Musicman20

Jees what venues are you playing? If its super loud, id just go all out doom and forget lightweight/micros. TUBES + 4x12sssss.

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' post='964675' date='Sep 22 2010, 05:21 PM']That doesn't show on the link! Only £857! All the others have the special offer undeneath the price! And she's "only" 600W@4Ohms and the Supertwelve will go up tp 1000W@4Ohms... I'm still very leaned to Alex's cabs for a keeper. Oh!, just confirmed that the Promethean is only 250W... Thomann almost tricked me! That one is out of the list.[/quote] Im not saying dont get it, just make sure you are 100%. You will never need 1000W, and the Genz cabinet is excellently made, very road worthy but also pretty! [url="http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/Genz_Benz_Neox_Cabs.html"]http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_sp..._Neox_Cabs.html[/url] £675 including shipping to the EU. Im just giving you options, that's all Please, don't just go on something through specs and power rating. That Genz cabinet is bomb proof and very desirable. If you ever tried to sell it, youd not lose a lot. Plus, the Shuttle 9.0 and 212T is a combination people have been using since the 9.0 came out over on Talkbass. Good reviews and matching manufacturer. Bloody hell I dont even have any Genz, so I dont know why im going on so much. If I didnt have the Aguilar and Markbass/TC, id have Genz gear.

[quote name='Chris2112' post='964394' date='Sep 22 2010, 12:47 PM']It's not that I don't like Sadowsky basses, as far as basses go they're alright. Solid, useable basses that get the job done in an unspectacular fashion, if you're looking for jazz bass or modern jazz bass sounds. A bass I don't like would be well, a Gibson or a P bass or something (so no, I doubt I'd like a Sadowsky P bass either, it is an inherently poor design IMO). As far as jazz basses go, they're not the best and they're not the worst. Although the Sandberg California J basses sounded and felt much better than the Sadowsky Metros through the same amp for considerably less; perhaps there is something to be said for A/B'ing these things! [/quote] Ive not played a Sandberg but I think the prices are VERY reasonable. What I dont understand with most high end makers, is that they just give you a bloody gig bag. Some gig bags are fantastic, although they wont beat the Mono one I invested in, (I hope not for the price!). Now, I understand their aim when its for city bass players, but I would NEVER heavily gig without a full case. If you are paying over £1k, id expect a proper case, or a discount on one.

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' post='964606' date='Sep 22 2010, 04:03 PM']I've seen the Neox 212T, she's the kind of cab i would buy to keep but the Supertwelve T looks so much better and has better specs in every point for a fairly smaller price...[/quote] Supertwelve T £675 GB Neo x 212T - [url="http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/Genz_Benz_Neox_Cabs.html"]http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_sp..._Neox_Cabs.html[/url] £655 on offer Id take the Neo X 212T

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' post='964566' date='Sep 22 2010, 03:27 PM']I intend to do that but near where i live it's a bit hard to find top-end cabs, just the usual Ampeg-SWR-Warwick huge and heavy crap![/quote] Ah I see. I would actually suggest, from the massive amount of good reviews, that you check out the Genz Benz Neo X 212T. Even the cab gurus on Talkbass like it! I would take one of those with the Shuttle 9.0 and keep it! Lightish, well regarded, and built well. Plus, well known manufacturer as you know. Dont make weight the ONLY factor in buying a cab unless you absolutely must IMO.

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' post='964528' date='Sep 22 2010, 02:44 PM']@Musicman20 - A friend of mine who's opinon i trust just told me he tried the head with Aguilar and EBS cabs (didn't specify wich of them) at a store and got the impression they didn't sound so good with the GB as they're own amps. He tolled me to get a Bergantino for it.[/quote] The Berg AE212 would be great with it no doubt. It would cost a fair bit but be top end. Depends on tone goals I guess. Sorry I was trying to advise on cabs in general, not just for ones now. Id test what you can before you go ahead.

Personally, I would go and test before you buy it, if possible. My all time favourite cabinet so far is the Aguilar DB212. Its fairly large and not light, but it is a sonic powerhouse. It does come with casters, has great resale value, and looks stunning. Very well built and has that Aguilar quality to it. A 1x10 is worthless with that amp. Id go for an absolute minimum of a quality high end 2x12 (4 or 8 ohms). Or 2 x 112. Its a buyers market

[quote name='Chris2112' post='964249' date='Sep 22 2010, 11:14 AM']I can't say I've ever known a bass to sound good on it's own and bad in the mix or vice versa. A good bass sounds good, period. If it doesn't sound good all the time, why would you buy it when there are so many basses that can?[/quote] This also left me confused. Surely it should sound excellent in and out of the mix?! A P bass with flats sounds nice in a mix, but also sounds nice out of the mix IMO. The mix is not just about the bass anyway, its everyone else, volume levels, amps, cabs, pedals, PA, etc. Sometimes I sound rubbish in a mix, then another venue it feels great. Anyway, I dont want to start going on and on, as I see why people like the quality of the Sadowsky basses. That is a huge factor I consider.

