JTUK

PLI though, Deffo

Ampeg and Berg seem the opposite end of the sound spectrum to me,...just as I wouldn't pair Ampeg up with SWR or Eden cabs of old either.

I have to go with the fawning/stalker thing here. If someone posts and you relate to it, then great, if you don't then that is just another poster. Relate to the person not the circus or all the rest.

You must know guys who play and who are out there gigging. Tap them up and see if they want to do another band. No one needs to stick with one band and most good players have more than that on the go. If you see someone whose playing you like..and you think your playing would fit in..talk to them at their gig and go from there.

I mention it as the SWR and Eden cabs are a step up from most cabs and they are tight and focused, imo. I always thought Eden and SWR were comparable and you went for one or the other as you preferred the mid bias on them. Although the 2510 is quite middy as a speaker, I never thought the SWR conversion worked out that well and didn't put out the bass as well as the originals. I think you might get a few people argue that the newer NEO Eminence outclass the the PAS SWR and Eden equivalent, if only through newer technology, but I recall being distinctly disappointed in the result and not worth it. As I say, I was forced into it through needing to repair/replaced the chassis and people told me it was a very good swap solution. I didn't think so. Good match up, on paper, maybe... not so much by my experience. As far as I am concerned basic specs can only indicate so much and it isn't until you have tried it, you get a proper perspective. My ears told me it didn't work. I could never A/B them..which you can if you retain the working Eden speakers, and you'll also have a pair to sell on.

I did it with an SWR Goliath jnr lll for Eminence 2510 NEO's. This is quite common and you can find these reviews on the web I didn't like the swap and only went for it as a repair/replacement as I couldn't get the original's replaced. Only improvement was the weight... but IMO, the cab wasn't the better for it at all. Sold them..but have spoken to quite few others who liked their same swap.....??????

[quote name='Clarky' timestamp='1330371944' post='1556442'] Fair comment John. I appreciate the answers everyone has given but its just I feel I am taking advice from those most inclined to err on the 5 side. If I had set up the poll as "4 or 5 string?" there would undoubtedly have been a much more mixed response with plenty pointing out that the greatest bass lines in history were almost all on 4 stringers. [/quote] I wouldn't say get one unless you were hearing the need to change. I can't see the point for points sake. My interest in them was because of the gig at the time and I was beginning to hear the possibilities if I played low.. so I was mentally working out my bass lines even then..prior to getting one. Had I known the work it would be for me..I would have thought even harder. Having made the switch, there is no way back for me, but I am not advocating they are a solution for everyone..far from it...because they certainly aren't, IMO.

Yep..always done this every month or so..and I hear the strings go off. I am not a slave to ultra bright anymore, but I need that edge so I liek to clean the bass. It can feel pretty gunky otherwise. Have to say, I am very impressed with my Newtone experiment..would recommned them in an instant.. opps.. I have

[quote name='Clarky' timestamp='1330334640' post='1555678'] Other than general interest, part of the reason underlying my OP was that I am "time poor" due to work, family etc and to become truly familiar with my 5-stringer will require quite a bit of practice and neglecting my 4 stringers ... so I was wondering if this is a worthwhile exercise or whether I should just stick with the familiarity of my 4 stringers [/quote] I think it depends how you play as to how long the 'change' will take. If you were just concerned with fretting in the right place and the left hand needed to get comfortable with the string spacing ..and the right hand plucking..then there isn't a whole lot of difference or hardship to have to contend with. If you have advanced techniques that are all about speed and precision, then you'll need to groove that in to be second nature. That will take you a LOT of time, IMO.

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1330350953' post='1555996'] I've owned two in the last 18 months but just don't really like them, mainly because I think the notes below low E sound pretty crap. I've thought this about pretty much every five string bass I've heard, regardless of how expensive it is. If I need to go below low E I'd rather use a synth - I'd buy another Chapman Stick before I'd consider buying a five string bass again as I think they sound much better than a bass for the low notes. [/quote] I ALWAYS say that the B defines a 5 st..and it is NOT a given that any model range will work and certainly not big production lines, IMO. You have to seek out that bass and try it.and you also have to keep the strings fresh. This takes maintenance if only for the string change. But if you have year old strings on a 5, then no... your B string will most likely stink regardless of how good your bass resonates normally, IMO.

