Mornats Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Someone please de-GAS me... I'm constantly looking around for a decent head/cab or combo but I really don't think I need one. I'm not gigging, I'm not in a band and I primarily record stuff using a Guitar Rig Session interface and Guitar Rig amp software. Somehow I just feel like I need an amp. I do have a 15w practice amp which is fine for noodling around on but I'd never be able to do a band practice or gig with it (if I ever did start playing live). I've got my eye on an Ashdown EB12-180 and was thinking of buying new so that's around £270 or so. Ideally I'd trade in my Bass Collection SB315 for one (with some cash, depending on trade-in value). Trouble is, without actually being in a band or gigging I have no idea of my requirements. Best to leave it until I know what I need? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musky Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) Are you at the point where you're considering joining a band, or have the prospect of jamming with others? If not I'd say you don't actually need another amp and the little practice sounds fine for your purposes. If you've got a long term aim of eventually joining a band, start putting by a little cash aside for the day when you actually need something bigger. Until then hang on to your 315. Edited March 24, 2012 by Musky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjones Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Don't buy new if you don't need to. There's usually plenty of Ashdown EB amps either on here, ebay or gumtree for around the £100 mark. Great little amps by the way and plenty loud enough for whatever gigs you throw at them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 25, 2012 Author Share Posted March 25, 2012 Cheers guys, I hoped that I'd get some sensible advice, I'll definitely wait. I'd love a MarkBass setup for the weight of them so best get saving just in case I need one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 29, 2012 Author Share Posted March 29, 2012 Ha, well would you believe it. A few days after posting this I stumbled across a drummer and guitarist practising at a pub and may be joining them to see how it turns out. Gonna try my little Laney RB1 (15w!) to see how it copes but I can borrow a Laney Linebacker 100w amp if needed. I'll take it from there and see what I end up needing! Got my eye on a few EB-180s on Ebay but saw this for £229 new which is a bargain: [url="http://www.kennysmusic.co.uk/backline/bass-amps/ashdown-electric-blue-12180-bass-combo.html"]http://www.kennysmusic.co.uk/backline/bass-amps/ashdown-electric-blue-12180-bass-combo.html[/url]. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) I wouldn't waster your time with the 15 watt practice amp against a guitarist, let alone a drummer! I've struggled with more than 100 watts in that sort of setting in the past. 200 odd quid should get you something more substantial than the EB on the 2nd hand market. You're getting into 300 watt trace elliot/Ashdown MAG combo territory there! Reading back through 3 or 4 pages of for sale ads on here you could put together a rig that'd do everything you're ever likely to need (until GAS sets in) for about the same money as a small combo with a fairly limited ability (in my opinion - your mileage may vary!). Check gumtree/local ads too. There are bargains to be had EVERYWHERE, especially if you're willing to go with something a little older than the current fad. Good example is a friend of mine bought a trace 300 watt head, 2x10 and compact 1x15 for under £300 in really good condition. Sure it's heavy, but it's a fantastic sounding rig for very little money. Edited March 30, 2012 by Bigwan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) Like this for example (no affiliation with seller - just an example of how far your money can go): [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/171780-trace-elliot-2-x-10-gp12-smx-300w-bass-combo/page__hl__bristol__fromsearch__1"]http://basschat.co.u...__fromsearch__1[/url] Edited March 30, 2012 by Bigwan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 Agreed, you're going to need more oomph than 15W. I once tried to play a wee pub with a 30W practice amp against one acoustic guitar and a keyboard and it was just about ok on stage but I don't think the audience heard much (probably a good thing ). Against a full band you'll need a three figure sum of watts. I know there's more to it than power, but it's complicated, and more complicated than my capability to understand. The 100W Laney you can borrow will probably just about make it but you'll maybe want a bit more headroom and leeway than that. For what it's worth, for the first few years of my gigging I used a Hartke HA3500 head into an Ashdown ABM 4x10 cab at 8 ohms, thus yielding 230W and I never had to put the master volume much higher than about 6 out of 10, even when I was doing a marquee gig without PA support and I was the bass for the room. Then I got a 4 ohm Zoot 4x10 cab for 350W and the volume went down to about 4 Now I've got a new head (gigging it for the first time tonight) which spits 500W into 4 ohms so I wonder what I'll have to set it at tonight - 2? Doubt it - it's a big room to fill tonight, no PA support (vocal only) and we're slap bang in the middle of a big old church which is now a pub - literally in 3D about in the middle - on a mezzanine floor most of the way up the stairs