JTUK

One of the better music pubs round here has a music fan LL. If you playing a Counting Crows number he will love your band forever.. He has a top pay policy and he is sensible about it. Some pubs will pay £350 a night but the band better to be worth it and BS backfires on bands that go for that and 'fail'..so £250 is the figure that a lot of pubs want to pay for most bands. It is all in the turn-out of course. Audition nights are popular tho and it depends if you buy into the pub/LL being fair on the night as to whether you should do them. If you do well, they might offer you a gig on a band night ( and pay a little bonus ..?) but mostly, bands who use these free nights to prospect a gig aren't good enough. Every band has can have less good nights and you can also luck out and get a very well attended gig, but mostly you will find your level once you have played there a few times. LL's tend to hear who the good bands are and what they do regards to pulling in people so will expect to pay. It is only the chancers who want to pay nothing, and they are the gigs you'd want to avoid anyway. We've always said pubs don't pay enough so the only ones you do are the ones that have a good regular audience and the chance to have very good nights and pay enough to make the experience worth doing. £50 a night for a *** gig at a *** pub isn't worth anything long term. You'll not get anything other than hassle or fights..and you wont pick up the good party gigs and you'll go home thinking the whole thing was a waste of time. To get £750 plus parties, you have to be a very good band and not flog it forever in a pub as the client tends to say you work many pubs for £250 and you are takin g the p** asking for 3 times as much for my partty.

I wouldn't moan about a Christmas gig at one of the Cambridge colleges, so hand it over

I prefer passive but my basses have an active option which I use to make the sound a bit more peaky but not fundementally different. This is because I don't get the set-up time on some gigs to get the passive option right all the time...so it is a short-cut fix. If I had a better gig, I'd be passive but then I'd also have the production time to sort it and the whole rig. Having said that.... my sound is good, IMO and people comment on it as do some bass players so I am not doing a lot wrong.

There are two ways to do it in a conventional style, ie not Gary Willis, who has a different technique. First off, after just two years playing you have picked on a pretty advanced style and technique. You can mute LH or RH but Scott Devine explains what you are trying to achieve well with a LH mute. Search Ghost notes bass on Google and Scott Devine will crop up quickly but basically keep the RH notes consistant... Play straight 8's/quavers off the RH and fret and mute with the left. That will break up the pattern you are playing to give you enough of an idea to develop what you want. A mute of the LH is a simple release of the fretting finger to get a dull thud in comparison to the sound of playing the actual note.

[quote name='Chienmortbb' timestamp='1409240125' post='2537887'] Take the low sliders down rather than up and take the 2x10 with you and you will be fine. [/quote] I'm wondering why the person supplying this amp wants to run the risk of it running hard into a 210. If the amp does around 300 into 8ohms, those 10's need to be pretty good and TE weren't noted for using great chassis, IME. If it were me lending/hiring it out, I add another 210 just for insurance. The reason I wont take my rig is because I don't know how close I can get the car ... I might not use much bass, if the monitors are good, but we haven't used this stage before so..?? I am pretty sure someone will give it a caning though and all those faders will be used as flat out volume..!!!

Another thing I meant to mention, I think one of my basses would get close pretty easily and the other would be pretty hard work. Their jazz sounds, whilst 'classic' are world's apart 'classic'. I have one that does Marcus Miller really well... and it does Jaco very well off the back pickup, but I'd have to work very hard to get that bass ball park.. The other one..which I describe as vintage modern would be far easier. It also happens to be my go-to bass as well in that it has that vintage/early 70's sound. Think Paul Turner...which is not a surprise as he had the thing built for him. If I had to say one component I hear there is a RW neck..???? I am not a fan of EQ'ing the hell out of things ...if it isn't there, best leave it and get one that lends itself better. That way you don't go round the houses chasing sounds... and aren't lost when the fancy settings have gone or disappear... which they do

First off, many players/bands ignore slap lines live for that very reason... Sounds like a Jazz to me, tricked up, and it will be mixed post gig, of course. How to get it exactly I am not sure... but you could get it pretty close if you get away from the classic, as in old hat, typical bass sounds. I have a RW J5 with a JE pre... and I'd work the mid sweep pretty hard but wouldn't need/use compression.... but many probably would. On my bass, I'd go bass boost at half, or less, treble notched at 0...you may have to +- a tad here to taste. The mid sweep would be around three quarters and the boost around the same. Amp set pretty flat and the enhance or timbre or whatever played around with a bit. Then I'd go to the cab and see how that was able to speak in a live context and maybe the horn around half to 3/4 on.. Too much treble on bass or amp would give it too glassy a tone..

