New Cab Day-LFSys Silverstone

[ebenezer]

How did it compare to the Barefaced cab?

[JohnDaBass]

4 hours ago, ebenezer said:

How did it compare to the Barefaced cab?

My main rig is 2 x Barefaced SCs with Mesa Subway D 800 or Fender Rumble HD 800. (So pretty much a BF Fanboi)

The sample music used for the shoot out was not pure bass guitar tones.

IMHO, to my 70 year old , tinnitus inflicted ears both the LFSys cabs appeared to sound fuller, richer and clearer than the Barefaced.

I did prefer the bigger bottom end from the lower powered (350w?  12Pr 320?) LFSys cab, it just seemed to suit my particular tone needs.

 

 

 

[ebenezer]

Cheers for that John.....that 12 pr 320 seems to be a killer driver.

[JohnDaBass]

9 minutes ago, ebenezer said:

Cheers for that John.....that 12 pr 320 seems to be a killer driver.

I am not sure that @stevie used the Fatial 12Pr 320 that was in the BC Mk3 cab. I saw @Chienmortbb did not commit to answering your question and left it for @stevie to confirm officially.

Now that the LFSys products are launched it maybe unwise to disclose publicly the precise model used in the cab system. Clearly there is a need for protecting LFSys IP.

Edited October 21, 2022 by JohnDaBass
spelling

[ebenezer]

Point taken, it was just an assumption......i am thinking about ordering one of the Silverstone cabs.

[Phil Starr]

6 hours ago, JohnDaBass said:

I am not sure that @stevie used the Fatial 12Pr 320 that was in the BC Mk3 cab. I saw @Chienmortbb did not commit to answering your question and left it for @stevie to confirm officially.

Now that the LFSys products are launched it maybe unwise to disclose publicly the precise model used in the cab system. Clearly there is a need for protecting LFSys IP.

Hi John, I can confirm that the Silverstone is using the Faital 320 and the same horn driver as the Mk3 BassChat design, where it differs is in having a nicer and more expensive horn flare and a lot of work on the crossover especially around looking at phase issues.

 

You are also spot on about the relative sound of the Silverstone to the more expensive LFSys speaker which I hadn't heard before the Bass Bash. I'd love to try that at a gig but at the test the Silverstone hit the sweet spot for me too, the bass has a lovely warmth to it without being overpowering. The shootout wasn't a scientific process, I hadn't time to set up the levels beforehand and I didn't know what speakers I was going to be testing before the day, I just grabbed four of the 'best' speakers in the room. It would also have been interesting to have had a live bassist but I was stuck with something I downloaded from You Tube. It wasn't definitive but i hope it was fun and at least a little bit informative. 

[Phil Starr]

Ok I think it is time I contributed my experiences using the Silverstone as I've been trying prototypes out during the development, watched the design process and listened to a lot of variants during the cab's evolution.

 

So most of you will know that Stevie and I were involved in the Bass Chat DIY designs from the start. We've had some fairly intense 'discussions' through the process which I've thoroughly enjoyed even when it has got quite heated For the record I was quite interested in designing coloured/voiced cabs and Stevie was the proponent of FRFR. To be fair I think both of us were devil's advocates for each approach.

 

Anyway on to the cab. First of all it looks great, really solidly made and the handles are not going to come off these cabs   It's a deep graphite grey rather than black and the green front panel behind the black grille subtly marks it out as something just a little different.  The cab is an easy carry for me, I'm 70 years old and a lightweight myself and I have no trouble carrying one of these in each hand. Not the lightest 12 I've ever lifted but an easy lift due to its two neo drivers.

 

So coming on to the sound, I've had the usual history of cabs starting out with a Peavey 2x15 then a series of quite deliberately coloured cabs of my own design. I quite like a coloured cab, plug and play appeals to my lazy side. Asking me to test out an FRFR speaker was an interesting choice and an interesting experience for me. Recently though with my duo I've scrapped the backline and gone through the PA. Playing through the Silverstone is not like playing through a PA speaker on the floor. The PA speakers are designed to be up on stands and on the floor the bass is woolly and needs to be rolled back, up on stands you can get a great sound though. I've also compared the Silverstones with my RCF ART745's and the bass quality is cleaner. My suspicion is that injection moulded cabs just can't match a decently braced wooden cab but I guess that would need a bit more investigation. Plugging in the Silverstones don't sound hi-fi to my ears there's no extreme top end sparkle or overwarm bass and they don't sound soulless either (all accusations against FRFR generally) . What they do remind me of is the first time I heard what I'd recorded at a studio through the big monitors. Clean, lots of detail and definitely my bass and my strings. Swapping from my American Deluxe P bass to my Highway 1 J bass was interesting too. I tend to use the Jazz with my duo but find too much deep bass and too little punch compared to the P when I take it out with the full band somehow the mids are just a bit more present with my J using the Silverstone, the bass more controlled. It's not dramatic but definitely happening. You can hear the difference.

