Wal/Jazz mongrel

[silverfoxnik]

[quote name='White Cloud' timestamp='1386792581' post='2304715']

You sir, are a gentleman.
[/quote]

+1

[Roland Rock]

[quote name='White Cloud' timestamp='1386792581' post='2304715']
You sir, are a gentleman.
[/quote]
Ha, cheers.
Beedster, it was a serious offer - look, I pulled out a wenge board today - 5ft x 7in x 2in
Nipping a bit off the end is no trouble. Let me know..

Edited December 13, 2013 by Roland Rock

[White Cloud]

[quote name='Roland Rock' timestamp='1386956204' post='2306853']
Ha, cheers.
Beedster, it was a serious offer - look, I pulled out a wenge board today - 5ft x 7in x 2in
Nipping a bit off the end is no trouble. Let me know..


[/quote]
Wow, that is a serious Wenge Board indeed!

[Beedster]

Roland, that's extremely kind of you, many thanks.

It looks like Bass Doc is going to be doing the work for me. At present this is going to include

1. New unlined ebony board with side lines at each fret
2. New PUPs (this is going to be a big issue......)
3. Restore as far as possible the facade of the bass to something like original

I don't know how much Wenge costs but I am imagine it's not cheap so I'm very grateful and would like to take you up on it. If you won't take anything from me for it please let me bung a few quid at a charity of your choice? If ot's OK, I'll PM you once I've sorted everything with Howard? Many thanks.

Now PUPs, what do you folk think? Here's some things to keep in mind

1. I was never a great fan of the Wal circuit or sound
2. I like passive instruments
3. I have a fretless Precision so there is little need for anything that sounds Precisiony!
4. One of my favourite fretless sounds was a Ric with very heavy nylon flats. Problem is, that did one sound and one sound only

I was looking at things such as Darkstars and am keen to explore these http://lhnborn.com/page3.htm, which sound lovely with flats (waiting for a soundclip with rounds). I'm also keen on some passive MM style humbuckers (although I'd also tempted to get an East circuit in there just in case!). I've contacted Paul at Wal re PUPs but I've yet to hear back (something that was pointed out to me earlier was that if Wal do the work the instrument will retain some authenticity, but I'm thinking a lot of work would be required to get it to that stage and I suspect that a new build would make more sense. There's also the real risk this bass could end up like Trigger's broom in Only Fools and Horses). I've also looked at Martin Simm's Super Quads which I have to say might be the safest bet all around, unfortunately they don't retro fit the Super 8 which I would have loved in this bass.

Your thoughts on PUPs would be appreciated. I don't see this as a restoration project as much as an opportunity to build a unique bespoke instrument, albeit one with a vintage pedigree.

Cheers

Chris

PS thanks again Roland!

[Roland Rock]

No worries - PM me with dimensions and address (either you or direct to Bass Doc) when you're ready.
Can't help on pups I'm afraid. Looking forward to seeing the finished article

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='eude' timestamp='1386670383' post='2302753']
I did cringe a little when I saw whats been done to that bass, but at the end of the day, they're for playing, not looking at, so whatever works for you is the right thing.
If I was you, I would go for a pickguard to hide the wood insert, with the best intentions, wood stain wood help, but it'll never be a perfect match.
Some of the old Wal pickguards are big enough to hide a multitude of sins, and I'm sure Bass Doc could design up something sympathetic of the original Wal style pickguard that is adapted to hide the grizzly bits...

Something like this example below, with similar pickup locations wouldn't be too far off the mark and could be made with black plastic



Anyway, best of luck with it, I look forward to seeing how it all turns out!

Eude
[/quote]
Nice colour.

[Dingus]

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1386959870' post='2306920']
Nice colour.
[/quote]

I don't like green basses as a rule, but that does indeed have a charm to it. The used to do a burst version of that geen , too, that Pete used to call "snotburst".

[Dingus]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1386958037' post='2306885']
Roland, that's extremely kind of you, many thanks.

It looks like Bass Doc is going to be doing the work for me. At present this is going to include

1. New unlined ebony board with side lines at each fret
2. New PUPs (this is going to be a big issue......)
3. Restore as far as possible the facade of the bass to something like original

I don't know how much Wenge costs but I am imagine it's not cheap so I'm very grateful and would like to take you up on it. If you won't take anything from me for it please let me bung a few quid at a charity of your choice? If ot's OK, I'll PM you once I've sorted everything with Howard? Many thanks.

