citymariner Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 VERY small venue coming up and really don't need to take the whole rig. Problem is - which cab? They are both Ashdown Classic Neo cabs (the 115 and 210) They both sound ace but which one will be best for cutting through and give my the greatest versatility. What do you reckon? BTW we are a rock cover band. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Depends on your style really. If you`re a Duff McKagan type bassist, being heard in the mix, take the 210. If you`re a Cliff Williams type bassist, being felt in the mix, take the 115. From your post, stating cutting through, this can be achieved with a 115, by adding more mids than you usually have, but, the 115 will also have more depth. I`m never keen on 210s as stand-alone cabs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Not heard the 115 personally but it will certainly louder than 210. Although it doesn't need to be loud but it'll give the better sound onstage with the right EQing. The mids-low mids will be better and the lows will be able to keep up better than with the 210. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Heeley Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 rock covers: take the 15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 If you just use the 15 then you won't be taking up less space, so if your "sound" is dependent on using both cabs, that's what I'd take. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citymariner Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 [quote name='chris_b' post='1306535' date='Jul 17 2011, 11:53 AM']If you just use the 15 then you won't be taking up less space, so if your "sound" is dependent on using both cabs, that's what I'd take.[/quote] True - my real estate stacks upwards I guess. Everyone has mentioned both elements that are part of my sound. The 210s provide the cut through and the 115 adds the feel. It was quite funny watching an empty plastic beer glass 'walk' across the stage last night... If it is all too much for the bricks and mortar I can always ditch one of the cabs and use it to elevate the other reducing the amount of bass. Thanks for your thoughts! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomBassmonkey Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 210s give a rounder sound for me, 15s do low end well but they don't have the definition IME. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 [quote name='citymariner' post='1306540' date='Jul 17 2011, 12:00 PM']....If it is all too much for the bricks and mortar I can always ditch one of the cabs and use it to elevate the other reducing the amount of bass....[/quote] I'd take both and probably turn the volume down a bit, but only if I had to! I think louder bass is pretty good in most situations, including small spaces; the problem is that when the drummer and guitarist hear loud bass, they generally crank up as well and that's the real problem! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 The biggest problem I've found using a 210 on it's own is that you need to find a way of lifting it so that the sound doesn't just wash around peoples ankles. I use a stand and turn my 210 vertically if I want to travel light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citymariner Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 That is doable. I'm gonna take both cabs now. Stick the 115 on the floor, then the flight cased head followed by the 210 vertically aligned on top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blademan_98 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Interesting that most comments said use the 15 but the poll shows the 2 x 10 is the winner! My Marshall combo is 2 x 10 and the extension is a 15. The 2 x 10 is great on it's own, but the 15 really gives it depth. Turn it up and play LOUD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molan Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 For my last similar gig I took a 1x15 and a 1x10. Tried them both and the sound was quite boomy, this was a room issue more than anything with the cabs. Tried the 15 on it's own and still a bit over-powering so switched to just the 10 on its own and it sounded great Easily loud enough and sat perfectly in the mix of a 7 piece soul/funk band. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 2x10 vertical FTW. I'd also try another 2x10 with it if you can get a loan of one & see if you prefer it to your mixed setup. It should produce just as much bass as your 15 & 2x10 but with more consistent results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Cutting through and versatility? Got to be the 2x10 i would think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 If you only want to take one cab, then it has to be the 210 for a quiet gig. A 15" on its own is a terrible cab, 99% of the time, unless it has a horn, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molan Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 [quote name='JTUK' post='1306983' date='Jul 17 2011, 07:37 PM']If you only want to take one cab, then it has to be the 210 for a quiet gig. A 15" on its own is a terrible cab, 99% of the time, unless it has a horn, IMO.[/quote] The Bag End 1x15's are amazing, definitely a standalone 'gigging' cab Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 [quote name='icastle' post='1307008' date='Jul 17 2011, 08:10 PM']What 'con trick' is that then?[/quote] I think he means the way that many manufacturers lead you to believe that you need a 15" for bass & 2x10/4x10 for mid & top. With the correct cabs you can get the same frequencies covered from either a 10", 12" or 15" cone (& Alex is working on showing that it can be done from an 8"). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citymariner Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 Both cabs have horns that can be turned high low and off. Ray is clearly a hater of Ashdown and in typical fashion throws in irrelevant bludgeoning of the brand, the 210+115 debate AND an option that is not available. For the record I've tried 2x 210 (both the same cab) and preferred it with a 210 and the 115. The sound was equally as good (although the 115 is punchy) but I didn't feel it as much. If I had no care for my back, ears or venues I play i'd get a 410 and sit it on top of the 115. I like to feel my trousers flap... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I'd take both. Small venue = small stage = bassist standing so close to a single small cab on the floor that only his knees can hear it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 [quote name='ThomBassmonkey' post='1306549' date='Jul 17 2011, 12:05 PM']210s give a rounder sound for me, 15s do low end well but they don't have the definition IME.[/quote] With the right EQing a 15 will sound more "rounder" than any 210. Take a look at the Barefaced website. I've done a fair bit of looking but you'll be hard pressed to find any 210s that go as low and as loud as even quality 1x12 let alone a 1x15. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 [quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1307137' date='Jul 17 2011, 09:59 PM']With the right EQing a 15 will sound more "rounder" than any 210. Take a look at the Barefaced website. I've done a fair bit of looking but you'll be hard pressed to find any 210s that go as low and as loud as even quality 1x12 let alone a 1x15.[/quote] I don't believe I've ever said that about 1x15"s. In fact I've never given damn about speaker size (apart from in polar response considerations, but side-by-side smaller drivers are worse than single or vertically aligned larger drivers). There are numerous parameters that matter to me and speaker size is way down the priority scale. And the 15"s used in bass cabs over the years have tended to be worse in the parameters that matter than the popular 10"s over the years, usually because manufacturers didn't seem to consider that you should pay more for a 15" than a 10" because like for like it does twice the work. I've used 2x10"s that beat many 15"s and 12"s. And the reverse. Trying to tell the the bass world that speaker size is the least of their concerns sometimes feels like trying to tell 1950s America that skin colour has no bearing on your ability to be a good President. It might have taken the world decades to get beyond looking at someone and not making a mindless judgement based on what colour they are and instead listen to what they have to say but so many bassists are still determined to hang onto groundless old ideas and make blanket judgements based on looks instead of listening with an open mind. Jonathan Swift wrote a good book addressing bass players' ill-informed prejudices about big speakers and little speakers back in 1727 - unfortunately some editor changed it to being about very small people fighting over whether to cut the 10" end or the 15" end off their soft-boiled egg, and the original manuscript is long lost... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citymariner Posted July 18, 2011 Author Share Posted July 18, 2011 It is irrelevant that it is Ashdown gear to be fair - that just gave some background. I was asking, if in a small venue situation, and had the choice, would you take the 210 or the 115 if you were in a rock covers band? I can't supply anymore details like room size, floor material, number of punters, proximity to other instruments etc. Nem mind hey. Thanks to everyone else who has given some constructive input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 [quote name='citymariner' post='1308357' date='Jul 18 2011, 08:17 PM']Is it really that dumb to ask for peoples experience? Isn't that what a forum is all about?[/quote] No and yes. I prefer the old adage that there's no such thing as stupid questions, only stupid answers. FWIW, I also use Ashdown 210 and 115 cabs. I stack them 'upright' so that the 2x10s are one on top of the other (with the 115 cab at the bottom). Seems to work fine and has quite a small stage footprint. Last weekend I played a garden party gig and only had room for one cab in the car as, this time, I was taking a lot of the PA gear as well. I chose the 210 and it was fine. I've only tried a direct comparison of the 210 and 115 at home and, to be honest, I didn't notice any great difference that a bit of eq tweaking couldn't fix. Perhaps I've just got cloth ears! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 [quote name='xgsjx' post='1307014' date='Jul 17 2011, 08:16 PM']I think he means the way that many manufacturers lead you to believe that you need a 15" for bass & 2x10/4x10 for mid & top. With the correct cabs you can get the same frequencies covered from either a 10", 12" or 15" cone (& Alex is working on showing that it can be done from an 8").[/quote] The shape and size of the speaker cabinet is far more important than the size of the speakers themselves. The cabinet itself is what gives you the low end frequencies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citymariner Posted July 18, 2011 Author Share Posted July 18, 2011 [quote name='flyfisher' post='1308394' date='Jul 18 2011, 08:43 PM']No and yes. I prefer the old adage that there's no such thing as stupid questions, only stupid answers. FWIW, I also use Ashdown 210 and 115 cabs. I stack them 'upright' so that the 2x10s are one on top of the other (with the 115 cab at the bottom). Seems to work fine and has quite a small stage footprint. Last weekend I played a garden party gig and only had room for one cab in the car as, this time, I was taking a lot of the PA gear as well. I chose the 210 and it was fine. I've only tried a direct comparison of the 210 and 115 at home and, to be honest, I didn't notice any great difference that a bit of eq tweaking couldn't fix. Perhaps I've just got cloth ears![/quote] Thanks for the reply, I've never been to this venue although I've been told by someone who plays there that it is tiny. However, that does not mean it is going to be quiet. I've plenty of EQ with a 7 band Boss EQ as well as the 7 band on my Klystron head (non of the freqs cross over). Space in the car isn't an issue, I know that means that I can take both and use one as a table. It was just which one would you pick. It's likely I'll have a play around with the three combinations I have 115; 210; 210+115 - From what I can gather I'm likely to experience different mid range response. Both cabs are front ported, horned and very solid so I guess if it is all too boomy I can go to one cab and raise it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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