 

At first band rehearsal I set up with my Warwick Gnome, it was comfortably loud enough even when the drummer went for it. Interestingly I set up the balance to my normal level and the band asked me to turn up. I wandered out front and they were right, the bass was well back in the mix even though everything was crystal clear back in front of the cab. I turned up until it sounded OK out front and the band were happy. Back by the speaker it was loud but to be fair not so loud I lost what the rest of the band were doing. I've had the same at gigs and other rehearsals and I've now had to adapt to having more bass guitar in my corner. I've readjusted to feeling my trousers moving but not being deafened.

 

I've now gigged with the Silverstone a few times and it has changed my playing. First of all I've spent a lot of time  on my sound, plugging in my BD121 brought my bass alive rather than just adding a subtle bloom with my older speakers. I've set up my Jazz bass much more carefully with a Hartke emulator (I miss my old HA3500) and a bit of compression which works well with the band. and at home I'm experimenting more with fx because now I can hear the changes it's just more rewarding to spend time on getting them right. When I'm playing live I'm just hearing more of what I'm doing so I'm self-correcting more. Paying more attention to note lengths/string damping and so on. Did I mention I'm a messy player  

 

The difference is in the mids, they are just cleaner, better off axis, no mid suck out and no upper mid peak. Balancing the upper and lower mids  really works. There's no tizz from the tweeter either. You don't really notice it because it's nicely integrated with the bass driver, there's no point where you suddenly hear it jump out at you. 

 

The overall impression of this speaker is about cleanness and clarity. It makes you bass sound like a bass and hands you control. Because it isn't forcing its sound on you it frees you up to create the sound you want. Am I a convert to FRFR? Well I'd still be happy to play through an old Trace Combo and enjoy it for what it offers but if you had to have just one cab this might just be the one. It's the best FRFR cab so far and the big advantage is that it would be easier to make this sound like a Trace than the other way round.

 

 

Edited December 18, 2022 by Phil Starr

[stevie]

Nice reviews, guys, thanks. The cheque's in the post. 😄

 

Couple of things. The driver is indeed the Faital Pro 12PR320. All the drivers I use are standard drivers selected from the top manufacturers. This means that you'll be able to easily get spares in ten or twenty years time even if you're in Australia.

 

On the handle issue, I agree that there's nothing worse than an amp wobbling on top of a speaker cab. However, the LFSys handle extends just 6.5mm from the top of the cabinet. That's not a lot. The smallest standard feet with screws fitted to amps are 9mm high. Even the cheap stick-on ones on my Ashdown RM500 are 8.5mm. So it's unlikely your amp will wobble.

[Chienmortbb]

1 hour ago, stevie said:

e reviews, guys, thanks. The cheque's in the post.

You know there is a postal strike, don't you? Seriously though. I was quite happy with my BC112 MK3, but having tried the Silverstone, it was clearly a next step development. I am really fickle, and it was the looks that made me think about the change first. Then? Everything clicked. 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2022 by Chienmortbb

[Mykesbass]

Great review and a fabulous looking cab. Congratulations to all involved. @steviereading your website, what was the name of your MI distribution company? I'm wondering if our paths crossed during my short tenure as owner of the Guitar Shop in Ipswich.

[stevie]

It depends when your short tenure was, @Mykesbass. 🙂 The Guitar Shop doesn't ring a bell but it's not exactly a name that sticks in your mind. I've sent you a pm.

[Chienmortbb]

On 27/10/2022 at 06:50, Mykesbass said:

Great review and a fabulous looking cab. Congratulations to all involved. @steviereading your website, what was the name of your MI distribution company? I'm wondering if our paths crossed during my short tenure as owner of the Guitar Shop in Ipswich.

To be fair, they are all @stevie's work. As I understand it, a few people were asked to test early versions, and @Phil Starrordered one early on. However, all the clever stuff was @stevie

[Phil Starr]

Just an interesting aside really. I ordered a second Silverstone as I'd decided two 1x12"s were my dream rig. Stevie delivered it this week and we had a bit of a session with all things bass speaker. He was just leaving and on impulse I unplugged my bass and tried my acoustic guitar and strummed a few chords. I'm no guitarist but the sound was glorious (It's a Takamine with some light Elixirs fitted) lovely warm sound with a really musical top end.

 

I have to say this was as good an acoustic guitar sound as through my RCF PA. I imagine it would do as an all round guitar speaker if you use a modeller with an acoustic amp. The advantage of that really sweet mid-range response.

[Mykesbass]

21 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

Just an interesting aside really. I ordered a second Silverstone as I'd decided two 1x12"s were my dream rig. Stevie delivered it this week and we had a bit of a session with all things bass speaker. He was just leaving and on impulse I unplugged my bass and tried my acoustic guitar and strummed a few chords. I'm no guitarist but the sound was glorious (It's a Takamine with some light Elixirs fitted) lovely warm sound with a really musical top end.

 

I have to say this was as good an acoustic guitar sound as through my RCF PA. I imagine it would do as an all round guitar speaker if you use a modeller with an acoustic amp. The advantage of that really sweet mid-range response.

