Most Round-Like Flats

[dmc79]

Hi all, I'm considering my first foray into flats after playing rounds for about 25 years. In the last year or two, I got sick of the zingy break-in period, cheese grater feel & finger noise of nickel plated steel rounds, and have been playing rollerwound GHS Pressurewounds since. I'd say they are the best strings I've played to date - I love the considerably reduced finger squeak, and smoother than NPS rounds feel, but I'm wondering if they will become a gateway into proper flats. My 'E' is rather dead, and I'd like to reduce (well, more remove really!) the string noise even on these and go even smoother. So I figure it's as good a time as any to try some flats. 

 

I play a 4 string Precision (top load bridge), through a Tone Hammer DI (AGS on), into IEMs. I play 2/3 pick, 1/3 fingers. I don't gig in the traditional sense, I mainly play in a church worship band. More contemporary than traditional - the usual Hillsong / Bethel / Elevation type stuff for those who are familiar - the bass on which can be quite gritty on many songs. I like to have a touch of grit from the THDI, but minus the finger screech that gets worse with every slight clockwise turn of the gain knob, that is anything past 9 o'clock. I don't bother with effects, I just want a great driving tone with a little grit. 

 

I've always liked playing with the tone fully open. This may be sacrilege to some, but any time I roll the tone knob back, I just don't like the muffled sound that comes out. So I like a fairly bright sound. A mellow, motown, dark, dull thump is most certainly not my thing, and I won't be putting foam anywhere near my strings. For this reason the demos with tone at 0% and 50% don't interest me. Fortunately I've been able to see some demos with both pick & finger play with tone wide open. 

 

I realise that what I don't like is what a lot of people do like in flats, but I'm sure there will be others (show yourselves!) who also want a bright-ish, grindy, growl yet with smooth feel and no finger noise, if such a thing exists. I'd like a sort of happy medium in terms of stiffness, I certainly don't want anything floppy, I guess I will veer towards the stiffer side, yet without wanting anything too bridge cable like. Tension wise, I guess something down the middle again - I don't want anything too crazy that'll need me adjusting my setup majorly. 

 

I've heard of sets of flats lasting years, but honestly I'm not too bothered about longevity, I'm happy to change a set once a year. I'd like them to remain reasonably bright anyway, so if they mellow out too much I'll only want to replace them anyway. I've been reading a bunch of threads and watching demo videos, and will order a set soon, but am hoping to get some opinions on these, especially from those who use flats for similar reasons to what I'm thinking. There are others of course (such as GHS Precision, Dunlop, Ernie Ball Group 2/3, DR Legend), but my research has led me to believe that these seem to be the most popular. I'm most likely to pick from the top 3:

 

Fender 9050 

I'm quite impressed with these from various demos. Seems to be a good all rounder, and is a fair bit cheaper than others at £40, where most other flats range from £50-£80. I've read that it has decent low-mid grind/growl and is a bit similar in tone to TI Jazz, but less flappy. They seem fairly bright and less dark than chromes. Right now this is the front runner for me to try, it would be a relatively inexpensive experiment. 

 

D'Addario Chrome XL 

I had some briefly on a used Mustang, I thought they felt pretty good, yet still replaced them with rounds before I even had chance to play it properly with the flats on, then sold the bass soon after anyway. This seems to be a real 'Marmite' string - people either seem to love or hate them. I'm sure I've read more negative comments than positive ones. It seems those who like them really like them. I've read that they have good clarity & punch. They are bright, yet a little dark sounding. I've also read that they have a long break-in period, need some patience, then just die rather quickly. They have a hi-mid metallic clank / zing, and are quite scooped. It seems they are not as smooth as other flats, and can be sticky / grabby. I like some of the demos, but they are little dark compared to the Fenders. Apparently they have a bridge cable stiffness, and for this reason I'm not sure about them. 

 

La Bella Deep Talkin' Bass

These seem to be perennial faves - smooth and well balanced. I had some very briefly on a bass which I passed on so quickly I'm not even sure I gave the strings a proper go plugged in, but they felt amazing to play acoustically. I'm just not entirely sure they're what I want based on demos. 

 

La Bella Low Tension Flats

I'm ruling these out based on them not being the sound I'm after at all. Probably too flappy for me as well. 

 

TI Jazz

I like the sound of these in demos more than some, but not as much as others. The fact they are meant to be very flappy, along with the price, has me pretty much ruling these out. 

 

Ernie Ball Slinky Cobalt 

I've read that these feel like flats, but sound like rounds. This interests me, but I've also read that some have had issues with fret wear, rust, and stickiness. They are at the more expensive end too. 

 

Rotosound Jazz Bass 77

These sound quite bright, but reading that they have very high tension, are tiring on the fingers & have low output, puts me off trying them. 

 

Thanks in advance for replies. 

Edited 13 hours ago by dmc79

[fretmeister]

I've tried all of those.

 

The La Bellas are definitely out for you - they are the sound of Motown.

 

TI Jazz are lovely but are low tension.

 

The Rotos are massive tension and they are very bright for about a week and then the brightness falls off a cliff. Steve Harris of Iron Maiden changes his every single show. John Deacon had them on his P bass too and you can hear how different his tone is to Harris'.