[quote name='Mark Latimour' post='964225' date='Sep 22 2010, 10:53 AM']If a company has a manageable waiting list that the market will bear then its a good indicator that they are priced well in their market. That's a supply vs demand basic.[/quote] In the USA, perhaps this is so, and I can see why they are more popular because they seem to be getting a better overall financial deal on the basses, and obviously closer contact with the company. Ship them over here, pay VAT, customs, shipping or pay a little extra and get one from one of the outlets, and THEN it isnt such a great deal. I realise we suffer quite a bit with most products like this, but when the product is already high end, its an extra sting. Dont even get me started on how I view the way these basses are sold here. That winds me up even more. Something like this needs a bass specialist, not a general guitar/music shop as most the workers and normally guitarists with no or very little bass knowledge. Obviously the Bass Gallery are the best to contact!

[quote name='Mark Latimour' post='964216' date='Sep 22 2010, 10:40 AM']Right, so you haven't played one. I guess that kinda says all one really needs to know about your opinion on the actual value of the basses in the hands of a player. On the "theoretical" pricing debate, my point is simply that bass pricing is whatver the bass pricing is. You can be as upset as you like about the fact that you can't afford it or that, even if you could, you don't think its worth it. However, that's basically irrelevant because its clear that the market thinks the basses are worth it. There are plenty of bass companies that disconinue models etc because the market thinks those models arn't worth it. OTOH it seems pretty silly to me to bang on about how a bass with a 6 month+ waiting list "isn't worth it" (and i'm not suggesting that's what you are saying). To be honest, I would struggle to be able to justify buying another Sadwosky at their current prices, but I don't think they arn't worth it, I just realise that I can't afford what they cost. There is a big difference. NOw, there are some basses out there that I do think charge more than I would be willing to pay for a bass, but I don't think that they arn't worth it (they also have waiting lists), I just appreciate theres a difference between my valuation of the bass and the markets valuation. Put simply: if something's overpriced it won't sell, if it sells, whether or not you'd be prepared to buy it is irrelevant to pricing consideration and I see little value in posting in a thread complaining about price if you wouldn't buy it anyway.[/quote] Read it again. Its not like I havent played one. I have played 3 or so. I even went back in to see if it was just the amp etc causing me to wonder what the fuss was about. I dont understand the comment about not being able to afford one. Is that aimed at me? I looked into buying one of these (yes a NYC and a Metro) and I even thought about going over there and having a holiday at the same time. Anyway, thats pointless arguing whether someone can or cannot afford one, and again is just being a little bit patronising to not just myself, but anyone who reads this. I dont like it when for no reason people start being overly aggressive on here. Its the internet, not real life. A forum like this doesnt normally have such comments. Waiting list....? Virtually all companies bar the big production companies like Fender have waiting lists. On contact with Lakland a month ago, they have a 4 month waiting list on their 44-60 Jazz bass. Ive even known Fender to have waiting lists at some points.

Orange Thunderverb 200. Designed for both....serious low end if you like ultra dark and bassy type guitar tones eg Queens of The Stone Ages.

Excuse me, I have no incapability understanding anything around supply and demand. I would just take note that all we are doing is discussing, and trying to keep it friendly. I wouldnt start attacking anyones understanding of business, espcially considering we dont know each others background/hobbies and occupation. Ive worked in small and extremely busy businesses whilst studying, and I understand how these basic principles work. Supply and demand, yes. No objection. Price? Well, I can say what I like. Its not like Ive not played one. Its seems as soon as someone touches a nerve, (for instance if there is a NYC or Metro owner reading) we all have to endure yet another attack on our opinion.

