Dolando Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 I would like to know if a 300 Watt 8 ohm head would struggle to get a decent volume out of a 500 Watt 8 ohm cab? Only need it be loud enough for a 5 piece band practice and small/medium size gigs. I know under-powering is ok as long as you don't push the output to the point of saturation, just wanted to make sure that this would be loud enough for what I want, and not pushing both amp and cab to their limits. Cheers, Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 [quote name='Dolando' timestamp='1322666827' post='1454185'] I would like to know if a 300 Watt 8 ohm head would struggle to get a decent volume out of a 500 Watt 8 ohm cab? Only need it be loud enough for a 5 piece band practice and small/medium size gigs. I know under-powering is ok as long as you don't push the output to the point of saturation, just wanted to make sure that this would be loud enough for what I want, and not pushing both amp and cab to their limits. Cheers, Adam [/quote] What is the make of cab and what drivers does it have (1x15, 2x12, 4x10 etc) and tbh Adam, the most important bit of info is missing... the sensitivity of the cab! Essentially you'd be able to get about 200-250 watts out of the amp but that is just maths figures it doesn't tell you/us how loud your guitarists/drummer play and what PA support you have. More info needed and then most folks would still probably say "Give it a go and see". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperbob 2002 Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 You will be fine pal- 300w is sufficient for most any cab. Bear in mind it`ll only put out 300w if your master and input gain are max`d out. most players use much much less than 300w. Bit like motorbikes- I have one that has 180 bhp at the back wheel- but can I use that? Not very often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Possibly. As mentioned above there are a lot of factors in play here that we cant make absolute judgements without. Its worth a go though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolando Posted November 30, 2011 Author Share Posted November 30, 2011 Cheers for the replies. The cab is an Ampeg 410HE 500 Watt cab, Sensitivity is 89dB. With regards drummer, he can be loud but tends to be pretty controlled, same goes with the guitarist. Appreciate the reply, looking at a new head for the ampeg cab....was looking at Markbass little mark 3, or little mark tube 500....not sure yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 300 watts into that cab will be fine. Put a 210 on top and you'll have a great rig. I used an Ampeg SVT3PRO with my 410HE. It made a great noise and was loud enough for any band. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Yep, I had one of those cabs, and used a TC Classic 450 into it - which with one 8 ohm cab pushes about 300 watts. I only ever had the amp on 4 on volume. For gigs I added a 210 from the same range, but this was more due to wanting to than ever needing to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monckyman Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 I`m using a Little Mark II into all sorts of Ampeg cabs including the 410 and it provides great power and tone. A couple of bands I`ve played for have complimented the warmth of the sound from that rig with no pedals or pre-amps. The only con for me (and it`s not really) is the Markbass does clean very well, it`s very honest and transparent,so most Rock players tend to add a valve pedal or pre-amp like a Sansamp or it`s cheap clone the Behringer BDDI or in my case a Dave Hall VHA1. But, you don`t really need those add ons unless you must have a valve sound.They sound fantastic on their own too. The LM II or III wil give you 300watts at 8ohms and 500watts at 4ohms if you use two 8ohm cabs together or a single 4ohm cab. Plenty to scare any drummer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 [quote name='Dolando' timestamp='1322668633' post='1454216'] Cheers for the replies. The cab is an Ampeg 410HE 500 Watt cab, Sensitivity is 89dB. With regards drummer, he can be loud but tends to be pretty controlled, same goes with the guitarist. Appreciate the reply, looking at a new head for the ampeg cab....was looking at Markbass little mark 3, or little mark tube 500....not sure yet... [/quote] Providing you aren't a quiet player with a light touch..this should be ample, all things considered in your line-up..ie...most importantly...gtr and drums aren't excessively loud. One man's loud though...???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolando Posted November 30, 2011 Author Share Posted November 30, 2011 Cheers Monckyman, glad to hear the Mark Bass and ampeg go well together. I'm still unsure in a solid state amp, so was possibly thinking about the little Mark tube 500, but have heard its not very valvy for a valve head and do hear very good things about the little Mark 3. Also, i know about it going to 4 ohms with 2 cabs, would just like a 4x10 with head setup. may add a 2x10 one day.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 If you`re thinking about a 210, keep your eyes open for the SVT210HE, and if one come along, snap it up, as it`s unfortunately a discontinued model. They do crop up once in a while. Pairs well with the 410, and also visually matches of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazza1 Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 [quote name='Dolando' timestamp='1322668633' post='1454216'] Cheers for the replies. The cab is an Ampeg 410HE 500 Watt cab, Sensitivity is 89dB. With regards drummer, he can be loud but tends to be pretty controlled, same goes with the guitarist. Appreciate the reply, looking at a new head for the ampeg cab....was looking at Markbass little mark 3, or little mark tube 500....not sure yet... [/quote] Why not try the Ampeg PF-500? I have one & they are cracking amps, 350 watts @ 8ohm & 500 watts @ 4 ohm. Someone was selling one recently on here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 [quote name='Dolando' timestamp='1322666827' post='1454185']I would like to know if a 300 Watt 8 ohm head would struggle to get a decent volume out of a 500 Watt 8 ohm cab? Only need it be loud enough for a 5 piece band practice and small/medium size gigs.