icastle Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 [quote name='TimR' timestamp='1327273699' post='1508829'] Sounds like 20-30 songs is a bit of a tall order. [/quote] Totally ludicrous. I'm not a church goer, but if I was, the last thing I'd expect would be to sit through a 1.5hr gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnutkj Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1327237237' post='1508060']He is an out-of-work sound engineer [/quote] Yeesh! Why didn't you just say that in the first place? You could have saved five pages and wouldn't have had to use the phrase "colossal tool"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Lol it wouldn't have made for such an interesting thread otherwise. "I got asked to play in a band by an out-of-work sound engineer - I said no" "Good on you mate" "Yea, I would've done the same" "I would've cock-slapped any sound engineer that comes within breathing distance of me" Guys, it isn't a church choir, it's a 'turn up and sing' affair run by individuals and is not part of nor endorsed (nor discouraged!) by any church in the area. It's a 'white people doing sister act' type group *shudder* The clapping out of time alone is enough to make you want to self harm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitz666 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Sorry but anyone speaking like that to me, especially when I am doing them the favour, would be left in a snotty heap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1327308969' post='1508962'] It's a 'white people doing sister act' type group *shudder* The clapping out of time alone is enough to make you want to self harm [/quote] white people never have "da riddims" Should we explore this in "Funk and Groove" thread? Does the choir sing to the songs being played by the "band" then? (if I missed it) If so I'm sure that you can find backing tracks to 90% of church songs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
throwoff Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 McGraham the answer is simple and staring you in the face. Contact said tool. Say you want to come back, you were wrong and so on and so forth. Also say you have found an incredible Keyboard player, guitarist, percussionist and 3 piece brass section who would fit in and are ready to go. Invite members of BC to fulfil those roles and turn up to practice. ...... what happens next is up to you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevB Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Persuade the guy to stick to something he should know something about - setting the PA up and getting a good mix. Delegate the actual musical direction side of things to someone with better people skills and make it clear to him that this is definitely no longer his job and not to get involved. He sounds like a guy I was involved with a few years ago who was trying to get a band together after not gigging for about 12 years. I was between bands and a mate from a previous band persuaded me to get involved. The 'leader' wanted to work to a drum machine until we were tight then get a real drummer in to finish a 4 piece lineup and get gigging. We spent what seemed forever getting intros precise to the nanosecond. I had the temerimty to point out to him that when the real drummer came in we'd probably have to change things anyway to accomodate them so it seemed a waste of time laboriously going over these drum synth related aspects (after six weeks we still semed to be on the same 5 or 6 songs) and things went completely downhill. He just got stranger and stranger at each successive rehearsal. I'd always got my parts down pretty well as I practised them between sessions so when he came in one day and had a tirade about how I'd been playing, my sound (neither had been an issue for the previous six weeks) and that basically we would be gigging by now if he'd got another bass player in from the start I quietly packed my gear up, wished him all the best with the new bass player and left. The guy that I knew and had got me involved was so disgusted he quit after another couple of days. We've both gone on to be in other bands that gig yet neither of us have ever seen the guy that was putting the project together play live anywhere since that day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1327309960' post='1508968']Does the choir sing to the songs being played by the "band" then? (if I missed it)[/quote] The choir sing along just to the piano during rehearsals, played by said tool, when he can be arsed to turn up. He thinks the world revolves around him. As I've said above, anytime they've tried to get someone in to cover for those weeks when he just doesn't bother turning up or throws a paddy, he just throws another wobbly and threatens to leave, and the organisers think the sensible thing to do is pander to his whims. I think I'd tell him to remove his head from his arse and maybe his head won't be quite so full of excrement. [quote name='throwoff' timestamp='1327311163' post='1508989']Contact said tool. Say you want to come back, you were wrong and so on and so forth. Also say you have found an incredible Keyboard player, guitarist, percussionist and 3 piece brass section who would fit in and are ready to go. Invite members of BC to fulfil those roles and turn up to practice. ...... what happens next is up to you [/quote] So tempting... but I prefer having no criminal record. [quote name='KevB' timestamp='1327311504' post='1508994']He sounds like a guy I was involved with a few years ago who was trying to get a band together after not gigging for about 12 years. [/quote] Given we're both in Nottingham it could be the same guy! Edited January 23, 2012 by mcgraham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1327269098' post='1508727'] Been thinking about it and I probably won't email the person in charge... even though they are a friend too it wouldn't be helpful for anyone, and would be perceived as more childish than trying to fix things. I'll ask my wife to pass on