Rich Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 16 hours ago, KevB said: Magic plectrum shot from the grassy knowle. Knowle is many things, but 'grassy' isn't really one of them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plangentmusic Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 Sounds like Jamerson to me, but Carol can get funky. Here she is with Joe Pass on guitar! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmo Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 If Carol Kaye says it was her line, I am in no position to argue. I don`t know what she would have to gain by lying, as she has achieved more records on a hit then we all have put together on this forum, It was an interesting clip, so thanks for posting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewine Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 On 3/5/2018 at 15:39, EssentialTension said: Jack, you just had to bring up the Beatles again, oh dear. Yeah, becareful. Some folks here go insane over Beatle issues. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 7 hours ago, Bluewine said: Yeah, becareful. Some folks here go insane over Beatle issues. Blue Do they? Heeheehee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectoremg Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Where's that Canadian BCer who got v irate the last time it was discussed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 I'm a bit surprised that people would think Jamerson couldn't or wouldn't have played an orchestral bass part - as well as the bass groove work he played on many tracks with full orchestra. I also find it surprising that Motown would have used anyone but Motown players on their tracks until they moved to the West Coast and even then you would wonder why they would move away from a winning formula. All that said, I don't doubt Carol Kaye's ability and absolutely jaw dropping back catalogue. She is great. The track posted is interesting - I don't however hear the pick referred to at points. As for the Beatles - we haven't had a thread for a while to remotely challenge their national treasure status. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staggering on Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 36 minutes ago, spectoremg said: Where's that Canadian BCer who got v irate the last time it was discussed? It was NOT this Canadian! ...and Canadians rarely get irate... Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 25 minutes ago, drTStingray said: I'm a bit surprised that people would think Jamerson couldn't or wouldn't have played an orchestral bass part - as well as the bass groove work he played on many tracks with full orchestra. I also find it surprising that Motown would have used anyone but Motown players on their tracks until they moved to the West Coast and even then you would wonder why they would move away from a winning formula. All that said, I don't doubt Carol Kaye's ability and absolutely jaw dropping back catalogue. She is great. The track posted is interesting - I don't however hear the pick referred to at points. As for the Beatles - we haven't had a thread for a while to remotely challenge their national treasure status. Just to reinforce your point here are some search results just from the General forum: Only Four results Two pages of results. Nope, not much to see here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, SpondonBassed said: Just to reinforce your point here are some search results just from the General forum: Slow day, huh..? ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 33 minutes ago, drTStingray said: I also find it surprising that Motown would have used anyone but Motown players on their tracks until they moved to the West Coast and even then you would wonder why they would move away from a winning formula. Why breakup a winning team? If your ego is big enough you can break anything. It seems Gordy would do anything to get into Hollywood. A lot of the creative talent was leaving Motown towards the end so maybe the ship was sinking anyway. Motown used many players in LA. Wilton Felder on ABC etc. Many of the LA tracks were released, and some, as we know, were rerecorded in Detroit. That is probably where the claims and discrepancies come from. Plus when the session guys were given a chance to get royalties from their work, they were screwed by having to apply for each track in a pretty short time scale. Even more scope for inaccuracies! I would imagine Carol Kaye's record keeping is pretty good, maybe better than the guys in Detroit (?), but she wouldn't know about the overdubs and rerecording that went on after. At one point JJ claimed to be the bass player on Cool Jerk, even though Bob Babbitt played on it. It seems things were not so clear cut back then and certainly don't look any clearer from the outside today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 42 minutes ago, Dad3353 said: Slow day, huh..? ... Yup. As a moderator you've seen this recurring debate more often than I. Poor you. At least I can choose not to read it. It makes for compulsive reading though and I get sucked into it every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, drTStingray said: As for the Beatles - we haven't had a thread for a while to remotely challenge their national treasure status. I was speaking figuratively and being ironic! I meant there haven't been any in a couple of weeks - the last big controversy I recall was over some of Quincy Jones' recent Alf Garnett equivalence comments which touched on the Fab 4!! 55 minutes ago, chris_b said: Why breakup a winning team? If your ego is big enough you can break anything. It seems Gordy would do anything to get into Hollywood. A lot of the creative talent was leaving Motown towards the end so maybe the ship was sinking anyway. Motown used many players in LA. Wilton Felder on ABC etc. Many of the LA tracks were released, and some, as we know, were rerecorded in Detroit. That is probably where the claims and discrepancies come from. Plus when the session guys were given a chance to get royalties from their work, they were screwed by having to apply for each track in a pretty short time scale. Even more scope for inaccuracies! I would imagine Carol Kaye's record keeping is pretty good, maybe better than the guys in Detroit (?), but she wouldn't know about the overdubs and rerecording that went on after. At one point JJ claimed to be the bass player on Cool Jerk, even though Bob Babbitt played on it. It seems things were not so clear cut back then and certainly don't look any clearer from the outside today. Yeah I generally agree - didn't Wilton Felder play because the booked player failed to show up? One thing is for sure, Carol Kaye, good as she is, was certainly no 60s/70s black R and B bass player - all of those guys played with a feel and authority very few could emulate - it was readily apparent in live performances I went to throughout the 70s - as I became more and more exposed to it through a changing personal musical taste it really changed my approach to playing. Bob B, Alan Spenner and a handful of others could play totally like this - my theory is their bass playing was rooted from the outset in that style or was fundamentally influenced by it. It certainly isn't apparent in, for instance Beach Boys recordings - not that those don't have their own appeal - it is just totally different. Edited March 10, 2018 by drTStingray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 17 minutes ago, SpondonBassed said: ...and I get sucked into it every time. S'not you the sucker, then, huh..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 17 minutes ago, drTStingray said: One thing is for sure, Carol Kaye, good as she is, was certainly no 60s/70s black R and B bass player - I'm not disagreeing. I don't think Kaye ever claimed to be JJ. I think she was just claiming the sessions she played on and a couple (out of the 1000's) may well have been claimed in error. Back then songs would be recorded and rerecorded for singles, albums and for various other artists. Lots of chances to play on different versions of hit records and when you add in the overdubbing of parts the puzzle becomes more and more complicated. I think she got a couple wrong, but IMO that doesn't take anything away from her being one of the top players in the history of electric bass playing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassace Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 There was a programme on the recording of Pet Sounds BBC4 last night. CK was spoken of very highly and it was great to see her at work and hear that great pick sound straight from the desk. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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