in the middle of the building. In my experience it's nice to know you have that extra oomph if you need it and it's also nice to know you aren't thrashing the hell out of your amp, running it at full tilt every gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 30, 2012 Author Share Posted March 30, 2012 Some good advice as always I've always fancied a Trace Elliot amp but weight is an issue. I'm a weedy chap and will have to lug it in and out of a Lancer saloon. I'll pop over to the lightweight amps thread and have a read-up I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 It depends on what your wee 15w amp is capable of. I've gigged with 2 guitarists & a shed builder of a drummer using a 1x12 30w combo & though it was pushed to near breaking, coped with the gigs. I've also done many gigs with 100w heads & a couple of 15" cabs & had plenty of wumph, so don't worry so much about how many watts it says the head gives, but how much air you can move. Is there a decent PA? Going into that means you'll only need something for you to hear. You'll get some good gear in the For Sale section on here if you're willing to go 2nd hand. Could get something like a LMII & a decent 2x10 for @£4-500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 30, 2012 Author Share Posted March 30, 2012 At the moment it's just for practice and I've no idea what type of venues we may (or may not) play yet. I'm pretty sure I actually gigged back in the 90s with a 30w Laney Linebacker (I think it was) and it competed with the drummer, guitarist and keyboard player quite well. Only really went into the PA for a Battle of the Bands thing in a much larger venue. (If anyone's from Preston, most gigs were upstairs at the Adelphi pub and the BotB was at The Mill.) Trying the 15w and the borrowed 100w would at the very least let me hear what 15w and 100w sound like Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 Hand trucks are your friend when it comes to loading stuff in and out... Until you get to the stairs and then you're kind of shagged, which is where the drummer comes in to lend a hand! Unfortunately with your stated budget you will be limited - lightweight typically means expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 30, 2012 Author Share Posted March 30, 2012 I've had a read through the 17 pages of the lightweight cabs thread... phew! And yeah, lightweight usually means very expensive. I did manage to pull out this gem: Gallien Kruegar MB112 - 200w (hit or miss as to whether it's loud enough) and 13kg and £250 new. Ticks all the boxes if it's loud enough. I've been convinced to favour buying second-hand off BC though so will be keeping an eye out for something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barkin Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 +1 to buying 2nd hand - all of my current kit has come from here There's an Ashdown Mag300 head in the for sale section for 100 quid, and there pretty much always seems to be a selection of Ashdown/Hartke/Peavey etc cabs for the same kind of money. Something along those lines would be a far more gigable rig than an EB combo, IMO. For tonights gig - 100-ish people if it's full, rock covers, drums, 2 guitars, 3 vox - I'll be using a 175W/8Ohm Hartke HA2500 into an Ashdown Mag 2x10. If that's not loud enough for your average pub or small club gig, tell the guitar/s to turn down! Lots of pub bands, that I see, play far too loud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 Now that sounds like a good bargain (shame that one's collection only from Essex). I'm quite keen on the idea of a separate head/cab now. A while ago I did think about getting a head only and using it to shape the tone before pumping it into my Guitar Rig interface. And a separate head and cab would be lighter if I took two trips to the car and back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted April 1, 2012 Author Share Posted April 1, 2012 Ok, had my first practice session. Just the guitarist going through a 50w Laney amp and drummer un-miked. Took my 15w Laney Richter and it just about coped. I had to crank to volume up to 9 and throw a whole loads of mids and some highs in there just to be heard and I could just about hear it. Not bad for 15w to be honest but I do need more. They reckoned the bass should be 3 times the wattage of the guitar amp (and I know there's more to it than just wattage as xgsjx says. So I'm back to looking at two options. Either the Ashdown EB-12 180 / Gallien Kruger MB112 or go for the Ashdown MAG300 head and a suitable cab. The EB / GK option would mean I could order one new and get it quick whilst I'd have to stalk to the for sale section on here for the head/cab set (or indeed, look on here for an EB / GK). Obviously the MAG 300 would give me more headroom but as my little 15w performed okish I can't help but think that for this band's setup that a 180/200w combo would be plenty. I think at the moment the MAG 300 / 210 cab option is my favourite if I can find a set fairly quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barkin Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Shame we're 150 miles apart - I've a Mag400 combo you could borrow while you consider your options... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 (edited) Look beyond where you are with this band at the minute, and beyond where you practice. Where do you want to be playing with this band in a year or 2 (I'm assuming you want to be gigging)? Are you going to have PA support? That's what your rig should be aimed at. Buy once. All of this is 'within reason' of course, but there's nothing as annoying as thinking you're sorted to then have to turn around and do it all again because you're first attempt fell short. IMHO and YMMV. Edited April 2, 2012 by Bigwan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share Posted April 2, 2012 Thanks for the offer though Barkin, much appreciated! Totally sound advice Bigwan. I imagine we'd start off gigging in the pub we practice in and would possibly stick to the smaller venues. Any bigger venues would likely have a PA system (so a DI output is essential for this possibility) but without knowing the exact venues, I couldn't say really. I think I'd be pretty safe with an Ashdown MAG 300 head in an appropriate cab (210 maybe) but I'd really like one in the next week or so which then pushes me to looking at buying new unless I can find something sharpish on here. And that I think, is the crux of my dilemma. Buy new for short term gain vs. buy used for long term benefit. So, with that in mind, like I said I'm sure I'd be safe with 300 watts going into a 2x10 and that would do me mid to long term. If I can't get that, I may have to compromise with a 180 - 200 watt combo that could fill a small to medium-sized pub with my dodgy bass notes. Now, I know that 180 watts from one combo could be louder (however you define louder...) than 180 watts from a different combo. So this is where I'm starting to think about 12" speakers over 15" speakers. e.g. the Ashdown EB 180 comes in either 12" or 15" but I don't know if one or the other would give me more benefit in this situation. Just weighing up my options with the EB at the moment (and learning more about amps/cabs/combos and their suitability). The benefit of the EB is that I've tried one and really liked it. Had a couple of Spectors and Fenders go through it in a shop and put my Overwater through one at another place. I've not tried anything else other than a Line 6 (which sounded quite good with my Overwater to be fair but they've never stood out as a recommended brand that much so far). Or am I thinking about this too much?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janmaat Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Not sure if this advise it any good, but I was playing through this GK Backline BL-115 on a couple of rehearsals and I must say, from the different randomly available stuff, and the price tag, I consider it great.... Cheap, if you you look at it, amazingly versatile from the controls, and loud enough - plus I like the fact you can angle it easily. http://www.thomann.de/de/gallien_krueger_bl115.htm So that's probably what I'd buy if I'd buy a combo, though of course the head + speaker is so much more fun since it allows you to evolve more. But hey... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted April 3, 2012 Author Share Posted April 3, 2012 Oh lord, that starts off the 12" vs. 15" speaker question now! In short, I'm looking at a 12" on the vague assumption that I'll get better mids rather than lows but still get some lows and it won't sound woofly like a 15 does. Or summat like that. I'll try out a 12" EB 180 and a 15" one side by side to judge tbh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted April 3, 2012 Author Share Posted April 3, 2012 [quote name='janmaat' timestamp='1333400108' post='1601288'] Not sure if this advise it any good, but I was playing through this GK Backline BL-115 on a couple of rehearsals and I must say, from the different randomly available stuff, and the price tag, I consider it great.... Cheap, if you you look at it, amazingly versatile from the controls, and loud enough - plus I like the fact you can angle it easily. [url="http://www.thomann.de/de/gallien_krueger_bl115.htm"]http://www.thomann.d...ueger_bl115.htm[/url] So that's probably what I'd buy if I'd buy a combo, though of course the head + speaker is so much more fun since it allows you to evolve more. But hey... [/quote] Just been looking at this and I'm seriously considering it now. £207? Sounds like an absolute bargain! Gets good reviews too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted April 3, 2012 Author Share Posted April 3, 2012 Although this has caught my eye: http://www.kennysmusic.co.uk/backline/bass-amps/ashdown-mag-300h-evoii-half-stack-package.html Wicked price for 300w of Ashdown MAG into a 210 cab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiamPodmore Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 [quote name='Mornats' timestamp='1333464028' post='1602059'] Although this has caught my eye: [url="http://www.kennysmusic.co.uk/backline/bass-amps/ashdown-mag-300h-evoii-half-stack-package.html"]http://www.kennysmus...ck-package.html[/url] Wicked price for 300w of Ashdown MAG into a 210 cab. [/quote] Not a bad price for new, but as many others have said, a little bit of patience and searching the FS threads for a few days, you could get that rig for about £200 with ease. Liam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted April 3, 2012 Author Share Posted April 3, 2012 Wise words. And is having a warranty worth £150? Hmm, I think not. I'll be patient as my mate has just lent me his 100w Laney amp that I'll try out. Used to be owned by Jack Bessant pre-Reef so has a little history too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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