what's happened as the person currently in charge is more liable to tear him a new one than pander to his mood swings [/quote] On the contrary, I think it would be very helpful. As has been said, there's a choir that wants to sing and musicians that want to play and the only thing buggering it up is this monumental knob. You know, the guy with no face and a cock shaped dent in his head. The fact that he gets his hair off when those [i]above[/i] him make decisions goes to show that his ego is totally out of control. It really starts to sound like he has serious anger-management issues, for one thing. Getting shot of him would be the best thing they could do. If he (and presumably his bint) were out of the picture, would you play with them again? [quote name='throwoff' timestamp='1327311163' post='1508989'] McGraham the answer is simple and staring you in the face. Contact said tool. Say you want to come back, you were wrong and so on and so forth. Also say you have found an incredible Keyboard player, guitarist, percussionist and 3 piece brass section who would fit in and are ready to go. Invite members of BC to fulfil those roles [b]Invite said tool to an audition for this band that you have arranged... in a deserted warehouse...[/b] [/quote] Fixed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote]If he (and presumably his bint) were out of the picture, would you play with them again?[/quote] I would be happy to do anything they need me to do because the majority of them are my friends and I want to help them do well. The reason I don't go anymore is simply because they rehearse the same night as my church team, and that's my priority. Unfortunately, there is no-one that could commit to or manage to handle the piano backing week to week, for the reasons given above. I know that isn't a great reason not to give this guy a metaphorical kicking, but at the same time the choir is in a not-so-great state that mean it could well fold if there isn't a musician handling the backing duties for a couple of weeks. Lesser of two evils is the reasoning there, even though I don't necessarily agree they've picked the lesser evil. Does that make sense? [quote name='Rich' timestamp='1327313037' post='1509022'] On the contrary, I think it would be very helpful. As has been said, there's a choir that wants to sing and musicians that want to play and the only thing buggering it up is this monumental knob. You know, the guy with no face and a cock shaped dent in his head. The fact that he gets his hair off when those [i]above[/i] him make decisions goes to show that his ego is totally out of control. It really starts to sound like he has serious anger-management issues, for one thing. Getting shot of him would be the best thing they could do. [/quote] Hmmm... you've made me reconsider to some extent. Unfortunately there are NO musicians in the choir that want to play - we've left for various reasons, and those that have joined just the band (rather than the choir) for one-off gigs have only done one-offs because they don't see eye to eye with the band leader. That said, I think I may send a tentative email on the down low to the person running it at the moment. I just need to phrase it appropriately, as the reason for sending it is not to gripe but to let them know that even someone they'd count as a reasonable and patient friend of his has bowed out because of his temper tantrums, and that I genuinely think it's his ego trip that's preventing them from flourishing as a choir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-bbb Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 to use the new corporatespeak ... sounds like somebody needs their expectations managed or in plain good old south london terms .... maybe they need their fortune telling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1327316092' post='1509075'] well if you word it right they might just check up with the previous musos and see if their story collabertaes yours [/quote] While I'd love that to be the case, that's unlikely. The people who set up the choir are limp-wristed friends who won't tell you something negative even if your life depended on it. The person running the choir at the moment is far more to the point, but the amount of work they have to put in to keep things going at present means they'd be unlikely to choose to spend time checking up with previous musos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linus27 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='Fitz666' timestamp='1327309840' post='1508967'] Sorry but anyone speaking like that to me, especially when I am doing them the favour, would be left in a snotty heap. [/quote] Ooooh grim, you would had blown your runny nose on them? I guess thats one way to show your not happy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1327319015' post='1509128'] Sounds like this is one of those projects thats keeps going around in circles and never gets anywhere. [/quote] You, my friend, have hit the nail squarely on the head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1327319015' post='1509128'] Sounds like this is one of those projects thats keeps going around in circles and never gets anywhere. [/quote] A bit like western 'civilisation', then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I understand this fully now. It's basically AmDram but with a choir instead of actors. The producer or in this case the "MD" is usally a complete PITA. Usually what happens is the actors and the rehearsal pianist rehearse until ready then the musicians turn up at the technical rehearsal, are given the dots/charts and sight read it with the rehearsal pianist as the MD. You just do what he says when and how he wants it. Take the money or the beer and wait to get called again. I've done hundreds. They're all pretty much the same format. Tell him to call you when the choir is ready and he has a date for the performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Exactly Tim! Exactly! That's precisely what I told him at the start when he asked me, and he insists he won't schedule a concert for the choir til he's happy with the band.