I bet Sheldon gets this on every thread that is ever created with the word, "fanned" and "frets" in.
I've read this thread with much interest and I'm still baffled by all the viewpoints on here.
Before I begin, I shall make a statement which I subscribe to: "At this level, there is no better, just different." This applies to most everything in the bass world and is appropriate for use in many threads.
Furthering on from this, we can question whether we need to spend so much money to get a boutique bass (I won't focus upon this, this has been talked about ad nauseum) for a certain level of performance - afterall, the workhorse jazz bass was good enough for Jaco and still remains the choice of guys like Marcus, and many, many pro players with exceptional musicality as well as blinding technique (lets not forget there are some people who can perform advanced techniques on some very cheap instruments). The majority of basses out there do not use fanned frets. As stated before, the fanned fret concept is not a new thing; its been around since the 80s yet still hasn't caught on as much as you would expect - given that people claim that it is such an improvement over the standard, traditional layout.
As an example, which is better? Active or passive? Well, it depends upon what you are looking for. If you want an active sound, you need to go active. If you want a passive, then obviously, go passive. Those in the know, know that a passive/active switchable circuit is a half way house. The tone pot values for an active circuit do not lend themself to a passive... and maybe should be seen as a "get out of jail free... for when your batteries or active circuit fail". What am I talking about this for? Well, the same thing goes for fanned frets... playing chords is a bit of a nightmare at points on the fanned fret neck... and if you think that the stretch on Portrait of Tracey is bad on a 35" scale, try it on one of Sheldon's basses! But that's the point, you select the correct bass for the job. Obviously, you wouldn't reach for a Dingwall if that is what you are playing... hence there should be space for other instruments in your collection.
So, lets look at fanned frets. I don't buy the intonation thing at all. Try telling Macca that intonation has hindered his bass playing career. OK, maybe you can't get the thing intonated as well as basses with compensated nuts, fully adjustable bridges... but has it been a stumbling point for the listeners? or the players for that matter? His record sales certainly don't appear to suggest that. (For those that don't know, a Hofner violin has a set bridge, that you can't intonate... and is short scale to boot!). Furthermore, the fact that you have relief in your neck and if you have have a medium or high action, you are going to influence your tuning, fanned frets or not, purely because your strings aren't parallel with the neck. (Fret spacing is set assuming a perfectly flat neck with a perfectly parallel string). Now add to the fact that's strings stretch, the pitch will change as a string is fretted and as it is vibrating. This is fact - check it with an accurate tuner to see.
Whether you lengthen the scale length, or shorten the scale length, this is all applicable. Even if you have the whole perfect intonation fret approach (with all the slightly offset weird looking frets), the way that the string lies against these frets
is going to influence tuning. At best, you are only going to get an approximation of something that is perfectly in tune.
OK, fanned frets do change the feel of the string - and this is where I feel the main benefit comes in. I think doddy said it all. It's not a solution to a tuning problem because regardless of the scale, the frets are all placed in accordance to the scale length. If you increase the scale length, the problem doesn't go away because relative to the scale length, the fret is still in exactly the same position. All 5 and 6 players (or 4 players who play with a low B ) will have felt a bass with a floppy B. Some basses have a more noticably floppy B than others which obviously can be less than desirable. Again, this is further influenced by the string type... The fact that the fanned fret supposidly gives a greater clarity than a standard fretted neck is definately open to discussion. Let's forget fanned frets systems for a while. Everybody (I'm assuming) has played a range of 4 string basses. Let's look at the jazz bass for example. A standard, 4 string, 34" scale jazz bass. All jazz basses are not the same; some sound dead, some sound lively, some play nicely, some don't. Some have strings that feel loose, some will sustain for years, some will give notes that die straight off. Added to the fact that alot of this can come from human perception, you can see that there are a lot of variables. Let start thinking about high mass bridges vs bent bits of tin, active circuits vs passive, bolt on necks (and how they are attached) vs through neck. Even the wood (and if you have graphite rods in the neck - even people say dual action truss rods influence your tone!) will effect the performance and tone of a bass - it's getting all these attributes working in harmony with each other that makes a great bass. Despite what any luthier may say, you can never tell what a bass will sound like until it's up and built - hell, even a pair of "identical" pickups can sound different and that's before you take into account the rest of the bass. The only manufacturers I can think of who stand half a chance of getting identical sounding bassses are the carbon fibre lot (of course, they are still at the mercy of the pickups! - nb, scatterwound is accepted as producing a more pleasing tone - but of course adds further chaos into getting identical pickups!). As LawrenceH said, you need to compare a number of two like for like basses (only difference being fanned frets) to get an appreciation of the real differences.
My belief is that the clarity of the B is mostly due to the ability of the pickup (and circuit if applicable) to sense the movement of the string and provide the output to the amplifier. I was there when Pete compared Dave Swift's Dingwall and GB B string. It was quiet at that point - and we all were surprised at how "normal" the bottom B of the Dingwall sounded. Regardless of being in a quiet environment or not - not having the clarity or definition defeats the point of having a solid B that cuts through if you need a quiet environment to cut through! I think the main reason there was such a difference in the B was down to the pickups and preamp. It would be interesting to compare a bass that has the same pickups and circuit as the Dingwall with a Dingwall to see the differences again. I think in the case at the bass show, there was very little in common with the two basses - scale length, through neck, pickups and circuits...
I'd like to hear a piezo on Dingwall - positioned at the bridge, that should *theoretically* be the best place to get the best defined bottom B out of an instrument.
Anyway, if you think a fanned fretted system is great... then great - but then again, this doesn't mean that all the other basses out there without franned frets aren't great aren't great or even superior to those with fanned frets. Maybe it's a solution to a problem that nobody else really had...? Let your hands and ears do the research... physics is great - but doesn't take into account the differences in pickups or composition of wood for instance. As Pete said earlier, see it as a feature rather than a requirement of a bass.
I think Sheldon's basses are great - they are certainly different and for some, the looks alone would be enough to get one. After spending some time with a few examples, they are a top class instrument with a great build quality and defo one that should be checked out. If I had money to burn, I'd have one for sure. Hell, I'd have two. Or three.
Grand Wazoo - it's great that you've found your brand but you shouldn't poo poo people's experiences or comments because a lot of this can be psychological, whether it be basses, amps, cabs or anything! How do we know that a Dingwall owner's perception of what is a tight sounding B is correct? - everybody has a honeymoon period when it comes to gear. How can you quantify the differences? In contrast to your experiences with your MMs, when I got my Stroborack, I did a very similar test to you, and was surprised at how in tune my basses are up the neck... but then again, I play with a ridiculously low action (which helps to avoid the tuning issues due to string alignment along the neck as discussed earlier) and am anal when it comes to intonation as I can't stand hearing out of tune chords on my bass. Oh and I wouldn't say owning a MM is embarassing in any means of the word - your Dingwall can't sound like a MM. If your gig requires a Stingray sound, you are pretty much stumped. PS, this isn't meant to be personal - I don't want this thread to disolve into a slagging match!
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[quote name='McBass' post='1178195' date='Mar 27 2011, 12:50 PM']Hi Steve,it's a couple of years old,it doesn't say on the pedal so i assume not....i do i tell the difference?[/quote] 2nd edition pedals say true bypass on the pedal.
[quote name='stingrayPete1977' post='1176076' date='Mar 25 2011, 03:59 PM']That's the one! Brilliant cabs if I had a 2ohm head I would be tempted for two [/quote] Buy another head and run a stereo rig.