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1409239618' post='2537878'] Isn't that exactly what has been happening with loads of manufacturing jobs in British industry, with them being moved to other countries where labour costs are so much cheaper, indeed almost 'free' in comparison to UK wages? I'd bet you've bought stuff made by this 'cheap labour' at sometime, just like we all have. Again, I could turn the question around and ask why anyone would choose to try to scrape a living by charging for something that many people will do for free. Unless you believe you have some inherent right to earn a living by playing music then you just have to accept the big melting pot that is the market economy we live in. You don't have to like it, but you're not going to be able to change it. [/quote] I think we could legislate against it but as you say...that would force a lot of ppl to be more 'legal' than they are now... so would probably be a non-starter to all intents and purposes. The Black economy exists elsewhere and it is very hard to shut down, of course... I do actually operate quite a strict policy of not buying music stuff from the far east...but that is mostly because I think the western stuff is better anyway... or certainly the kit I have. To my knowledge it isn't stuff that creeps over the Mexican border either. I don't believe the vast majority of free bands are that competitive anyway... so the gigs they would get, no one really wants as either they don't have the budget to pay, or they don't have a budget to do things properly. The free festivals around here shout pretty loud but they don't really attract the numbers either, IME... The places where they do affect things is in pubs as they can push the price down. Another reason to not knock yourself out on the pubs. At festivals here, you can tell if the deal is free, by the bands that are on the bill. Of course, the big City council fests are worth doing but they will have a budget if you ask... they just need to want you more than you want to do them...

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1409155604' post='2536922'] A 112 would be an easy lift in to the car and 2 of them would cover any gig, and IMO would sound better than a 110 or 210. [/quote] Agree, a 210 is no match for 2 decent 2x112's but will do a quieter gig. You can't fight gtrs or loud drums though with the 210, IME. 10's are my favourite speaker size but you have to be reasonable what you expect from them. 1x10 is a jazzer gig only, 210 is for a controlled gig with a sorted drummer.. and then we come to the 2x112 solution which will still be there in the sound, with 2 gtrs, IMO.. Of course, one man's loud is another man's..???

I've got a gig on sat with a TE210 500w combo... that is all the detail I have on it and we will have decent stage monmitoring so I am not stressing too much. The load-in will be a sod which is the only reason I am contemplating it, tbh, but I might through in another 210 to go underneath, if need be. Why does a proper stage think a 210 will be enough? It will surely get a caning unless the monitoring is really sorted and in the quick change-rounds that may be the problem. Far easier for the bass player to be able to look after himself and the band and that is one less issue for the engr to sort out in the limited time available.

Music is a job like everything else, IMO... If you want to earn enough, you'll be chasing all over the country after that gig that pays £2k and the player pay will be around £300 from that gig. The band will be a business and have other exes so it isn't such a simple split of the money. There will be a kitty/fund etc .. That is a good start to the working week, money-wise, but you can't leave it at that. You have to cram in a few more and you CAN'T be picky and you have to keep that going week-in, week-out. It takes a certain mind-set to be able to stick with it, for long enough and I, myself, can't think of much worse, tbh. I think one of the things holding bands back is their inability to get/think beyond bars/pubs but then you also have to have a band that is capable of that as well. However, what that certain something is that works for one band and not for others is less clear. The one thing around here that seems to propel bands/acts to the top of the local league is the initial ability to play anything and everything ... but NOT bars. You can smokescreen to a degree but you also need to have a really good business plan or head on and sell the whole thing, By and large, IMO, these acts have something a bit different about them. .. be it contacts/connections, money, bandwagon, BS and ANOTHER.

All I want to know is what the feel/groove is and the key. If there are any unusual changes, then maybe let me know, but blues on bass is just about holding it together while the gtr goes missing on a solo. One of the reasons why I don't like to play in bands without keys.. If the keys are pretty educated in their substitutions, then even better and it is all on the shout. Might freak the gtr tho ...which is funny..!!

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1409159084' post='2536967'] Wasn't there, and never a fan as such, so I have absolutely no idea, but could it be that after 35 years she might have struggled with some of the notes? [/quote] I think she always struggled with the notes but in her quirky style it never became the issue. I can't for the life of me see her pulling this off after all these years...but, everyone seemed to have loved it. So, she still has it as far as her fans go...fair enough.

New candidate on the basis that I have just spent 2 days working one in the studio. Line 6 Lowdown 300w Combo. I tried all the model options and settled on the 'Rock' sound. This combo has a 15" plus a tweeter which is not attentuated - which I would miss, but I was able to get it lively enough with my mid Sweep up pretty high. Core sounds pretty good and I had a live sound screened from the drums, and DI and mic on the cab and the sound went down pretty well. Like all these things, I think the most serious questions are asked when running LOUD, but these should work well for the quieter gig without rampant gtrs to fight. Cheap 300w combo, I'd say and will do a job.

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1409063605' post='2535933'] I watched a buddy of mine in a Pro Band do their 90 minute show. I got jealous because I feel trapped in this local 4 hour bar band level of play. When you’re in a pro band, with a catalog of hits, captive audience (people that came specifically to see you and hear your music), they know the material and the words to the songs it’s seems so much easier to manage and win. Not to mention pro lights and sound. For most of us doing bar shows , it’s always a hit or miss proposition. Crowds are usually marginal in terms of overall music knowledge, your band and live music in general. I am spending a lot of time networking in an attempt to find a recognized national or regional touring opportunity. Anyone else want to complain about their circumstance. blue [/quote] Join a tribute band. This is why they are so popular with players, IMO as the talent can go much further. You can be a decent covers bands and it is hard to get beyond a £1k gig unless you plug into weddings etc ... Pick the right act to Tribute and you can get far better gigs than that.

self promotion/ego women and money... that is it.