No.. but I keep hearing good things about the SL112's but I am not sure I fancy the premium price of Neo against what is a lightweight cab at 40 odd lbs anyway.AFAIAC. Having said that..I'd be tempted to take a punt on ML112 if I could get them here from the U.S for a decent price and not waaaaay above a DB112 for example. The DB112 looks particular good value at £439, IMO.

The worst shop in my recent experience has been a chain... but I have had excellent service on the phone with a few smallish shops. If they have the stuff in stock they will get it to you asap. Bass Gallery, Mansons and GAK in Brighton have all been great, no problems. I might have been able to add Bass Merchant to that had they had what I wanted in stock at the time but they seemed to know what they were doing AFACT. Also the latter is now up and running again in a slightly new guise, IIRC. Google them for info/details

[quote name='paulypbass' timestamp='1330337579' post='1555740'] i see what u mean here.used a hartke HA5500 and a Ashdowb ABM 1 both are around 500 watt amps but the hartke pisses over the ashdown in terms or volume and head room. Theres so much more volume on the hartke Although what mondeos u been drinving that do 150.lol maybe the ST [/quote] ha ha ...... I was assured this guy's modeo ST was good for 150... but he said it got to 120 and stayed there for eons. Maybe the implication was that it might do it but it had basically run out of puff and was gasping beyond 120 I do recall passing him at a decent lick ...and I know BMW's do what they say on the tin.... The acceleation curve is steady and upward.and it will hit its top speed easily.

Anyone seen a Baer ML112 up close and/or heard one..?

Actually I'd agree that blithely adding low mids or this or that isn't always going to help you. You potentially are flooding a mix so it becomes a fight over whose is more powerful/loud which is not where you need to be going. You need your sounds to sit alongside each other.not get into a battle through a wall of noise. What I would do is play my bass with the drums in a simpy pattern, I'd EQ the bass so I heard everything across my bass range against this drum pattern. I would want gtr and keys to sit along side my bass rather than blow right over it. If it does the latter then the gtr can easily overpwer you which what you have to avoid. These instruments seem to be able to drop in and out of the band sound but the whole track works from bass/drums and that way this carries the track. The gtr and keys and anyone else should have the status of embelishments in the track whereas the bass and drums are fundementals so when they stop playing or solo, the track doesn't drop t the floor with a big hole in it. Most gtrs wash over EVERYTHING and do not realise that the world will not end if they don't have a part to play. Keys are harder in that 88's can cover the whole spectrum which is why you want the piano player in the guy to drop out his left hand. As I said..the education starts with frequency choices but extends way into parts and how the gtr constructs those. This is why you are in trouble if the one gtr the gtr brings along is a LP or an Ibanez I'll forgive the Les Paul,..just..

[quote name='BottomE' timestamp='1330339237' post='1555776'] Trouble is that being a muso makes it hard to see things through the eyes of the punter. We forget what its like even though we are punters ourselves. On another note i see you are "Down South". How far south are you? Dorset? [/quote] I am in Kent. I think we are all punters if we go and see a band so my observations are what they are If that means a bunch of musos come to see you and run their rule criteria over you then so be it. And anyway.. I can only view this the way it makes sense to me... I can't let a band off just because I might look at things differently from anyone else. but by the same token I can lighten up and enjoy an event for whatever reason it appeals Generally, though, I am quite a hard person to please in this musical regard and apply this to myself and other others in the band. Has caused a few rucks I can tell you, but I do it to make us better, that is my excuse and I am sticking to it..

Must admit 500w or so means very little to me beyond is it loud enough for MY purposes I equate it to cars and BHP and top speed etc ... you need to know what this really means in context with the car. A BMW and Mondeo will both do 150mph..for example, but there is a world of difference in how they do it. 500 watts from one amp, IME.. may not be like 500 in another in terms of how it handles it. Some amps will be puffing away to get to 500watts...others will do it easily and sound nowhere near as 'strained' Of course, these are subjective observations and not scientific, on my part.

