeplume on this whilst whilst watching it at home and noodling on a Stingray - slightly less or more cool dependent on your viewpoint - back on topic - Marcus must have been very young in 1975? its worth listening to Jaco's predecessor Alphobso Johnson - although more funk than Jaco I think you can hear a sort of embryonic Jaco sound at times. The number of influential bass players from the late 70s era is really mind boggling - including the Philly players, Rocco, Abraham Laboriel. Good as Jaco was I think he's only one part of the jigsaw - Percy Jones is also a very good call and a Wal Fretless player also.

As you well know, the Bongo is the bass with which to impress women - though the Ray does pretty well - especially in Fretless form.....eye popping carpet here as well.

Ha ha - I think you're doing yourself a dis-service there, Bass Tractor! It's worth thinking about who was influential when Jaco was really popular - this was probably from 1976-80 as far as Weather Report are concerned. During that time period, Stanley Clarke (with Return to Forever and solo), Bernard Edwards, Louis Johnson, Anthony Jackson, and a steam of others produced memorable bass work. The point is that whole era of music contained bass playing which influenced bass players who followed like Mark King, Pino Palladino and others - would Norman Watt-Roy have played that line on Hit Me With Your Rythmn Stick without having seen Jaco live - probably not but he would still have done a myriad of others without (eg What A Waste). I think his direct influence is grossly overstated but he may have popularised Fretless bass and maybe increased use of techniques like harmonics incorporated into bass lines. So having top ten singles involving The Crusaders (a very prolific jazz/R and B band), free form sax solos (Ian Dury) or vocoder and jazz funk from a jazz act (Herbie Hancock) was the norm for a few years. Jaco is only a relatively small part.

The thing with Jaco is if you don't like jazz and R and B, you're unlikely to like his music. I think it's great - always have done - but there were plenty of other jazz influenced R and B players around at the time, and plenty of jazz upright players doing something similar - I always though Nils Henning--Pedersen, who played with Oscar Peterson, was absolutely a stand out player. I have taken the time and trouble to learn a number of Jaco's bass parts - some are pretty challenging - it has helped my overall playing and understanding of music greatly. However I am heavily slanted towards an R and B/ funk influence - jazz, rock, rock and roll and other genres influence me but not as much. There is no doubt Jaco was a superb bass player and musician whether you like him or not. Marcus Miller was a session player on R and B pop records (eg Somebody Else's Guy - Jocelyn Brown) - I first came across him knowingly (as opposed to having heard him on records not realising it was him) in Miles Davis's band in the early 80s - where he came across as a funk/R and B player with jazz influences - another fine player with totally his own style and musician-wise, way beyond just a bass player. I don't have a problem with people not liking Jaco - I suspect if you dislike jazz it's likely you won't like Jaco - similarly I dislike a lot of Paul Weller and Morrisey which is probably anathema to many people - just personal taste I guess.

There's a picture somewhere on the net of him playing a Stingray in the studio. I'm guessing he's used lots of types of basses considering how long U2 have been around.

Take great care - this could simply be caused by the resonance of the room you're playing it in combined with your amp and bass guitar EQ settings. Boomy rooms can cause major problems. I played with a keyboard player on Sunday whose EQ choice along with the resonance of the room caused his left hand chords to cancel entirely the sound of his right hand - this was resolved by him cutting both the bassiest and adjacent low mid fader on his amp EQ considerably - this completely resolved the problem - had to cut the bass slightly on my amp EQ also - similarly on the PA for the bass drum. Prior to this the boominess on the band's sound was awful.

What a nice bass you have there - the white pick guard looks great with black as well. If this is a metallic sound of string on fret it sounds like it could be a set up issue to me. When the weather turns cold I find that any bass with lowish action needs a tweak on the truss rod - we have recently had a cold spell - I played a gig at a club a week or so back and all of the guitars went out of tune between sound check and start of gig - someone left a door open via the stage to the car park and the back of the stage was freezing cold (around 0 degrees outside) compared with a warm room full of people in front of it. A tweak of the truss rod on a Stingray is a very simple task. The other thing, if you're not used to a Stingray - you don't necessarily have to play the bass as hard as some other makes - and if you do, you would need to have a higher action to avoid rattling the frets when digging in - similarly too trebly an EQ setting on amp or bass would also highlight this. Finally, as Pete said, the saddle heights need to compensate for the fretboard radius and difference in string guages - whilst EBMM have, in my experience always shipped basses with nigh in perfect set up, some dealer staff do like to fiddle with them. As has been said many times before, poor after market set up often causes grief.