Now PUPs, what do you folk think? Here's some things to keep in mind

1. I was never a great fan of the Wal circuit or sound
2. I like passive instruments
3. I have a fretless Precision so there is little need for anything that sounds Precisiony!
4. One of my favourite fretless sounds was a Ric with very heavy nylon flats. Problem is, that did one sound and one sound only

I was looking at things such as Darkstars and am keen to explore these [url="http://lhnborn.com/page3.htm"]http://lhnborn.com/page3.htm[/url], which sound lovely with flats (waiting for a soundclip with rounds). I'm also keen on some passive MM style humbuckers (although I'd also tempted to get an East circuit in there just in case!). I've contacted Paul at Wal re PUPs but I've yet to hear back (something that was pointed out to me earlier was that if Wal do the work the instrument will retain some authenticity, but I'm thinking a lot of work would be required to get it to that stage and I suspect that a new build would make more sense. There's also the real risk this bass could end up like Trigger's broom in Only Fools and Horses). I've also looked at Martin Simm's Super Quads which I have to say might be the safest bet all around, unfortunately they don't retro fit the Super 8 which I would have loved in this bass.

Your thoughts on PUPs would be appreciated. I don't see this as a restoration project as much as an opportunity to build a unique bespoke instrument, albeit one with a vintage pedigree.

Cheers

Chris

PS thanks again Roland!
[/quote]

Regarding the pickups, if you like the ( now very hard to get hold of) Dark Stars, have you considered the Hanson/Lakland Chi Sonics ? They are loosely based on the Dark Stars , but they sound slightly more open in the midrange , with a similar mixture of vintage warmth and hifi clarity to the sound , kind of a supercharged passive pickup. They are available in a number of case sizes, now including regular Jazz pickup size, so you could use the existing routes , or a humbucker sized casing in chrome or plastic if you prefer that look on a Wal body , and they sound unique. You can hear them on the audio samples page on the Lakland website and compare them to a regular Jazz pickup. The difference is very apparent.

I love the Dark Stars , too, but they are changing hands for silly money now, and they can be difficult to adjust properly. It is a mystery to me why some major pickup manufacturer hasn't licensed the design and isn't knocking out a version of those pickups , because they would sell loads of them .

[Beedster]

I'm doing a lot of thinking about this! I've decided to hang onto my '78 maple board fretless Precision which has the flatwound P-Bass retro thing covered. PUP-wise on the Wal I'm going to be looking for an active option likely with rounds in mind. I'm tempted to go for a single MM-style humbucker at the bridge and an East circuit, or possibly an HS. Thoughts?

[White Cloud]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1387143764' post='2308760']
I'm doing a lot of thinking about this! I've decided to hang onto my '78 maple board fretless Precision which has the flatwound P-Bass retro thing covered. PUP-wise on the Wal I'm going to be looking for an active option likely with rounds in mind. I'm tempted to go for a single MM-style humbucker at the bridge and an East circuit, or possibly an HS. Thoughts?
[/quote]
I'm not the best person to ask about electrics and pickups to be honest. I do however believe that a Wal should only have Wal pickups & electrics - but appreciate that is not the direction you want to go for obvious reasons.

I personally really, really like the sound and tone that a couple of Overwater's that I have heard recently possess. I may be wrong but I believe the pre is produced by John East? Perhaps this is an option?

[mikeswals]

White Cloud, he would have an impossible time even IF he wanted the Wal pickups and circuit. Wal absolutely will not sell those components. They have stood their ground on that for many years now, despite the couple folks who bought stripped down basses were refused replacement electronics.
A Sting-Wal would be a cool resto-mod . Look at this rare odd, apparently factory made MkI with a single pickup in the 'StingRay' position and not in ether Wal position.

[leftyhook]

immense dismay......... the very thought............ !!!!!!!!!

[Owen]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1386961827' post='2306970']


Regarding the pickups, if you like the ( now very hard to get hold of) Dark Stars, have you considered the Hanson/Lakland Chi Sonics ? They are loosely based on the Dark Stars , but they sound slightly more open in the midrange , with a similar mixture of vintage warmth and hifi clarity to the sound , kind of a supercharged passive pickup. They are available in a number of case sizes, now including regular Jazz pickup size, so you could use the existing routes.
[/quote]

Not wanting to hijack the thread, but could you link me to where I might buy a set of J Chi Sonics?

[Dingus]

[quote name='owen' timestamp='1387150507' post='2308870']
Not wanting to hijack the thread, but could you link me to where I might buy a set of J Chi Sonics?
[/quote]

Hi Owen

I can't post a link right now, but if you go to www.hansonpickups.com and then get the contact information and send an email the Bo Pirrucello will get right back to you with up-to-date information and prices and shipping info ect. . The website is a bit lacking in information in certain respects , but there is also a Facebook page dedicated to with the latest info on though Chi Sonic pickups, so it is worth having a look at that, too. Bo is a very nice chap and responds very quickly in my experience. The newest version of the J Sonics in Jazz Bass -sized cases have got black covers and look identical from the outside to the Jazz Bass pickups on the 44-02 and 44-94 basses. I know they had a couple of sets with very slight blemishes on that they were selling off cheap recently, if you are interested.