Do love my 2  1x12s, although very different on style to yours (quite coloured I'd imagine - Purple Chili). 

 

I have found that acoustic guitar through bass amp/speakers sounds way better than through an electric guitar amp, even without the near PA quality of your speakers.

[Phil Starr]

2 hours ago, Mykesbass said:

Do love my 2  1x12s, although very different on style to yours (quite coloured I'd imagine - Purple Chili). 

 

I have found that acoustic guitar through bass amp/speakers sounds way better than through an electric guitar amp, even without the near PA quality of your speakers.

I think that's right, by and large bass gear if it is coloured (most of it is) has a smiley face/loudness contour which just sounds kind of 'normal' to us and which our brain processes really well. Guitar amps and speakers often have an upper mid boost if they are designed for electric guitar. I spent ages persuading my duo partner to switch from his horrible sounding guitar amp to using the floor monitors for his acoustic.

 

 

[stevie]

LFSys speakers were designed principally for use with bass guitar, but I spent a lot of time developing the crossovers, testing and retesting, and making sure that the LF and HF drivers worked seamlessly together. This involved many hundreds of frequency measurements of different types, although the acid test of any of the various designs was always how well they reproduced male and female voice. I hadn't thought of these cabs as something for acoustic guitar but I can see why they would work. I do know they sound great with keyboards and as an FRFR cab for electric guitar. I guess they could well be a one-cab solution for multi-instrumentalists.

[LukeFRC]

On 26/10/2022 at 15:14, Chienmortbb said:

You know there is a postal strike, don't you? Seriously though. I was quite happy with my BC112 MK3, but having tried the Silverstone, it was clearly a next step development. I am really fickle, and it was the looks that made me think about the change first. Then? Everything clicked. 

 

 

I love my BCcab and have in the past compared it to the equivalent  cab design ethos model  made in Brighton and much preferred the BCcab

 

comparing the BCcab to the silverstone I was amazed how much difference and how much nicer Stevies evolution of the design was. Purely subjectively it’s just sounded nicer and more musical in the upper mids and a smoother response.

 

Another big difference, I run a colour box v2 at the end of my pedal chain, lovely pedal at low gain for bass but turn it up too loud and it goes from fuzz to some awful square wave sound of something clipping horribly - BCcab it’s ice picks aimed at your head, LFSys was more in control and just sounded a bit nasty. 
 

I’m probably an odd use case for a bass cab as I play a lot straight into a PA - what the LFSYS does is set my effects pedals (HX stomp up to recently) and then know that that tone via the pa was going to be fairly similar ish 
 

[JohnDaBass]

On 18/11/2022 at 10:06, Phil Starr said:

Just an interesting aside really. I ordered a second Silverstone as I'd decided two 1x12"s were my dream rig. 

Why do you feel you need 2 Silverstones?

How do you plan to use both, will you be switching off the horn on one of the cabs or stacking the top cab upside down?

[Phil Starr]

1 hour ago, JohnDaBass said:

Why do you feel you need 2 Silverstones?

How do you plan to use both, will you be switching off the horn on one of the cabs or stacking the top cab upside down?

OK I'll confess it's a vanity project, GAS or inertia depending upon your point of view. 

 

I've been giving the same advice for several years that one good 12 would be loud enough for almost everything and two would cover every possible eventuality. I decided to take my own advice and go for two 1x12's For years I've been taking all sorts of half complete prototypes to gigs and the band were beginning to get more functions so I wanted to up my game by  having a consistent and good looking rig. I was going to build two BassChat Mk3's and ordered the crossover components from @stevie  He wanted me to trial the Silverstones which use the same drivers so we did a deal to use the drivers I already had and he would build me the case and crossover .

 

I've also sold my old passive PA and have no passive speakers but retain the amps so I have top hat mounts in my Silverstones so they can double as a PA if I ever have problems. Ironically the band have now moved to in-ears and may be losing the backline altogether so no bass amp might become my normal. I'm convincing myself that any working bassist needs a decent amp and speakers 'just in case'

[Phil Starr]

1 hour ago, JohnDaBass said:

 

How do you plan to use both, will you be switching off the horn on one of the cabs or stacking the top cab upside down?

The only time I imagine I'll use the pair is at small beer festivals which are pretty common down here in the summer. Not all of them are equally well run  PA support can be a bit iffy so I'll just stack them and not worry. I've tried them like that and it's all good. Better than my playing anyway!

[scrumpymike]

In case anyone on here is interested, just posted a review of my LFSys Monaco, which I believe is the first-off production cab.

[LukeFRC]

It’s alright @scrumpymike, I’ve got your back and will do the link thing 

 

[tubbybloke68]

These look fantastic! Well done to all involved.Are there any plans for a 2x10 with a tweeter? Hope so. 
Best regards, jeff 

[stevie]

Thanks, Jeff. There are quite a few LFSys cabs in the pipeline. The next one will be a 1x10. So, yes, it's reasonable to expect a 2x10 some time in the future.

Edited December 16, 2022 by stevie

[bartelby]

Quite a few you say…

 

a 15” based cab, by any chance?