I'm sure there were other 60s/early 70s players who used these (John McVie, Larry Taylor and others) so they could make the same basic instrument and put a range of different names on......... oh hang on ?

I get that some signature basses are quite different versions of stock basses. However there seems an increasing tendency of one manufacturer, having dropped the 'non standard' signature instruments, to issue an ever more bewildering stream of 'parts bin' signature instruments based on designs they've been producing for years but in a different colour. I guess it's a marketing strategy but being cynical, it smacks a bit of desperation to me. It also makes that manufacturer's range even more bewildering than ever.

A generally true and rather telling advertisement for highly priced and prized vintage gear as I've ever seen I think. i always thought Andy Fraser got a reasonably focussed and generally good sound with Free (I saw them live three times - all at the same venue). I think the biggest impediment to 'your' sound is the room dynamics and particularly if you can hear yourself properly (so monitoring) - it also depends whose amps you're stood next to and how/what they play. Followed by playing a bass with a decent flexibility to get a supportive and (if you want the notes to be heard) focussed bass sound. I hear far to much indistinct mush sound these days (probably caused by people trying to get that vintage 60s vibe described by Chris_b)!!

I watched it - if you can overlook the fact that at least some of them are rather old (even more than me) I thought they sounded excellent and definitely evocative of 1969/70 (with the exception of Gillan's voice) - but even he sounded good but different. The mix was excellent and on my tele the keyboards and the bass were as prominent as the guitar where required - unlike the Gilmore concert a couple of nights ago where I was hard pressed to hear any of the detail of what Guy Pratt was playing. If you're into Deep Purple circa 1970 this is pretty good.

To be honest, weak G string sound has no place in this thread as the OP has already decided they want a Stingray. Why try to talk him out of it? I own lots of Stingrays and don't experience the problem - I have never heard any sound sample which replicates this effect in hearing Stingrays recorded since 1976. Therefore I'm inclined to believe it's a user issue - there are so many variables in play that something as simple as slightly compromised hearing could create this effect (to a listener stood a couple of feet in front of speakers pointing sound out past their knees).

By far the most versatile, whilst still retaining the standard H Stingray ability would be an HH. Coming from a Corvette you may find this the best - really the only downside, if there is one is its not quite so easy to slap with the neck pick up there. The dargie delight, amongst a number of other finishes, is really a collector's bass, hence commanding higher prices - and some of the colours available in the past have been fabulous - there are lots of different examples. Natural with maple or sunburst with maple are really classic colours on these basses - followed by black and also white. However some of the EBMM colours like blueburst, blue dawn, and trans red are equally classic these days. A rosewood board would give a slightly darker sound. As for 2 EQ or 3 EQ, the latter gives a lot more flexibility especially live in boomy sounding rooms - it can also get quite close to a 2 EQ by cutting the mid a decent amount. The Classic series give you highly figured neck wood, 2 EQ and adjustable mutes on the bridge amongst a range of cool features. Id go with that natural HH if it was me (in fact I nearly bought one recently - but I already have an HH in one of the limited edition colours so didn't in the end). Other EBMM models like the 25th Anni, Reflex, Bongo are as it says on the tin, different models - they are unlikely to give you the exact Stingray sound although they are excellent in their own right.

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1510150213' post='3404302'] Louis Johnson and Bernard Edwards did some of their best work on Stingray's with tapewounds so it's all down to what you like. [/quote] Stingrays shipped with GHS flat's until mid 78 when they appear to have changed to GHS rounds. Nard's will most likely have had GHS flat's, pointed to by various recorded sounds (especially popping strings) - it's highly unlikely that Louis Johnson's had flats based on the recorded sound and videos of him soloed. That said none are tape wounds - and I've never tried them on a Stingray in 35 odd years - must give it a go sometime.

Crikey there's a whole load of stuff on sale or sold from his Reverb shop. Now there's several V cool Musicman basses he has........

As well as matching the binding, standard SR5s with black pick guards have black pick up covers and control knobs - remainder normally have white pick up covers and silver knobs. Also applies to Classic 4 and Classic 5 models. White covers were, apparently an option in the early pre EB days also. For four string H basses, the covers were available to buy when the Classic line was introduced. As Pete says, they can look good even when contrasting, say on a bkack bass. I think these 30th Anniversary SR5s look great as they are.