[quote name='bonzodog' timestamp='1409078294' post='2536135'] Middle one. I think thats what most people will type if they google it [/quote] Indeed. Most important to use as close to the common search string... This is the problem, IMO, in using a logo type to identify the band. I'd use the middle one

Sorry to read this.... should be plenty more years to do your stuff, whichever direction you choose to go. Good luck

If you can't hear each other, you have no band..just a bunch of people playing notes and good luck with that. Stage monitoring is key.

But that is why it is work. Getting up every day to catch the tour bus at 0930 for a drive across Germany or wherever is exactly that after a few days... gruelling work and a bloody long day sometimes.

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1408996480' post='2535399'] That makes your position a lot clearer . . . and all power to you in those choices. Well, if we're going to start teasing each other, how come bands playing for a few hundred quid a night in grotty pubs are not good enough to be playing 5000 seat venues with £50 tickets, or even larger venues, or how come they don't have recording contracts with major labels, or how come they're not on the telly every week . . . . . . [/quote] If I knew that, I'd have to charge you for the magic formula. But a few serious points.. The reason we don't do too many pubs is exactly because it dilutes our ability to charge ticket prices. When we quote a festival price we may well get the 'I know what you work for in pubs' and they could guess ball park correct. We then say this is a special show .. and if they want a pub band then go and book one. We tend to cost them all the same but aren't allowed to say exactly how much. It doesn't help if we start playing games between them though and sometimes this might cost you when you stick to your prices. Some pub bands never get beyond that thinking so they are always stuck on pub rates plus £100-200 max. Some pub bands think doing a wedding/function for £600 is good money...but in reality, they are the dates you'd want to avoid. IMO. I've asked some of the regarded local pub bands if they would share a bill at a very nice venue for decent money but they'd have to sell 100 tickets. The venue will hold 350 plus so potentially the band split around £2k after exes but it will cost £1500 upfront to put on. I've had no takers and agree it can be a lot of stress What makes a band worth £5k... I really don't know but I admire the business plan of those who can get it. One of the very best drawing bands round here sell-out and get very good money. They don't give half the door tickets away like others have been known to do... just to claim a 'sell-out' but they have their product and they do well enough. They wouldn't play the pub circuit as they'd get blown away by a lot of the bands on them and that is sensible of them but they will pick up gigs that are all round worth doing IMO. What makes one band 'worth' more than another is a fascinating subject...but 'worth' is not free. IMHO.

I'm for a protection-ist element to a degree as you can outsource anything, pretty much and then where do those in the west work..??? So, to follow on from that, I think we can charge what our market will stand and to a degree that determines our worth. Even tho I don't think we compete with free bands so much, it isn't the free bands so much as the venues themsleves. Bands for free do try and see the bigger picture in that they might think a loss-leader will open another door but if a band said they would do a gig for free, chances are, 95% of the time, I'd think that was their 'worth' Venues might just think that is one cost they don't have to a factor in. What the bands think they get out of that, is less clear, apart from being known to turn up and do it for nothing. I'd be thinking, if this is their business approach, will they even turn up.

The lesson is that the organisers need to be advised what they should provide. Anyone providing a 500w P.A doesn't take the event very seriously and/or hasn't done their homework We tend to talk quite a way thru with an organiser as some of them just do not have a clue what is required,. That isn't so much the problem as it might not be their own area of expertise, but they should listen to people who have it. If they don't, walk away.

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1408987506' post='2535276'] One advantage of playing for free is that if the venue is crap, and the load in/out is terrible, and the chances of a fight is high, then we don't feel obliged to play there just to make a bit of cash. Likewise, we've played a couple of weddings for friends who have specifically asked for us to play because they'd seen us before, so we were happy for that to be our present to them and there was none of the risk and hassle that seems to be associated with so many wedding functions described elsewhere on BC. .......... [/quote] Our rule for mates is that they get 'mates rates' and we have a minimum charge which is double our pub fee. The band member whose mate it is, may well pass on his fee. It is just like a day at work to me..I might enjoy it but I want to be paid. Arriving at a certain time, setting up and carrying the P.A also qualifies me to be paid more than than the others who don't do this. It is all a service for which there is a charge. I guess I don't love doing it as much as I thought. But I'll console myself with the fact that any duff gigs will still pay me. So, no, not sure I like bands working for free. I can't stop them, of course, but I'll tease them that they couldn't get p**** in a brewery

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1408985197' post='2535246'] If you consider playing in a band as 'work' then I can understand your position. Nobody likes to 'work' for nothing. [/quote] I consider playing 'work'. Totally.