JTUK

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1408982463' post='2535199'] A brass band playing in the park..? Worth hearing..? Probably. Worth paying..? Perhaps, but the bandsmen don't see it that way. They play for the love of creating great music and offering it to the public. Is that the 'horrible scummy US system that is leaking in'..? Maybe it's rather the ethos that, if someone, somewhere, is getting a slice of pie, we'll get ours, too..? Whatever happened to generosity, or altruism, or gratuity..? No place for folks with differing sets of values..? That's not a world I'll be promoting any time soon. ......................... [/quote] When the venue publishes it figures for the day..and how much everyone concerned contributed AND if on the payroll, earned, then I'll take the effort seriously.

Sure, a set fee for the type of work based on hours taken to and from the house. And parties/weddings below a certain point are not worth it so best to walk away. Another post in 'How as your gig' illustrates this pretty well.

Bad story..

[quote name='phil.c60' timestamp='1408979511' post='2535161'] I think that it depends: I'm against "free" gigs where you are providing something (entertainment, I hope) for free, and someone else is making a living off the back of that. It's really just exploitation of a band's keenness, desperation for exposure or gullibility, you choose, but charity gigs are a different thing ........... [/quote] ..Depends who is working for free though.... Multi event charity bills now are often run by an events team... and they aren't often free, IMO, altho whether they want you to know that is another thing ( I get it is a whole load of work, of course,) and neither are the various venders on site, or security, but somehow the bands are... why.. ?? Because they will do it for free...

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1408970957' post='2535019'] Not really true . . . Bands happy to play for free and helping themselves You may think that's a bad thing because it affects bands trying to earn money, but is it really any different to a shop that sells stuff cheaper than its competitors? We have laws against cartels for a reason don't we? [/quote] It certainly doesn't help pubs putting up the rates... when they know a lot of bands will work from zero to £150 why would they have to make a plan to pay double. £300 is getting to the top of what a pub can pay round here without door charges and upping the cost of a pint. They will have to sell 200 pints to make the cost of the band on the basis of earning £1.50 per pint. Maybe the margins are a little better than that in some places... but LL's are like so many others, they'll only pay what they have to pay... and therefore a band playing for £150 is distorting the market and in my view, if the market is £250 plus, that isn't a good thing. Their is also a difference between different values and no value ...as in 'free' No, we don't tend to play many pubs and the fee is one of the main reasons.

My start-off is simple. If you can't get a fee, if is usually because they wont pay you what you are asking. There may be a reason why you really want to do the gig ..but I'll imagine that gig has money in it in some shape or form..just not for you. I don't really recognise the term 'professional' either as all that can really mean is that the guys tries to make a living from it... whereas the connetation is that the band is very good, which is not always the case at all. I've said often enough that I'm against free gigs but I know of a few gigs where the band claiming the headline slot is getting it as they are free and other bands on that bill have been 'asked' not to disuss fees ...

I'm torn between a variety in a set..whatever that really means, and the standard fare round here which is pretty much a busking set. And a busking set is mostly made up of the songs you've played in your formative years and you'll know them straight off. Check the key and off you go..

We don't ever do any more than 2x 1 hrs. 1st set is typically 45 mins and the second will be 45mins-1 hr. Doesn't matter whether it is a wedding, party or whatever.. and we don't change the set to suit altho we tend to drop Talking Head;s number. Basically our pub set thinking transfers out into all our other gigs as that is generally how we get them. We may use an agent or two but only if they have seen us, but we don't get gigs from a web search...they are all recommendations, I think.

Twice as long as our maximum evenings work, that is for sure.

And around we go again... If playing for free wasn't an option because people and bands didn't do it... then the concept couldn't really exist.. just like that free 'plumber' So, bands don't really help themselves in alot of respects. Anyone want to be on our support bill...good exposure

A break can be a good thing..... but mine was driven by the fact that I was asking myself why I was on that gig too often. When I came back, I realised how much I had been coasting and was far more refreshed and enthused. I am very careful not to let myself get run down like that again.. so now, I have quite a picky list of things I'll agree to do...

A good bill to a pub or venue is an 'asset' IMV, in that if the standard is perceived as higher, then people will go here on the off chance to see a band they don't know as they have bought into the LL/venue being good at picking good worthwhile bands. This helps the LL in that he knows people will come and it helps a new band as they have a ready-made audience.. That gets harder if the venue puts on 2 nights as there aren't enough good bands to fill the rosta over a 3 month type rotation. If you factor in the better bands charge more, then the idea gets diluted as the LL has a big task making it all work. He then may well,just accept that some nights will luck out and some wont and he may well take a punt on a band that don't play well but will bring in 40-50 people. The regulars might not turn up too much but the LL has achieve his number 1 goal.. he sold enough that night to make it worthwhile. I'd tend to look at it that some pubs and rostas aren't what we would be interested in... This generally leaves you with about 2 worthwhile pubs in any one town that pay the money, are big enough to play in and it is an all round decent experience. I've said it before, pubs are too much work for the money (imo) to not be able to tick off those 3 as a must-have. The trick is to be able to determine what you will do rather than have to take what is offered all the time. It goes without saying that a 'free' gig very very rarely qualifies...

Big fest we have next week will have 20,000 or so over two days but that is too big for the town to handle and they have ditched most of the stalwart acts and are going for a more folkey Hop fest feel. They say that the clean-up/drunkenness is too great when more rock bands play... so time will tell. The bar take has been staggering these last few years with pubs taking ridiculous amounts - £58k is ok for a pub and others are similar. Can the folk acts maintain that sort of interest..??