[Beedster]

[quote name='mikeswals' timestamp='1387147624' post='2308821']
Look at this rare odd, apparently factory made MkI with a single pickup in the 'StingRay' position and not in ether Wal position.
[/quote]

I like that, and I also like single PUP instruments generally

[Matt Golgotha]

Hey Chris - might be worth you looking into Q-tuner pickups - I have some of their BS jazz bass pickups mated up to an East J-retro (with S-1 style mod). Might get you near to that open growly Wal sound - though to be honest I had a noodle on a Wal Custom last saturday and think I might need one

[Beedster]

Thanks for your input folks. I've given this project - especially the PUPs - a lot of thought, and I've come to the conclusion that I need one thing and one thing only, versatility

OK, joking aside, what I want tone-wise now may not be what I want tone-wise in 5 years or even next year, so I will be essentially looking for

2 PUPs
Active circuit
Wal-like aesthetic (i.e., humbuckers, ideally black)
Relatively low cost (£400 total)

Thoughts?

C

Edited December 18, 2013 by Beedster

[Owen]

I am in the process of changing a single pickup instrument into a double pickup. I wanted the best of both worlds so have gone for 2 x humbucker pickup covers with 1 x J and half a P in each. They are mounted fairly close together and that way I can get either 2 x J, 1 x J or P options running.

Just an idea.

[Beedster]

[quote name='owen' timestamp='1387354641' post='2310922']
I am in the process of changing a single pickup instrument into a double pickup. I wanted the best of both worlds so have gone for 2 x humbucker pickup covers with 1 x J and half a P in each. They are mounted fairly close together and that way I can get either 2 x J, 1 x J or P options running.

Just an idea.
[/quote]

Interesting idea Owen, but the PUPs would surely have to be extremely close together to get a decent PBass tone (even reversing the order of the two PBass PUPs so that the treble side is closer to the bridge than the bass side makes a substantial difference to the tone)? Will having them that close give you sufficient separation for the J-PUPs to give a true J-Bass tone. I guess what I'm asking is whether it allow any of the PUPs to sit in their respective sweet spot?

Having said the above, who's making them for you, I'd like to see how they look?

C

[Owen]

Aaron Armstrong made them. They are just a couple of MM5 shells, because the one which was in there already was an MM5. The J ones should be in where they need to be. The P will be slightly spaced out and it is an experiment but it will work, even if it is not "pure P". I have put an Armstrong P5 into my MTD Kingston which is in the MM spot, and in the thick of a live band I have not felt that the position being a few mm to the left of where it "should" be is an issue and it still does "P".

I was originally going to put one big cover in with multiple magnet options in there but because the original rout was MM5 with ears it would have to have been the size of a bus to cover all the holes. If you are putting a new block of wood in the middle, then you could put a large one piece cover in - like the monsters you were considering earlier, just with your own configuration in there.

[Beedster]

[quote name='owen' timestamp='1387357899' post='2310951']
Aaron Armstrong made them. They are just a couple of MM5 shells, because the one which was in there already was an MM5. The J ones should be in where they need to be. The P will be slightly spaced out and it is an experiment but it will work, even if it is not "pure P". I have put an Armstrong P5 into my MTD Kingston which is in the MM spot, and in the thick of a live band I have not felt that the position being a few mm to the left of where it "should" be is an issue and it still does "P".

I was originally going to put one big cover in with multiple magnet options in there but because the original rout was MM5 with ears it would have to have been the size of a bus to cover all the holes. If you are putting a new block of wood in the middle, then you could put a large one piece cover in - like the monsters you were considering earlier, just with your own configuration in there.
[/quote]

Very interesting, another option to add to the mix, many thanks Owen. Seasons greetings to you also mate
C

[chardbass]

I love this thread.

[Beedster]

[quote name='chardbass' timestamp='1387363052' post='2311025']
I love this thread.
[/quote]

It's gonna cost me isn't it...?

[philw]

[quote name='chardbass' timestamp='1387363052' post='2311025']
I love this thread.
[/quote]

Me too.

I also love that fretless single pickup Wal. I too have great memories of a visit to Wal and Pete doing a service and set-up on my Mk 1 Custom (Pete was reluctant to take any money off me and I had almost to force £20 (I think) on him).

And yes, High Wycombe was the centre of the UK furniture industry right up to the point when we all fell in love with crap from MFI and then Ikea - that all but ripped the heart out of the town. I worked in the UK hi-fi speaker industry in the 80s and vast numbers of the speaker cabinets for all the big brands at the time; KEF, Mordaunt-Short (who I worked for), Mission, Celestion, B&W, etc. etc. were made in High Wycombe.

Phil

[HowieBass]

The first thing I thought of when I saw the paler wood inset in your Wal was maybe adding a large ramp in wenge with two pickups concealed inside it...