thedontcarebear Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 So is this Ash or Alder? I think from the photo Ash, but the spec says Alder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misdee Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 It would be handy to know what the bass was and where it comes from . Particularly if the bass was made in the Far East, it might be neither alder or ash but a local equivalent . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedontcarebear Posted November 20, 2020 Author Share Posted November 20, 2020 It’s a jap Tokai, they’ve made Alder and Ash basses, so it’s more about the grain. All the others of this model I’ve found say Ash, but they are natural finishes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artisan Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 (edited) Straight grain looks like Ash to me Edited November 20, 2020 by artisan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellzero Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Ash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedontcarebear Posted November 20, 2020 Author Share Posted November 20, 2020 Good good, to be honest, I am wanting it to be Ash! And the more elaborate grain made me think it was. It will be here later today anyway, all the way from Barcelona to Kippax in Yorkshire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belka Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 If it's Japanese, it's probably their local type of ash, which is called 'Sen' apparently. Pretty sure it's not alder. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeftyJ Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Yep, ash. Often it's alder for the opaque finishes, and ash on transparent finishes. Fender did that too in many occasions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misdee Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 3 hours ago, thedontcarebear said: It’s a jap Tokai, they’ve made Alder and Ash basses, so it’s more about the grain. All the others of this model I’ve found say Ash, but they are natural finishes. In that case it is actually most likely to be Sen, rather than ash or alder. Back in the day, Japanese guitars made of Sen were described as being made of ash, despite the fact that Sen is not related to ash in any way and is actually part of the Ivy family. Sen looks and sounds so much like ash that it was considered an equivalent substitute. Tokai used it extensively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Wood of some sort. It looks quite nice and the joins aren't too obvious. What else do you want? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martthebass Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Just now, BigRedX said: Wood of some sort. It looks quite nice and the joins aren't too obvious. What else do you want? To know whether it was alder or ash......... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 18 minutes ago, martthebass said: To know whether it was alder or ash......... Why? What difference will it make? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belka Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Just now, BigRedX said: Why? What difference will it make? For some people none at all. Others may prefer the way one or the other looks. There will also be a slight difference with regard to sound. Of course, this is only one variable and there are a whole host of others, but you don't have to be so dismissive of it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trueno Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 It might help you form a view of which wood you prefer for tonal properties... even accounting for all the other variables. I think my my Squier sounds great for agathis... but it does have emg geezers in it. I think the grain in the original pic looks great too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 1 minute ago, Belka said: For some people none at all. Others may prefer the way one or the other looks. There will also be a slight difference with regard to sound. Of course, this is only one variable and there are a whole host of others, but you don't have to be so dismissive of it. The most obvious differences of one piece of wood will make over another are the grain pattern if it is visible and the weight of the instrument, neither of which can be automatically implied by the wood species (not withstanding the fact that "ash" covers over 40 individual tree species). From the photo in the OP the grain pattern doesn't look too shabby and the joins between the different pieces of wood making up the body are not significantly noticeable. Weight can only be deduced by actually weighing the instrument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misdee Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 14 minutes ago, BigRedX said: The most obvious differences of one piece of wood will make over another are the grain pattern if it is visible and the weight of the instrument, neither of which can be automatically implied by the wood species (not withstanding the fact that "ash" covers over 40 individual tree species). From the photo in the OP the grain pattern doesn't look too shabby and the joins between the different pieces of wood making up the body are not significantly noticeable. Weight can only be deduced by actually weighing the instrument. The type of wood used makes a difference to the sound of the instrument. Alder can sound quite different to ash. I think it is perfectly valid to want to know what your bass is made of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misdee Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 (edited) These 1980's Japanese Tokai P Basses / J Basses are superb , by the way. Looks like it will be a lovely bass. Edited November 20, 2020 by Misdee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedontcarebear Posted November 20, 2020 Author Share Posted November 20, 2020 (edited) Good old bass chat! 1 hour ago, BigRedX said: Why? What difference will it make? What difference does anything make? That was in a jokey way by the way, I am actually more in the I don't care what the wood is when it comes to sound camp. I am more just curious what the wood is, because I want to know. Either way, I had bought the bass before I posted that picture. Edited November 20, 2020 by thedontcarebear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martthebass Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, BigRedX said: Why? What difference will it make? That wasn't his question. You have pushed the discussion into an area that wasn't solicited. The ash vs alder tonal properties has been discussed numerous times previously....there's a search function should you wish to avail yourself of it. Edited November 20, 2020 by martthebass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Misdee said: The type of wood used makes a difference to the sound of the instrument. Alder can sound quite different to ash. I think it is perfectly valid to want to know what your bass is made of. Although in this case, I think we can safely assume it the sound is neither undeniably ash or alder, or the question would not be asked! To further muddy those waters, I've played ash basses that sounded quite muted and 'soft' and alder basses that were very bright and lively. If there were a Venn diagram showing the tonal characteristics the area of overlap would be quite large. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belka Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 13 minutes ago, Chris2112 said: Although in this case, I think we can safely assume it the sound is neither undeniably ash or alder, or the question would not be asked! To further muddy those waters, I've played ash basses that sounded quite muted and 'soft' and alder basses that were very bright and lively. If there were a Venn diagram showing the tonal characteristics the area of overlap would be quite large. Good points - light swamp ash is more likely to sound like alder whereas heavier northern ash has a brighter harsher tone. I agree with some of what BigRedX says - predicting sound based on body wood selection is nowhere near an exact science and it is just one part of the puzzle. In my opinion neck materials, and pickup type and location have a greater influence on sound. Then you also have nut, fret and bridge type/materials to consider. However, if the pickups/electronics have sufficient clarity, I'm sure that body material will make a difference, although it's debatable whether this is more to do with density/weight than the actual species. I n some cases I'm sure it makes little to no difference; a short scale mudbucker-equipped EB0 could have a brass nut, badass bridge, heavy ash body and ebony fretboard and would still sound like mud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrevorG Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 (edited) Ash grains don't sit that far apart normally. Alder has very little grain. I used this site to discover my Ash bass was made from Heartwood(the centre of the tree often called olive wood or Tiger wood). Try looking here. https://www.wood-database.com/wood-finder/ Edited November 20, 2020 by TrevorG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedontcarebear Posted November 20, 2020 Author Share Posted November 20, 2020 19 minutes ago, TrevorG said: Ash grains don't sit that far apart normally. Alder has very little grain. I used this site to discover my Ash bass was made from Heartwood(the centre of the tree often all olive wood or Tiger wood). Try looking here. https://www.wood-database.com/wood-finder/ It looks very much like the Oregon Ash picture they have on their site. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misdee Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 I've got a P Bass made out of genuine lightweight swamp ash and it has the hallmark characteristics attributed to that wood i.e slightly scooped mids with plenty of highs and and a nicely rounded bottom. It's a subtle difference overall , but definitely a contrast to my alder-bodied P that has much more focused mids and low end. Northern ash is much brighter sounding and often sounds a bit compressed at the low frequency end of the spectrum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedontcarebear Posted November 20, 2020 Author Share Posted November 20, 2020 Boo, it's only just reached the UK, so I won't get it til Monday! This has made me wonder what wood my Sandberg is now, my 64 is alder, and my Jap Fender is basswood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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