warwickhunt

Both VS (originally) but the Marley Blue had the extra J inserted at the bridge and the P re routed for a J.

You need to do this!

As the FBT sub has either an 80 or 120 setting and the QSC mains (I THINK) have a 100 filter (or full range flat), I'll have to experiment as to what sounds best. Worst case scenario, the FBT sub deals with the HPF and I leave the mains/tops as full range and they'll only receive above the sub setting. I'm going to HPF guitars and vocals on the desk, hence the sub will only be handling kick drum and bass guitar (should I decide to put the bass through the PA rather than backline). It'll be trial and error but I have a tech rehearsal booked to run tests before it is used in anger.

I'm assuming the QSC 'sub' setting is for use when a sub sends a 'thru' full range signal, which I'll not be doing.

Hmmmm, not sure about that! I have a QSC K10 (10" 1000w) and I defy you to close your eyes and tell me if it is that (PA) monitor or a full blown 2x12 / 4x10 BASS cab... in fact I did the experiment on here.

Defo going to take the HP filter out option from the sub to the mains (so they get nothing below 80/120 depending on setting) but the mains also have a setting for receiving a full range signal from a sub and the mains then apply a filter... why you'd not HP coming from the sub I'm unsure?

Lots of great input and science have guided me to the choices; all down to the operator's abilities from here in! I'll have to have a bit of trial with the 4 settings for the sub X-over/voicing added to the fact that the QSC K10 (mk 1) have X-over settings, which need to be trialled. I may start with the FBT set to 120 and take the HP out to the tops but leave them full range (as opposed to the 'sub' setting. I can then flick between options too get the sweetest spot.

Personally I'd be getting one of these... https://www.thomann.de/gb/rcf_art_310_a_mk_iv.htm

I did yes. I considered any sub under 30kg and less than 0.5m cube sized (ish): RCF QSC... but I stopped researching as the FBT appeared on Marketplace (used) 40 miles away. Not the 'best' reason to choose a product but tbh I knew they were a decent make (not the same level as the RCF/QSC but good enough) and if it didn't work out with the 10" tops I'd not lose a lot of money on the sub. It is getting a run out in the next week or two... when I have my head around the QC12 desk.

Would a 'monitor' not be as good/better. It doesn't need to be FRFR, I had a Kemper and I trialled it with various options inc into the power section of a bass rig and an RCF310 was as good as any combination that I tried. I actually got a QSC K10 to use with it but the Kemper wasn't for me but the QSC is still utilised in my band(s).

My Radial Tonebone preamp pedal (not using backline) sends a DI to PA/FOH, with the preamp pedal main out to 'Inst in' on Rolls. I get an Aux send from the PA back to the 'Line in' which I have the rest of the band (no bass as I have control of that on the 'Inst in'). The 'Mic in' is for use as an ambient mic feed but this isn't always needed or is likely sacrificed if it is a bish/bosh turn around.

Exactly how I have it set up (+/- ambient mic as needed). Some might consider it an unnecessary link in the chain but it gives 'me' absolute control of what I hear without being tied to what the rest of the band want/get from an Aux feed from PA/engineer. I did a gig recently where (despite sending a tech spec) I turned up to find the PA/engineer couldn't give me the feed I needed in the time constraints; with the PM351 I at least had a work around. I can either take a cable to my IE (I use a thin phono type lead on a 5m run) or plug my Lekato wireless into the headphone output: as the Rolls is on my pedalboard it is literally at my feet so no worries with signal over distance/obstacles etc.

I may have said this before but I've ran 2400w power amps into 100w speakers and never come close to destroying the speaker... every amp I've ever used has a marvellous feature for controlling this; a volume or gain control. Conversely I've ran 60w amps into 1600w speakers and despite dire warnings from others, neither amp or speaker has come to harm. If you use your ears and 'ideally' a HPF (even the bass control on the EQ not being pushed), you shouldn't need to worry about amp or cab ratings... unless you use the type of speakers that they mount in cars; in which case you deserve what you get!

If something is cheap or at the market value (IMHO) I generally don't haggle but if I know that the going rate is less than a seller has something up for, I'll make offers. I think I've got a fairly good idea of the value of things but that isn't to say that a seller hasn't got a different viewpoint; sentimentality, buying 'new' or having bought something at the top of its price range and then needing to sell in a downbeat marketplace period, is generally when you have a wide range of opinion on price. There's no right or wrong, you just have to be prepared to disagree and walk away or pay what the seller wanted... and then they were right about the value. LOL I never get involved with 'vintage' Fenders etc as that is a minefield of values and authenticity + I don't like them.

When I bought the QSC used they weren't. Just as a general update. I've gone for the A&H CQ12 (bit of discount) and I've bought a used FBT 115 Sub.

They are a cracking speaker (I used to own 3 of them and still retain 1) but the QSC K10's that I have, best them... not night/day but defo better. If I was buying new on a budget they'd be on a list.

No fees but you have to pay due diligence as there is no comeback on the seller!

Appreciate the insight. However, it really is only ever going to be used for a 4 piece covers band and I don't think we'll scratch the surface of what it can do; the 18/20 would be massive overkill (for us). TBH a 12 channel analogue desk might suffice but for the extra initial outlay it makes sense to go this route.

Bill designs cabs and sells those designs, it would need someone in the UK to do the building... and distribution.

I 'think' one of those band members (who still owns that PA) is now in one of my band projects and I can tell you, he is having a proper grumble about the idea of 2 little 10's + little sub V's his big old monster PA! LOL

Yeah the £200 difference seems to get you a lot more features and flexibility. Saying that, we likely won't use a lot of that flexibility once it is initially set up. Some A&H uses may well use a desk like this with multiple bands and locations but ours will be the same line up in quite similar venues. I do like the 'idiot' set up whereby it auto sets input and monitors it + feedback suppression.

Yes, I think you see my dilemma and the balance between options are slim. My choice of mixer is probably leaning toward the A&H, more of a learning curve but greater flexibility. I'm also almost sure that I'll go QSC + sub, rather than x2 larger full range and no sub. The cost to the band will be diminished and theoretically it is almost as easy to transport 2 small tops and medium bin (the bin on a dolly need never be lifted higher than a car boot), than 2 larger tops. My band for the last 10 years has used a pair of 15" 7 series RCFs (with everything going through, for the last year or two) and it did OK but I was never happy with the vocal clarity/quality; part of my reasoning.

Absolutely but with consumer electronics being as cheap as this I'd envisage other frequencies will be migrated to and new Lekato (or similar) products will follow. I'm defo not saying that these units are the mutts nuts or of the exact same quality as say the Shure units... they aren't. However, if you are using them in pubs/clubs etc and you are ensuring you pack them away carefully after use, they do a job at less than a 1/10th of the price.