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JohnA

Is a 1x10 cab enough?

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On 28/06/2019 at 10:22, JohnA said:

The Ampeg brings simplicity which I really like about it, I do have a HK 12" active sitting in the garage, I'll give that a bash.  Just sold a Yamha DXR10, that might have done the job, but really like the idea of a 'proper amp and cab' for bass

I think you've answered your own question. You fancy a proper amp and cab. You want to use your Ampeg. Buy a good quality 8ohm speaker based on whether you like how it sounds. If you like it but need more volume go and buy another at a later date. If you end up using the Helix and FRFR more than the 'proper' bass setup then you can sell the bits you don't use. Used gear means you'll spend very little whilst you find what works for you. It sounds like you have enough active gear to at least find out what FRFR will do for you sound wise and you know it from your guitar work.

The theory behind using 8 ohms is simple. The output of a speaker is usually limited by the heat dispersion of the speaker and crucially the excursion. If you are driving the speaker into distortion with bass then it is ultimately going to fail. Your amp is going to drive your speaker as loud as it will go whether it is 8ohm or 4ohm. Even if all the power at 4ohms was available to you it would only give you between 1and 2dB extra anyway, and in most cases it isn't. Adding a second 8ohm driver increases the efficiency of the system and will give you 4-5db extra, which you will notice.

FWIW I use both methods depending upon the band I'm playing with. One 12 with a bass amp for my covers bands, two when the venue is bigger and FRFR with my duo. RCF ART10's both as floor monitors and for FOH. I also have a 1x10 Kickback combo, it's only loud enough as a personal monitor  but It's my favourite solution if I have PA support and it does get the stage levels down.

 

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I have an Eden 1x10 that does a close enuff in character thing to my Nemesis 410, which is !!!!!!!

Let me know if you fancy it

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2 hours ago, Thornybank said:

I have an Eden 1x10 that does a close enuff in character thing to my Nemesis 410, which is !!!!!!!

Let me know if you fancy it

Drop me a pm with details if you would.  Cheers

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@JohnA Tech21 VT bass deluxe is an excellent Ampeg SVT/810 and B-15 simulator - plus you get DI out and an additional uncoloured output. Worth giving a go through your HK active 12".

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2 hours ago, Kevsy71 said:

@JohnA Tech21 VT bass deluxe is an excellent Ampeg SVT/810 and B-15 simulator - plus you get DI out and an additional uncoloured output. Worth giving a go through your HK active 12".

My Helix has some great bass models in there too, just want to keep it real with a head and cab for bass, gone all hi tech with guitar.  I might end up using a modeller, but really like my Ampeg pf350 so would like to use it :)

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PF350 ideal for it.

My pf800 sounds choice in it - but can't max it, of course.

I also have a Fender Rumble 12 that would take the PF.

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Just to close this one out.  Got myself a Barefaced one10 and it’s enough!  Absolutely astounded by the volume and bottom end from something so small.  Love it!

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3 hours ago, JohnA said:

Just to close this one out. . . . . . 

Not yet.

When another One10 comes up in the classifieds, get it. If you think 1 sounds good 2 will be really make you smile.

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Ask your drummer. If he says no, that means you have a drummer and that means he was right.

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6 hours ago, chris_b said:

Not yet.

When another One10 comes up in the classifieds, get it. If you think 1 sounds good 2 will be really make you smile.

Really don’t think I’ll need a second, but never say never

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42 minutes ago, JohnA said:

Really don’t think I’ll need a second, but never say never

Maybe not for the volume, but a second cab gives you a big step forward in the tone.

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1 hour ago, chris_b said:

Maybe not for the volume, but a second cab gives you a big step forward in the tone.

That's it, nailed. I've played through a Barefaced 110 and it is very impressive, BUT it's still a very small box with one small driver in it. To get to drummer level it has to be driven to the max and that deletes all possibility of tone shaping.
IMO this pursuit of small and light has gone too far. We check the frequency response taken on axis at low input levels and it's impressive. Drive it hard and that's nowhere near what you get.
As a guide I reckon if the guitar can run a 110 combo, you probably need a 210 or even 212 to have real tonal shaping and the transient dynamics of a bass. Probably at least 4 times the watts too.
The good thing is start with one, then add...

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Cheers guys, will see how I get on.  As you say it's good to have the option of adding another, and it's still a tiny rig with 2 cabs

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9 hours ago, chris_b said:

Not yet.

When another One10 comes up in the classifieds, get it. If you think 1 sounds good 2 will be really make you smile.

Yes, the improvement (in what is already a good sound) is really noticeable at all volumes with a pair.

Frank.

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I used a 8omh 1x10 and a 250w head with an upright bass in jazz band situations where everyone is playing fairly quietly ... (at least to max brass volume).

plenty of power in this situation and could be the loudest instrument apart from the drums if I was distasteful 

Any louder and I have to add another cab or move on to bigger cab combos.

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I bought two Elf 10" cabs to go with the Elf amp, and the last three gigs I took only one cab, due to laziness, and it was more than enough. The sound guy loved the Elf's DI so I had PA support at one of the gigs. Carried the room just fine at the others, small clubs.

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I currently have the Eden Terra Nova 110 cab you mentioned, 4 ohm and 300watts. It's a great minimalist unit, extremely well made ported light plywood cab and the electrics are very high quality. So far, its performed as well as a Barefaced one ten I owned a few years back(now sold on). I use mine with a WTX264 and occasionally at noisier rehearsals with a Trace Elliot GP7 SM150. It seems to work much better with the Trace at volume. The cab puts out some serious lows at decent (clean) medium volumes. I've personally gone back to a reasonably good 1x15 for gigging as my experiences with a 1x10 cab on its own just didn't cut it for loud rock. I'm lucky that I have multiple cabs to choose from but if I could only have one, I'd prefer a good 1x15 even if it means a bit more pain lugging it about. 2x10's are also a good 'one cab' option worth thinking about and there's plenty to choose from these days. 

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Posted (edited)

I have a pair of Barefaced One10s. It’s never not been enough 😊

Edited by CamdenRob

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5 hours ago, dangoose said:

I currently have the Eden Terra Nova 110 cab you mentioned, ....

Got a barefaced one ten in the end and I’m very happy with it, those eden’s are cheap though and a 4 ohm cab would have been a good option, double the weight of the bf though

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1 hour ago, CamdenRob said:

I have a pair of Barefaced One10s. It’s never not been enough 😊

Think a second may be on the cards ;)

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On 13/07/2019 at 14:11, bazzbass said:

I bought two Elf 10" cabs to go with the Elf amp, and the last three gigs I took only one cab, due to laziness, and it was more than enough. The sound guy loved the Elf's DI so I had PA support at one of the gigs. Carried the room just fine at the others, small clubs.

That’s exactly what I do except a MarkBass LM3. The Trace 1x10 is more than enough for onstage and the PA handles the rest. Great cabs.

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Here's a clip from last night's pub gig: Bruce Thomas P -> Quilter Bass Block -> One10 + Line out to PA. One10 is nestled in a fireplace!

 

Band is drums, keys, sax, rhythym guitar. Drums are a folding Traps set so quieter than a full set, and we were quiet enough that people could still talk at the bar, but loud enough that we had dancing! :)

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