Mark Bass LM II pat test?

[ibanez]

Will doing a pat test on this amp without a cab plugged in damage it? Fussy venue, band getting rigs tested but I'm not there, so no cab plugged in.

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

It'll be fine. Its only valve amps where you'd need to worry about this.

[Phil Starr]

I don't think there is an issue here either but you could ask the venue if their insurance will cover your amp if it is damaged by their tester.

 

We had a venue try to book us for a cancellation, they wanted public liability insurance (what you don't have your own?!) and PAT testing. We do have insurance but no PAT testing. When I said we wouldn't do the gig because we didn't have time and the expense for a one off gig made it uneconomic it suddenly wasn't a problem A lot of social clubs in particular are run by committees who are unrealistic about what a band can provide at the ridiculously low charges we ask.

[ibanez]

Thanks, both. It's a charity organisation, who are no doubt tied up in reams of paperwork. None of our other regular venues have ever required this. I have a bunch of stickers, but they want a certificate listing the kit, signed by the tester.

 

[BassmanPaul]

Maybe I'm a bit slow today but what is a PAT test? 

[NickA]

Portable Appliance Test.  Hence PAT test is, like PIN number, a misnomer. but everyone says it.  Checks electrical equipment that's connected to mains to ensure no-one will get a belt off it ...in theory.

 

The test...Checks the plug earth pin is connected to any exposed metalwork and checks there is no leakage from live or neutral to ground.

 

Venues and health and safety oiks think it makes electrical kit safe to use and that it's lethal otherwise.

 

I have a PAT machine and a roll of stickers and a log book of stuff tested.  Easily done, I'm m not convinced it's worth the fuss but easier to do it than convince a health a safety oik that it's a waste of time.

[Lozz196]

Yeah, in our sites it used to be everything once a year, now for stuff like fridges etc they say every 3 years as although portable not many people shift them around that often. 

[tauzero]

12 hours ago, NickA said:

Portable Appliance Test.  Hence PAT test is, like PIN number, a misnomer. but everyone says it.

 

To be pedantic, PAT stands for Portable Appliance Testing, so PAT test isn't the same RAS syndrome as PIN number (or ATM machine).

[Jakester]

This comes up a lot - a venue can insist you have your gear 'PAT-tested' as a condition of playing there, but it isn't a legal requirement on you to have it done and (other than making it a condition of allowing you to perform) no-one can force you to do it.

 

Employers are under an obligation to ensure the equipment that their employees use is safe under the Electricity at Work Regulations 1989, but the Regs don't specify how an employer is to do that. PAT testing is one way of meeting that obligation, but not the only one. 

 

Venues use it as a short hand for ensuring equipment is electrically safe, but you don't have to have it done. By insisting on it, they are trying to push their own responsibilities on you to try and avoid liability if someone is injured by your equipment, but it misunderstands a) their wider duties and b) the relationship between the venue, you, the audience, and their own staff. 

 

I often ask for a copy of their own electrical inspection certificates if asked for PAT records and you'd be surprised how often they can't provide them....

 

You can also buy a portable appliance tester, do the competent person test (which is online) and then you can do your own, if you want. 

[BassmanPaul]

I thought it couldn't be as simple as patting your amp and saying 'There's a good amplifier!' LOL

 

[NickA]

5 hours ago, BassmanPaul said:

I thought it couldn't be as simple as patting your amp and saying 'There's a good amplifier!' LOL

 

Probably as useful and the amp will appreciate it 🙂 

[synthaside]

On 11/06/2025 at 14:14, Jakester said:

I often ask for a copy of their own electrical inspection certificates if asked for PAT records and you'd be surprised how often they can't provide them....

 

I will definitely be doing this in the future ... we got all of our gear tested for a birthday gig at a rugby club a bit back, not so much of an issue as our singer's husband works in Movie production in sound and lighting and  " borrowed a tester from work " which prints the certificate too 

Aforementioned rugby club literally pointed to a corner where the only wall plug showed obvious signs of being Burnt out ... we didnt dare use one ... instead ran a long cable from over near the DJ ... who moaned about it.
We also recently played a rehearsal space ... where i kept getting a mild electric shock through my mic into my lips ..   then venue swore up and down it was fine ... they came and checked it no shock ... when they touched the mic with a hand so clearly no issue.

Turns instruments have grounds and the fault was in the wall cicruit "  so as i played and sang bass i was shorting the PA and bass amp VIA MY LIPS dug about on the net as to what was happening
 a reddit post / article explaining the likely fault with enough detail they had it tested which failed hard.

We have " some discounted rehearsals " but im not sure i fancy it again ... 

[Jakester]

3 minutes ago, synthaside said:

Turns instruments have grounds and the fault was in the wall cicruit "  so as i played and sang bass i was shorting the PA and bass amp VIA MY LIPS dug about on the net as to what was happening
 a reddit post / article explaining the likely fault with enough detail they had it tested which failed hard.

We have " some discounted rehearsals " but im not sure i fancy it again ... 

 

Yikes! 

 

As someone who's been injured by dodgy equipment in a rehearsal room in the past, and have the scar to prove it, I absolutely wouldn't be going anywhere near it again!

[Phil Starr]

First of all I don't think getting a trained electrician to look at all your leads once a year is a bad idea particularly if you are not a technical person yourself. If they are PAT testing thenthey are also handling and looking at your leeds and are more likely to spot something dodgy than you are. It won't spot everything but it will improve your odds. If everyone on Bass Chat did it then it might only avoid one injury a year (I have no data, so this is an entirely made up no) but that might be a decent pay off. Just Saying.

 

As to house wiring in venues, I've had numerous mild shocks and the occaisional 230V from poor wiring. I've found sockets entirely incorrectly wired but more frequently floating earths. You have no guarantee that all the sockets in a room are wired to the same circuit, The wires have resistance especially if there are a number of poorly wired joints in the circuit. The end result is an earth that is considerably higher than 0V which is fine if everything you use is connected to the same earth and nothing goes wrong. Big buildings also have three phase mains inputs and the sockets can be on separate phases giving a voltage difference between them. they shouldn't be next to each other but in old buildings someone will have taken a short cut wiring in an extra socket. Anyway I've measured 45V difference between earths which is plenty enough to make a little spark between lips and mic. I always run our gear off a single socket meaning that they are all earthed to the same point. We only draw around 5A with everything plugged in so a 13A socket and 30A ring main is going to be fine with the load

 

[Chienmortbb]

There are many ways of looking at PAT. Before there were really defined standards, Panasonic would revoke the guarantee on any item that had a PAT test label. If we go back many years, especially the early days of valve amps, there were some lethal products around and the dangers were very real, but the various standards passed in the intervening years mean that equipment itself is very safe. 

 

The venues are another matter, as @Phil Starrhas mentioned. A socket tester is your friend https://www.screwfix.com/p/kewtech-kewcheck-103-13a-socket-tester-230v-ac/45558.

 

The other point is that your lips are ultra snsitive and a very small elctrostatic charge could be just as likely from a microphone. Perhaps a foam shield? https://www.andertons.co.uk/shure-a58ws-blk-foam-windscreen-for-sm58-beta58a-sm48-and-565sd-mics/ will both protect you from shocks and also protect your mic from saliva. 

[BassmanPaul]

I agree that a socket tester should be a vital part of a gigging musicians equipment. Before I left the UK I saw many instances of dangerous practices. One I'll never forget was a 13A plug with about fifty feet of doorbell wire connecting to a VOX AC30. I was terrified for the player!