You can have more confidence if you know what kit is available and whether you have a mon engr. If you don't know any of this... then I wouldn't be taking a chance and going without my own bass monitor We have a nice stage gig where I might have to use the stage rig as access and parking is just so much hassle... and we have another gig to get to ..but since we can't get garaunteed secure parking for the first gig , I might have to leave the rig at home and collect for the next gig. This will make an early slot a quick shoot and scoot I don't tend to trust rigs unless you really know... if you do, then fair enough.

Yep...got to kiss a few frogs but there are good gigs out there. There will be crap gigs as well so as long as the highs are better than the lows then you'll probably want to keep doing it. We've had a good summer, but we wont be doing too much beyond ticking over in the winter. A couple a month will be enough... Chance to completely rework the set and plan a few shows for spring next year.

Markbass aren't punky full stop.. IMO

Two outdoor gigs...1st one ok, the second one a stormer. 40th bithday party and I think the very good crowd will remember it all. Next up is 2 festival gigs on sat... both will be good, looking forward to them

The screws are a bit wimpy... I need to beef mine up.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1408710543' post='2532818'] Oooh yes I'd try a big Al version of an sbmm. Jtuk only plays fender copies anyway [/quote] That is true.... but I did say that EB aren't alone in this. It is a business decision of many many companies to ship build from the Far East. This isn't about better QC..it is about CHEAPER QC as those places are cheaper to build in. Simple. Now, some companies might split and have an entry level line and a U.S/western build line so this does, IMO dilute the marque. I don't think a £600 far east product is necessarily poor in itself, but they make far more profit selling a £600 bass made in the far est than they do made in the West, paying western salaries. You can outsource pretty much anything, but sooner or later you are going to put a lot of people out of work getting it made cheaper elsewhere. This is why I say it cheapens the Marque as the MAIN beneficies are the 'Shareholders'. I use the term shareholder loosely as it may well be a privately owned company..so consider that a euphermism for 'MAXIMUM PROFIT' But back to the core point, it is not solely EB's fault, I apply this thinking to all my kit and I don't own any amp, cab or bass made in the Far East.

Always depends. We do what we do, so people will get our take on stuff or not book us. I am not a juke box and have no interest in salvishly copying a record or learning bass beyond giving it a quick listen to see where it is going. We make what we do work within the confines of our line-up or abilities. We pick songs that we like first and foremost. We do a couple of modern day standards but they seem to have become standards thru the time we have played them. If we had thought that of them at the time, we probably wouldn't have entertained them. So, I don't think we are popular for the songs we play... maybe that is why nobody comes to our gigs After this very busy summer, I'll be suggesting we re-vamp our set with 10-12 new tracks and 4 originals. Punters... who'd have them ??

Time honoured 'scam' where you fill a pub on a dead night typically. There may be costs on the night and a lot of these gigs have house engrs and P.A's which can be a good thing but basically, I view it as a job for the boys type exploitation and this pays the rngrs and promoters for setting it up which can be a lot of work. The pub/venue LL will 'sub' out his venue to someone who is going to fill that night when he still has fixed costs whether it is full or not... Don't do it unless you are confident you can sell the ticket allocation. It can work for you but my cynical take on it is you pay to fill an empty pub. Consider the figures.. 4 bands at 25 tickets each is 100 tickets. Sell them at £5 = £500. LL/Venue might get a slice and promoter and engr certainly will... If you sell those 25 tickets what do you get from it..%-wise..?? probably £25 petrol..?? so there is £400 potentially to be split up ..? Not so bad money on a wet tuesday night. The promoters don't so much promote ...they organise it. You ( the bands ) provide the bulk of the audience.

As part of my practise routine I'll often put a youtube concert on and play along, or a CD/DVD but there is a reason why I do this... it is to be be ready to play a gig. I have no interest in turning up and not being ready, but you need, like we all do, to test yourself out in the real world and then you'll know how ready or off the mark you are. Bass is a life long study for a lot of people so we all have doubts to a degree. I don't see the point of honing a skill to quite a degree, which takes many many many hours and not having an end use. But you are the only person who can decide if and when you get out and play.

Not really surprised as we seem to be breeding a society that expects and demands so much. The sense of fariness is out the window and it is a free-for-all where people will take what they want and if someone is stupid enough to let them take it, then more fool them. And they say we evolve..??? I recently bailed out a touring bill and altho I didn't make a big thing of lending the stuff, none of the guys thanked me..until I went up on stage and told them how to work it. At least they were more grateful when they realised. I put that down to a communication problem. My stance with lending stuff is I am more incliend to do it if I think the favour is appreciated, and I'd get pretty obstinant if some chav behaved like they were doing ME a favour. Admire your restraint Barrie...

[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1408698711' post='2532588'] Come on........the Sub SBMM is an entry level bass and the SBMM a mid price range version of three or four US basses. They're all perfectly well built and solid basses - a parallel there in a market sense with the comparable Squire and MIM versions of Fenders. [/quote] I could say the same about those as well but we are talking about EB basses. Good for the business, not so much for the punter...IMO.

[quote name='Hutton' timestamp='1408697329' post='2532563'] I take it that you are referring to the more recent Subs and Sterlings and not the older USA SUB basses. [/quote] Yes for Subs... but not a fan of Sterlings, full stop. I think they cheapen the marque... but then I tend to think EB did that anyway, to a degree. I'd say the same about Warwicks etc etc etc as well, tho, tbf.