[quote name='Danny Clarke PROEL' post='964142' date='Sep 22 2010, 09:39 AM']Fair comments there from Spongebob, I will certianly have a word with the word with the workshop staff here as there has definatley been some crossed wires along the way. Whoever said that speakers are not covered under warranty was speaking out ot of turn. Every part of a markbass cabinet is covered under warranty but as I said before, in the case of a cone driver, it would depend on what the problem was. It is true that B&C offer a 3 year warranty on its standard catalogue products but no loudspeaker manufacturer would cover a burnt coil, or say the driver getting wet etc etc so warranty of driveres always has to be assesses on a case by case basis. Cheers Danny[/quote] Danny, thanks for clarifying it for all of us Markbass owners. Perhaps what might be a good idea is some sort of central email address where we can contact Proel straight away without any worry? Obviously I understand sometimes its best to goto the dealer, but sometimes its easier to contact you guys direct and then go from there. Cheers

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='964061' date='Sep 22 2010, 07:42 AM']Mine just sits on top of my amp so no danger of it getting broken. I also can live without it if it packed up. But for some reason I still want a BDDI. It just looks slot better and has more output options.[/quote] Its definitely, IMO, a great bit of kit. Solid and plug n play. When I started playing more gigs a few years back, EVERY bass player had one even if they didnt have other pedals. SOme used it for putting it through the amp, and some used it for DI'ing. Ive used it for both at once and it works well.

[quote name='CHRISDABASS' post='963509' date='Sep 21 2010, 04:38 PM']Ive just been speaking to roger about the mass production issue etc He read this thread and gave me these figures Average NYC production is 15-20 basses a month. Average Metro production is 40 basses a month, worldwide. We have 7 builders in the NY workshop. I bet fender do that in a day!! Lol[/quote] I wouldnt say thats small production though. Nothing is going to come close to the manic Fender production, but 40 Metros a month is still a fair few IMO.

The venue in my old town where we used to play a lot now has a no-beer rule for the stage. Good idea.

[quote name='Chris2112' post='963348' date='Sep 21 2010, 02:29 PM']I don't know about that, because when I played an NYC bass it was privately owned. I suppose a large part of my disappointment was that I was sitting down with a "Sadowsky", a name that has some much weight attached. And at the end of the day, when it's just a jazz bass and not a particularly outstanding one at that, you're bound to be left feeling disapppointed. I like jazz basses just as much as the next bloke, but for the same cash you could have a Sei or a Wal![/quote] This is the same as my experience, except I tried all Metros. They have outstandting fit and finish (and so they should) which id never argue with. [quote name='CHRISDABASS' post='963352' date='Sep 21 2010, 02:34 PM']Its gonna be interesting to see what happens to the opinion on Alleva's now Jimmy is using his new cnc machine for everything! [/quote] Exactly. Lets face it, if we were offered cash on something we'd worked on for years, hell yes Id sell and enjoy my life. Why not? In 5 years times Sadowsky and Alleva will be much larger names, and something else will be boutique. Same with a band. Id sell out in seconds if it meant earning and not stressing myself out being a trainee solicitor If I remember correctly, one underground hardcore band said (Coalesce): "Sometimes selling out is waking up."

[quote name='CHRISDABASS' post='963308' date='Sep 21 2010, 01:56 PM']I'd love to know how many metro's / laklands are made... I know that the New York shop makes around 20 basses per month so its pretty small scale really! You must have caught Kevin at a bad / busy time in the sadowsky office, ive had nothing but great service over the last few years, Ive even had strings, new volume pots and input jacks sent over to me for free just so i could try them out and i always get helpful replies to my questions. [/quote] I think they make Lakland Skylines in either groups of 30 or 60 according to the last time I asked them. Might be more now. Kevin seemed fine, it was Roger who seemed rather, hmm, I wont say anything rude.

Jees guys calm it! Dont get so defensive! We all chase the same thing on here I personally think at those prices, you are best off with a Sei, or an Alleva. Without a doubt. The NYCs arent everywhere here, but they are in the USA. I dont see, despite the fact I dont like how Lakland finish off their basses, why their is such a price difference on a fairly mass produced Metro cf to a Lakland Skyline. All made elsewhere then checked and fitted in the USA. Not a problem with that, but I dont see why they cost so much?! I wouldnt mind, but when I emailed them a fair while back, I felt slightly miffed at the somewhat sharp and slightly off responses. Made me realised If I had a problem with one once Id bought it, Id not feel happy complaining.

If you check Thomann these prices are virtually the same or more, so probably cheaper from Thomann! Still good prices mind.

IMO, expensive bit of kit.

I think a lot of TCs gig artists are using these amps with 3 cabs. If it wasnt recommended, they'd have units going back for repair all the time. I wont do it very often, but the option is there. Mainly I bought them to swap and change, and because at the time, before the price hike, they were very reasonable.