I am in the essential camp as well. It took me a long time to get really comfortable and I like to be able to play as naturally and spontaneously as possible..or at least have that facility . so I need to know exactly where eveything falls to hand. I can't do this if I am constantly re-adjusting to scale, frets or string variations.. so I have 2 5 st jazzes which I use exclusively.

Now..strangely, I find that very interesting from a design POV. I am pretty sure I wouldn't go near one playing-wise, but I'd like to hang that on a wall in the house somewhere.

[quote name='BottomE' timestamp='1330286445' post='1555286'] big + 1 to this So many bands get caught up with the sound, technical ability, gear etc and forget that they are there to provide entertainment. 99% of punters don't care about your amp or strings or if you know every scale or some super duper chops. Its taken me about 20 years to realise this [/quote] Playing songs [pretty well can be entertainment in itself...but it is also true that most of the more popular bands round here have frontmen as opposed to singers. Personally, if a person can't sing and screeches everything, I can easily do without that all night.but that is what you get. I don't really care if he thinks he is the DB's and has the audience eating out their hands. I agree that that in itself is a art..but at the local level, you very very rarely get a frontman who is very charistmatic AND can sing. Give me a tune and a singer anyday rather than a screech anthem. Having said that ..there are two excellent vox about and they play in the same pick-up band, mostly. How galling is that..?? .

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1330190895' post='1553981'] There is a band round here like that - can't play to save their lives but nice guys who can mobilize lots of friends and family to pack out a couple of biggish local gigs in their part of town Local landlords love 'em as they will always sell a lot of beer, even if it is generally acknowledged that they aren't any good, but I don't think that they would want too many other bands like that otherwise they would drive a way their regulars who turn out to see better bands Of course this band only play regularly at these two venues as if they play out further away or even the other side of town they NEVER get rebooked! [/quote] Well, this band call themselves a function band..which I find incredible and they seem to rate themselves quite highly. Their pub set is dire in both choice and execution though and I don't think they alter it much for a function anyway.. I can understand the chummy songs being a matter of taste etc etc ... but the rest..!! As I say, I find it laughable. The guys are nice enough but it all puzzles me..

Another reason why I will not be crammed is that the bass player ends up with a cymbol in his back or whatever...and I think I have had years of ear damage through being too close to high volumes..and cymbols,in crammed places. You can play outside and have 5000watts of foldback and talk reasonably loud to be heard over the instruments so that is comfortable on the ears, yet you can get seriously deafened with excessive volume in small confined places. Last night in a marque was the first time in ages where I didn't have to wear ear plugs. So, that is my rule now..everyone else in the band needs space..so do I and without it the gig doesn't happen.

I'd just play them bass and drums together and suggest that this sound is underpinning the sound/mix...all happy, so far..? Anything on top of that that cloiuds the sound will be down to them..and therefore theirs to rectify. Now, if they don't accept/can't hear the difference or the point you a trying to make, then they have no chance of trying to fix it. If you have to suggest that 2 guys playing Jaskon/Ibanex type gtrs through 4x12's is a really stupid sound set-up, then you are fighting a losing battle..they aren't even off 1st base. It would be the question of what are they going for..? and that they are oblivious to sounds and how to achieve them. Send them back to the bedroom,..there is no other way. Unless you have good seperation, there is no way you can have two gtrs blatting out their sound. Worse things on stage...oblivious musos types. You couldn't really call them players

in that case..you could name the gig.

[quote name='LemonCello' timestamp='1330258916' post='1554669'] Went to a pub not far from me to see a band last night. Very good they were too. I went to check out the venue more than anything else as we'll be out gigging soon. Don't know whether this is typical but they were 'shoe horned' in one corner, must have been no bigger than 10' by 10'. The guitarist literally had to move to avoid crashing into peeps as they got up to dance. At one point I noticed the bass player 'twang' his nice Stingray against the wall which quite understandably made him wince! I'm thinking I'll leave the Vigier at home and take my Squier! Anyone else played on a postage stamp? LC [/quote] Have done in the past...wont do it now. Am very picky about stage-size,/playing area. We need about 5mtr2 so if we don't get that, it isn't a gig for us.