[/quote] This isn't how it works. Forget the power handling rating you see on bass cabs - it's always the thermal power handling rating and that tells you almost nothing of use. If manufacturers quoted honest sensitivity and mechanical power handling ratings (that being the limiting factor with bass guitar) then that would allow you to work out the loudness - but very few do! Basically the bigger the cab the less power you need to reach a given volume (SPL) level. It's possible to make a smaller cab as loud as a bigger cab but only by giving up some fatness/bottom, so if you have to EQ that back in then you end up using more power so size wins out when it comes to sensitivity. Think of it like sailing boats. The size of the cab is like how big your sails are. The power you have available is like how strong the wind is. The bigger your sails the faster the boat will go for a given amount of wind. If the wind is less you can get the same speed by using a bigger sail. Boat speed = loudness, sail size = sensitivity, wind speed = amp power. A lot of people assume that you'll need more power to push more speakers - but you don't hear speakers moving, you hear air moving. So the more speakers you have, the easier it is to get more air moving. If you look at Ampeg's range of cabs, on the whole the bigger the cab the higher the thermal power handling (because it has more/bigger speakers in it) but the less the power needed to reach a certain loudness because the bigger the cab the higher the sensitivity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolando Posted December 2, 2011 Author Share Posted December 2, 2011 Hello, sorry about the late reply, I was reading it whilst my girlfriend was hear and was moaning at me for it...she's gone now...so can carry on talking about amps. ha [quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1322692152' post='1454703'] If you`re thinking about a 210, keep your eyes open for the SVT210HE..... [/quote] Will keep an eye out, but as i said (i think) I would quite like a small simple rig, just a head and a 4x10. Used to run a Hartke 1x15 and a 2x10, just got fed up with carting it all around. [quote name='tazza1' timestamp='1322698350' post='1454791'] Why not try the Ampeg PF-500? I have one & they are cracking amps, 350 watts @ 8ohm & 500 watts @ 4 ohm. Someone was selling one recently on here. [/quote] Have had a brief look into them, still got some more reading to do on them before i commit. I do like the sound of these Mark Bass amps though.... Thanks for the great analogy alex, think I get what you're saying....So, with the same 300 Watt amp will perform better running a 4x10 that say a 1x15? Or are you talking multiple cabs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 [quote name='Dolando' timestamp='1322784839' post='1456005'] ....I would quite like a small simple rig, just a head and a 4x10. Used to run a Hartke 1x15 and a 2x10, just got fed up with carting it all around.... [/quote] [size=4]I don't think there's going to be much difference in weight between Hartke and Ampeg cabs, they both weigh a ton. If you like Markbass I'd also look out for an MB 410 cab.[/size] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_S Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1322788649' post='1456022'] [size=4]If you like Markbass I'd also look out for an MB 410 cab.[/size] [/quote] Completely agree - the Standard 104 HR is quite modestly sized and weighs very little for a 4x10, and it reaches incredible levels of volume with my LMII whilst still managing to sound 'classy'. Not cheap, but worth every penny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 [quote name='Dolando' timestamp='1322784839' post='1456005']Thanks for the great analogy alex, think I get what you're saying....So, with the same 300 Watt amp will perform better running a 4x10 that say a 1x15? Or are you talking multiple cabs.[/quote] The 300W amp will usually be louder with whichever cab is biggest, so 8x10", 4x12", 6x10", 2x15", 4x10", 2x12", 1x15", 2x10", 1x12", 1x10", in descending order. If you're comparing ported and sealed cabs, the port makes the cab act a couple of sizes larger than a sealed version in terms of sensitivity. However, you also need to consider the real power handling - the mechanical (excursion limited) power handling, which is how much air the woofers can move before farting out - which is often vastly less than the quoted (thermal) power handling. Your 410HE can probably handle about 150W excursion limited, whilst a ported 4x10" of similar quality would handle about twice as much. Our Barefaced cabs handle a lot more power than the norm, hence if you have the power (which most modern amps do) then they behave like they're much bigger than they really are. Lots more info on all things amp and cab related in the link in my signature - especially the articles from Bass Guitar magazine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolando Posted December 2, 2011 Author Share Posted December 2, 2011 Yea, to be honest i love the sound of my ampeg 4x10, and i don't mind having one cab thats a bit on the heavy side, just always found myself just using the 1x15 and would lose my top end clarity obviously. So decided to go with a nice single 4x10. Now do i buy a little Mark 2 for like £380 or a Little mark 3 for around 520. is it worth spending a little more for the newer one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 Not sure theres much to be gained with a LMIII, they were going to sort out the limiter to the power amp section, but apparently didnt in the end. I'd go with the LMII (assuming both a new) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolando Posted December 2, 2011 Author Share Posted December 2, 2011 Well the mark 3 is pretty much brand new, and the 2 has some marks, but have been told its all fully working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Then you have to weigh up how much a warranty is worth to you ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolando Posted December 5, 2011 Author Share Posted December 5, 2011 Just to let you all know, I got the Markbass 2 and I used it with my ampeg 4x10 at practice last night and it sounds AMAZING. I'm really happy with it. I also got a warwick WCA 211 pro cab for £90, the guy selling the head was moving to Canada so needed to get rid of it. Really nice sounding cab, Absolute bargain...don't really need it, but was far too cheap not to buy it. A cheeky pic for your enjoyment [url="http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/192/38742310150408976823511.jpg/"]http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/192/38742310150408976823511.jpg/[/url] Cheers for all the replies, was a great help. Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Yup, they are superb amps. Enjoy it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolando Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 I definitely will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottomE Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 That cab will take a pounding. I ran one with a Hartke 350 all at 8 Ohms and never stuggled to be heard. I also ran it with some louder amps and it just sat and winked there saying "Is that all you got". The cab gave me a bad back though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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