Small "Hifi" amp head recommendations sought!

[andyhaines]

Hey All,

 

Sadly my new PJB D400 is going back. Much as I love the open, clear "hifi" sound, the preamp section is just a bit too noisy for my fussy tastes - which becomes especially apparent when played through a high quality, revealing cab such as the LFSys Monza.

 

So the hunt is back on for a suitable head - here's what it needs to do:

*Easily fits into a gig/shoulder bag

* Doesn't need to be huge wattage (200+w) as the Monza does an astonishingly efficient job and I never play loud gigs.

* Transparent, hifi sounding - basically all the usual awful adjectives that get thrown around! I love the PJB sound but haven't really tried any other similar amps

* After my recent experience absolutely must have the lowest possible noise floor at both pre and power amp stages and through the DI

* FX Loop and pre/post DI

* Budget £450-£800

 

As with my "search for a cab" thread, I'm primarily playing Zon and Sei fretlesses with a touch of reverb for solo / small acousticy ensembles with the occasional theatre band pit and jazz gig thrown in. It will also be my main preamp for DI'ing into my PC for Zoom teaching online.

 

Aside from the PJB BP800, the only other likely candidate that looks promising see would be the Eich T300. I suspect I could be a Glockenklang fan but they don't yet make anything physically small enough.

 

But do please chip in with thoughts, experiences etc.

 

Thanks!

 

Andy

[Hellzero]

To date, the most transparent amp I've played is the GR Bass One series, but if you want to have the possibility to defeat the fan you'll have to choose the 800 version and use the studio mode.

 

Furthermore GR Bass are not "overpowering" their specified output power like Eich is doing, funnily they use the same ICE power module, but they don't use the same output power specs.

 

I've repaired a few Eich heads and there's a lot a bad marketing used to sell some bullshīt.

 

The TrickFish Bullhead mini 500 is the other transparent amp available (Mike Pope preamp inside).

 

Both are expensive, but worth a try.

 

Acoustic Image, Vanderkley and Hevos are also transparent amps, but the 3 brands are out of the market and you'll have to check the second hand market.

[pete.young]

I'm using a Euphonic Audio iAmp doubler with my Monza. It's very clear, but once again no longer available although they pop up second hand in the market place from time to time.

 

I also have a Walkabout Scout which is more old style than modern transparent, but does sound fantastic through the Monza with bass guitar - less so with double bass.

[andyhaines]

Thanks both for your very helpful comments! @Hellzero you mentioned that GR is not overpowering their specified output unlike the Eich - could you clarify? And what were the issues you found with the Eich heads that you've repaired? Do they have a reliability problem?

 

@pete.young I am indeed keeping an eye out for an EA iAamp - never tried one, but always felt it could be a good fit for me!

 

Cheers!

Andy

[Beedster]

11 hours ago, pete.young said:

I'm using a Euphonic Audio iAmp doubler with my Monza. It's very clear, but once again no longer available although they pop up second hand in the market place from time to time.

 

I also have a Walkabout Scout which is more old style than modern transparent, but does sound fantastic through the Monza with bass guitar - less so with double bass.

EA yes, but Walkabout transparent? 

[pete.young]

29 minutes ago, Beedster said:

EA yes, but Walkabout transparent? 

 

"more old style than modern transparent" not clear enough? Sorry. 

 

Walkabout Scout is not remotely transparent but sounds fantastic whatever you plug it into. Better?

[Linus27]

Would something like a MarkBass Nano tick enough boxes? Not sure how silent they are but my Little Mark IV is mega quiet and the sound is very transparent. As another fretless bassist, just throwing a suggestion out there but ignore if no good. Keep us updated on what you do decide on as I would be interested.

Edited 10 hours ago by Linus27

[andyhaines]

Thanks @Linus27 - I've never been a fan of the MB sound, but it could just be because I've only ever heard their combos or cabs which seem to make everything sound muffled (at least to me). The Nano certainly has the features and portability.

 

The biggest challenge I'm finding when doing youtube amp research is having to listen to a constant stream of slap demos - it gets wearing really quickly!

[Beedster]

58 minutes ago, pete.young said:

 

"more old style than modern transparent" not clear enough? Sorry. 

 

Walkabout Scout is not remotely transparent but sounds fantastic whatever you plug it into. Better?

Better yes 😁

 

In my defence Pete, OP did state transparent 👍

[Beedster]

1 hour ago, Beedster said:

Better yes 😁

 

In my defence Pete, OP did state transparent 👍

…and low fan noise 😀
 

Edit, ignore that, wrong thread, sorry 🤔

Edited 8 hours ago by Beedster

[Linus27]

28 minutes ago, andyhaines said:

Thanks @Linus27 - I've never been a fan of the MB sound, but it could just be because I've only ever heard their combos or cabs which seem to make everything sound muffled (at least to me). The Nano certainly has the features and portability.

 

The biggest challenge I'm finding when doing youtube amp research is having to listen to a constant stream of slap demos - it gets wearing really quickly!

 

As a fretless player as well, I play a lot of melodic bass lines around the 10th, 12th, 14th frets on the D and G strings so I need a lot of clarity for these melodies to be clear. I use two rigs, a LM IV through a Barefaced Two10 and the Warwick Gnome Ipro 300 through a TC208. The latter is a beautiful rig, crystal clear, small and lightweight. The only reason I didn't mention the Warwick head is I can't remember how silent it is but I'll check tonight and let you know.

 

As for my other rig, I totally understand what you are saying about MarkBass, I found the MB cabs to be exactly as you describe and got rid of mine when I had them some years back for those reasons. The heads however are super transparent and clear and I do very much like them. You'll notice a lot of electric Jazz bassists use them as they are very transparent. As for my Barefaced Two10 cab, its quite old school sounding so I'm looking at changing it for a LFSys cab.