[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1508782037' post='3394401'] ..but I think it's cool http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIKNyzq38nw [/quote] Me too - how cool is that!! Excellent players as well. I've now got a Stingray strung with light gauge roundwound strings for moments when I feel like slapping, one with flatwounds for when I fancy that thumpy old fashioned style, a Fretless one for Pino (80s) and Jaco moments, and a 5 string one for funky hip hopish moments - that's all my needs covered I believe!!

[quote name='alaskaleftybass' timestamp='1508353793' post='3391664'] I respectfully disagree. I played the entire decade as a professional touring musician and never slapped. I was able to emulate slap using a fingernail technique but never needed to slap. [/quote] I did something similar in the mid 70s, never having seen film of anyone doing but had heard things like Car Wash - once I saw the likes of Stanley Clarke I tried to copy the technique - I'm still learning even now!! 😕

[quote name='scannerman' timestamp='1508357072' post='3391698'] Gm is my slap key preference! [/quote] Mine are C and D - allows fast fretting hand slap - probably a hand size thing - I find it harder elsewhere on the fretboard.

I don't totally disagree and like melodic solos - however slap (and even spanking the bass) are more to do with the rythmic/percussive side of bass playing - as is thumpy flatwound stuff for that matter (in an understated way) Perhaps that spanking the strings is partially for the visual impact as well.

I think you guys all moan too much you know!! That solo is very reminiscent of Stanley Clarke and Louis Johnson all rolled into one. I'd count myself fortunate to have seen them both live and both playing solos which, if I'd watched them played back would probably have bits which were questionable. They were very exciting live. Louis spanked the strings like that. Abe was/is an exponent of flamenco type rakes. Yes all of it can border on bad taste but it's exciting live and in some cases even to listen to. Jaco, Marcus, Stanley, Louis, Mark - all had/have tendencies to border into areas of bad taste occasionally for my money but if I had half of their ability I'd be a very happy person. Hell, Marcus even plays a 77 Fender - that's bad taste in itself for some (not for me) - but he is guilty of some bits of tasteless solo playing IMHO.

It's interesting the RHCP, Flea and slap thing. However, like RATM with rock infused with hip hop, RHCP's early material was a sort of rock meets punk meets funk and Flea has said he was quite influenced by Louis Johnson. Stuff like Sir Psycho Sexy is pure funk - even a little like Funkadelic. Their hits have tended to be of the less funky, more rocky type. Having been around 30 yrs + they have a wealth of material - in some eras the material contained more funk - and more slap bass. Mark King and Level 42 started off at the height of jazz funk around 1980 - and a lot of their early material was built around slap bass, and keyboard laden jazz funk (Prophet 5 particularly). Some of their later hits were far more rocky, and perhaps featured those elements less. But much of their famous hit back catalogue is from that 1981-1989 sort of era, many with slap bass grooves. After a gig a couple of weeks ago, I sat at home watching a TOTP from 1984 - and particularly paid attention because it was from around the week my daughter was born so it was quite personally nostalgic - I think there were three songs played virtually throughout on slap bass - Too Shy Kadjagoogoo, Hot Water Level 42, Young Guns by Wham. That is certainly a lot more than you'd expect now - indeed you would sometimes have problems even hearing the bass on some modern songs. For those with statistic interest there were 5 songs with keyboard bass either throughout or largely (two double tracking slap bass), 3 Arias, 3 Wals, 2 Fender J, one Fender P, one JD - IIRC 😀 This would certainly give a flavour of pop singles at that time - however I disagree that this is a description of 'mainstream' as if you're using importance by record sales and financial turnover, album sales and bands focussing on them have been more important than singles since the end of the 60s - beware definitions based on 60s thinking as it was very different then, many artists being thoroughly ripped off by the industry, which was focussed on single sales, sometimes by dubious means at that time. There are/were loads of main stream slap bassists it just depends what you mean by mainstream - the original bass player in Incubus (Dirk Lance?) was a formidable slap bassist - both Nick Fyffe and Stuart Zender in Jamiroquy - even Pino in Paul Young's band. If you're a metal fan there are probably loads of mainstream slap bass players. If you're talking pop singles they are few and far between now - the last I remember was Uptown Funk - the first I was ever aware of was Car Wash. So back in the mid 80s a typical TOTP might have 20-30% - but more notably - nearly 40% on keyboard - and amazingly (by today's standards), 100% with bass playing a crucial part in the song and very audible in the mix.

Or punk!!