(reading between the lines: HIS band for HIS choir). Like you, I also have experience of such things being done as you have stated, but he thinks he knows better. He's an amateur at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Oh except I'm not/wouldn't be getting paid for my trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassist_lewis Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1327172866' post='1507477'] He informs me he refuses to schedule a gig until he thinks the band is ready. [/quote] I got this crap from the guy who ran th Jamiroquai band I was in, he decided we weren't tight enough as a band (search Jamirrorquai in Ireland and you'll see that that was NOT the case) and wanted to rehearse weekly for months without any prospect of gigs (this was at all our expense I might add). IME if someone thinks that rehearsing is more important than gigging then they know nothing about music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevB Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I agree, I seem to have developed a sixth sense over the years as to the likelyhood of a project actually getting to gigging stage. Some people do see them as a social thing only and it doesn't matter whether they ever play to a real audience or not. One of the singers in a past band I was in referred to them as 'hobby bands' and he had no time for it. I tend to fall in with this on the whole. i don't need to gig every week but constant rehearsal with nothing fixed to work toward is pretty soul destroying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I think there is definatly a happy medium between not gigging till you are tight for a decent set, and booking gigs before you have any set list to speak of. A band I was briefly with before christmas auditioned me, and I got the part, after 3 more rehearsals I knew four songs but the singer kept changing what he wanted them to sound like so they weren't tight, barely polished. Also coomplained about wanting to go on to write new stuff. The next week he had 4 gigs booked with less than 15 minutes of material. The first 2 gigs we scrapped through with amazing reception from the crowd. Two days before the 3rd the singer quit. I say two, it was the week before but he forgot to mention it. Some great songs from the singer and guitarist but after this and the subsequent troubles after, it wasn't worth the hassle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1327172866' post='1507477'] So, played a gig or two last year for the gospel choir my wife and some friends sing in. Got asked to do it again, and I've had to decline and it was a difficult decision to make. I don't want to ramble on, but it's more complicated than that. Basically, the person in charge of the band is a colossal tool. I don't use that word often, particularly when describing someone who is meant to be a friend of me and my wife, but the truth hurts (not if you've got an ego that big to protect you of course). At the outset when I consented I was given an incomplete set list, I asked what he wanted me to work on first before a practice, and he informed me that he wants me to learn them EXACTLY as recorded and perfect them to a T before a first practice, otherwise what's the point. I say OK, when is the first concert? Obviously there's a lot of work involved perfecting a 20 song set list, I don't want to outlay all that time and effort if it's going to just be ongoing rehearsals for 6 months before a concert... particularly as it's a favour and i'm not getting paid. He informs me he refuses to schedule a gig until he thinks the band is ready. I've been down that road before and I think it's a massive waste of time... anyway.... Since then, he's had another couple of massive rants, expecting me to attend a rehearsal within a days notice, and insisting there will be no provisional gig til a practice. I've now been given an updated set list numbering 30 tracks, and he's not clarified which ones I'm meant to learn verbatim, create parts for, or ignore. I asked for him to specify, he said he mentioned this in an earlier email, I respond with 'what about the new ones' and his response his 'I've already explained all this numerous times in detail I refuse to do it again'. *breath* I politely informed him that I no longer wish to be part of his band. Sure it might make things a little difficult, but I don't see why I should endure amateurs with that sort of attitude, bring my level of professionalism to what he wants, for no money, no respect and no effort on his part. People like this need to be told to grow up and we need to stop tolerating them... 'oh they're just like that, leave them be' is not a valid excuse. [b]In any case, I was wondering what you guys would've done in my place?[/b] [/quote] I have absolutely no tolerance for that type of sh*t You did the right thing, and you describe him correctly as a colossal tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='silddx' timestamp='1327335974' post='1509522'] I have absolutely no tolerance for that type of sh*t You did the right thing, and you describe him correctly as a colossal tool. [/quote] Your way with words is amazing. BTW spotted another glove user, Nathan Navaro of Pinn Panelle in a skrillex cover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 [quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1327336421' post='1509537'] BTW spotted another glove user, Nathan Navaro of Pinn Panelle in a skrillex cover. [/quote] There are definitely more gloves being seen. One day, bare hands on a bassist will be seen as rank impiety Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 [quote name='silddx' timestamp='1327335974' post='1509522'] I have absolutely no tolerance for that type of sh*t You did the right thing, and you describe him correctly as a colossal tool. [/quote] Cheers! I feel TRULY vindicated now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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