 

As an example of my style, this is the sort of playing I do so you can hear from the start after the harmonics intro I am playing a lot of melody which needs to be super clear.

 

 

Edited 9 hours ago by Linus27

[Downunderwonder]

Quilter BassBlock is fully transparent at lower gain settings. 

[Hellzero]

I think transparent has not the same meaning to everyone, to me, it means, first of all, no compression and no signal modification or tone colouring.

 

The MarkBass heads are not transparent at all and have a huge emphasis in the low mids region and a tendency to compression.

 

The Quilter BassBlock is certainly not transparent at all and colouring the sound a lot with lot if compression when turning the master up.

 

Just like @Linus27 and you @andyhaines I'm a fretless player and like a dead flat tone coming from the amplification part, so I have tested as many amps as I could and often those upon recommendation were so disappointing as people ignore what transparency means.

 

The other thing that drives me mad is fan noise, so it has even narrowed the search a lot more, otherwise I would recommend instantly the Bugera Veyron 1001 M (not the T version).

 

I also like a cabinet to be as transparent as possible, hence the use of FRFR stuff over a quite long period.

 

Now, I'm not gigging anymore as the bass duet is over since March and, at 60 years old, I'm fed up by the musicians egocentric personality, so I now play through my soundcard into my calibrated speakers, which is the best tone I've ever had, but it also shows how bad most instruments are...

[Dan Dare]

The only way to find the amp that suits you is to take your cab(s) to a shop or two and try some out. You need to find the amp that makes the sound you like with your chosen instrument and cab, whether or not it's considered "hi-fi".

 

Unless an amp has no eq or it's eq can be switched completely out of circuit, you cannot be certain that it is "hi-fi" because you are hearing the designer's preferences even with eq set nominally flat. In my experience, bass amps claimed to be "hi-fi" tend to have slightly boosted lows and highs and a recessed midrange, which gives the impression of clarity, but isn't "hi-fi" in the true sense.

 

They sound great in the shop, home and studio at moderate volumes, but can tend to fall a bit flat in a live band context, unless they have enormous power on tap and you have some serious monitor-type cabs. Nothing like a bit of a low-mid bump to cut through a mix, hence the enduring popularity of the P bass.

[Hellzero]

The Eich BC112, rated at 300 Watts/4 Ohms, ICEpower module:

 

The GR Bass One 800 and Acoustic combo, rated at 800 Wattsm4 Ohms and even 1000 Watts/2.7 Ohms, ICEpower module:

 

And now the official data.

 

BC112: https://www.soundimports.eu/en/icepower-125asx2.html

 

One 800 and Acoustic combo: https://www.soundimports.eu/en/icepower-700as1.html

 

So what is happening with the Eich (Tech Soundsystems, Tec, TecAmp before that) is that players are pushing them to their limits, because they are way less powerful than what's been abusively announced and ... cooking them.

[andyhaines]

Thanks everyone- really useful. @Linus27: beautiful track and lovely playing. At the risk of derailing my own thread, what bass are you using there? The Gnomes look like amazing value for money, but heard they can also have hissing issues? (Plus they only have jack speaker sockets and my LFSys is speakon.)
 

@Dan Dare absolutely get it with shifting definitions of hiring. In terms of testing kit out, in the end until I get it home and live with it for a week I find it really hard to tell. Thomann’s 30 day return policy helps a lot here (as it did with Gear4Music with the PJB head, but they have a very limited range of bass heads).

 

And thanks @Hellzero for literally spilling the guts about what really goes on inside these things! And totally agree about the transparency thing.

[Linus27]

1 minute ago, andyhaines said:

Thanks everyone- really useful. @Linus27: beautiful track and lovely playing. At the risk of derailing my own thread, what bass are you using there? The Gnomes look like amazing value for money, but heard they can also have hissing issues? (Plus they only have jack speaker sockets and my LFSys is speakon.)
 

@Dan Dare absolutely get it with shifting definitions of hiring. In terms of testing kit out, in the end until I get it home and live with it for a week I find it really hard to tell. Thomann’s 30 day return policy helps a lot here (as it did with Gear4Music with the PJB head, but they have a very limited range of bass heads).

 

And thanks @Hellzero for literally spilling the guts about what really goes on inside these things! And totally agree about the transparency thing.

 

You are very welcome. I am using a 1987 Fender Japan 62RI Jazz Bass with Bartolini pickups and fretless Ebony board. I bought it new and it is the best sounding bass I have owned. It just sings and it beautiful to play. It is very beaten up as it has done thousands of gigs but has so much mojo. Its the one bass that will never leave me  As for the Warwick head, I'll check tonight and let you know. Its not something I've noticed and its the one head that has blown me away and I've stuck with. I've even considered replacing the Little Mark IV with the V2 of the 600w head, thats how impressed I've been with it but the Little Mark does do a really good job.

[Beedster]

9 minutes ago, andyhaines said:

Plus they only have jack speaker sockets and my LFSys is speakon.)

Mmm, that’s never stopped me 🙂

[andyhaines]

Anyone had an experience of the Bassics AH900 head?

https://www.bassdirect.co.uk/product/bassics-ah900/
 

looks interesting 

[Hellzero]

Frankly, @andyhaines, simply buy a Bugera Veyron 1001 M, it's the most transparent amp I have ever played, and if the fan noise is bothering you, simply put a Noctua ultra silent fan in it, job done.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bugera-VEYRON-MOSFET-BV1001M-Amplifier/dp/B00UD3J05A/

 

And then, you'll start your endless quest for the best amp suited to your tastes and have an excellent spare head.

[andyhaines]

It’s certainly a lot of bang for buck!

[Geek99]

What about a tc electronics bh250?