 

Fender - nice string indeed. Reasonably bright, nice feel under the fingers. I do wish they changed their gauges though. The E can be a bit floppy compared to the rest.

 

EB Cobalts - I have these on a PJ at the moment. They are not bad but I do find they feel a bit weird under the fingers for some reason. Once they die I will not get another set. They are bright but you still won't get a Marcus Miller type brightness out of them

 

One you haven't mentioned - EB Group Flats. These are the other EB flats. Stainless steel. They are not quite as bright as the Cobalts but it's very close once you've EQ'd everything to taste. They feel much nicer to me under the fingers. They will do a good 1970s chunky slap sound brightness.

 

Hope that helps a bit.

 

 

[dmc79]

Many thanks for the detailed reply. The more videos I watch, the more I like the Fender 9050. I guess this isn’t the cup of tea of many flat users, but the sound of these with tone fully open, with both fingers & pick, is the closest so far to the kind of sound I’m wanting, kind of growly but without the finger noise of rounds. 3:43 (after he removes the foam!) - 5:00

 

 

Edited 12 hours ago by dmc79

[Reggaebass]

Just to add, labella LTFs and the TIs aren’t floppy, they are lower tension though than the others mentioned, I also had the fender flats and they are fairly high tension , maybe look at labella 760 FS they are a nice string that still have brightness even when played in 

[dmc79]

Well I really love the 9050 here. They’re in the blind test results at 1:48 (sorry for revealing!), and with tone wide open with pick at 7:24 where they sound exactly like what I want. He states that these are all slightly worn in flats. This also features La Bella LTF but not DTB. 
 

 

Edited 12 hours ago by dmc79

[dmc79]

One last video for now. I keep coming back to this one. This has La Bella DTB but not LTF. Again the Fenders sound good to me (1:06 & 2:47):

 

 

Edited 11 hours ago by dmc79

[fretmeister]

This is my shortie with the Fender flats on it:

 

 

 

I did have the bass tone rolled down a fair bit but you can hear the growl coming through.

 

Thinking about it - I really like this tune and I have a variety of flatwounds on various basses at the moment. I might record it again with all the different basses. Just for curiosity really.

[ezbass]

2 hours ago, dmc79 said:

 

Ernie Ball Slinky Cobalt 

I've read that these feel like flats, but sound like rounds. This interests me, but I've also read that some have had issues with fret wear, rust, and stickiness. They are at the more expensive end too. 

For me, the most round wound sounding of all the flats (that I’ve tried). Never had any stickiness or fret wear (I equate stickiness with LaBellas, easily remedied). There was a period when there batches with spots of rust/discolouration (I had one string with this, but it was free set, so no cause for complaint), but this seems to be in the past. Buying from the Ernie Ball shop on Amazon seems to be the cheapest option for particular gauges (£42 for 45-100).

[fretmeister]

The EB Group flats are a lot cheaper on Amazon too - far cheaper than places like Strings Direct.

 

I wonder if Amazon has a deal going with EB.

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

I use EB cobalt flats on four thunderbirds and a rickenbacker. Never understood the 'sticky' complaint — they've always felt fine to me, and I have never had any with rust or discolouration. They are a lot brighter than all the other flats I have played and the brightness seems to last a very long time. I really like them. I use the lightest set, the one with blue on the packaging.

[Hellzero]

Here's my stone to the building.

 

Just like you, I like flatwounds that almost sound like roundwounds, but for other reasons.

 

I don't play with a plectrum, but I play fretless 99,99% of the time, so looking for the same overall feeling as you, but not for the same use.

 

I've tried almost everything available, yes it cost me quite a lot, but I always managed to resell the sets I didn't like.

 

I also have one question for you @dmc79 : Do you play in the higher register?

 

It's important, because a lot of flatwounds sound weird past the octave, out of tune in fact, even with a perfectly set-up intonation and it's more obvious on the E and A strings (linked to the construction)...

 

With that in mind, the best flatwound strings are the DR Legend, but they are a bit too dark for your liking, or the Dogal Hellborg Perfect Pitch Flat Wounds, but they are too floppy for your taste (and very expensive).

 

To me, the Fender 9050 are the perfect flatwound strings for your needs (and mine) and their intonation has improved over the years, certainly thanks to more control and precision during the manufacturing  process at the factory.

 

Frankly, the Ernie Ball cobalts are as dull as possible.

 

The D'Addario Chromes are so stiff you could tow a truck with them, just like the Rotosound 77's and absolutely not the kind of tone you're after.

 

The Thomastik Infeld Jazz flatwounds are really good, very close to what you're asking, but the low tension is not a plus for you and sometimes the E sting may sound a bit dead to the ears, just like the LaBella Low Tension which are darker than the TI flatwounds.

 

The LaBella Deep Talkin' Bass will not suit you as they are indeed the sound of Motown as @fretmeister said.

 

You may also consider these Harley Benton flatwounds as they are close to the TI flatwounds sound wise, only stiffer and really cheap, worth a try even if the sanding process (to flatten the string) is not perfect, but won't be an issue with a fretted bass : https://www.thomann.co.uk/harley_benton_hqs_bass_45_100_flatwound.htm

 

Good luck with your quest.