The-Ox

John's original

http://www.rareelectricguitar.com/ these guys are good, not sure if they do just parts though

played the slab again today. Whilst the strings were old, it didn't have that same growl. Now I'm nowhere near John's level, but I can get a similar tone to his through a Precision, but I really do think its to do with the amp and application of the player in this case. The strings were old mind you

Have you heard of Tim Allen? He's on Facebook for sure, he does very good pickguards

suppose The Rolling Stones are technically Brit/Yank now

very cool! Thanks for sharing

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1480697820' post='3186570'] Purely anecdotal, but I have heard of some guitarists moving to deeper neck profiles because (they reckon) it affords better sustain. Could that baseball-bat neck have provided some similar sustain or other qualities to the tone, or do the jury reckon these guitarists are just talking cobblers? [/quote] good point! I had another go at the slab recently, only held it, and the neck was not as heavy as I first remembered. They could have a point I think it plays a part, but not a huge part. In the context of John Entwistle, whats being discussed here is his slab sound, which is very barky and overdriven. I very much doubt a slightly bigger neck can cause such overdrive, its certainly the amps

[quote name='Cosmo Valdemar' timestamp='1480415137' post='3184119'] Now, that sounds very different to me from the Leeds recording, both in terms of the bass itself and the sound of the amps. IOW sounds like a Precision to me, with a lot of emphasis on the bass side of the rig, resulting in an almost farting tone. Leeds sounds razor sharp and precise with a much cleaner low end, and with the distinctive extra 'something' of the Slab (albeit Frankenstein). Of course there are so many other variables in play, all we can do is trust our ears in situations like this. That said, in the footage of Monterey JE is playing a Slab through rented Vox amps, giving a very odd sound most unlike the normal Who roar (Townshend sounds particularly weedy) - however the tone of the Slab is still very apparent. [/quote] yeah, I suppose there are differences, the way in which the two concerts were recorded may have been different? I think it was Meddle who said somewhere where you can hear the bass bleed into Roger's mic, I've listened to IoW countless times and I still hear the times when John's bass sometimes gets a more Leeds sound than the rest of the concert, which was quite bassy as you've noted. Then again, when I remember that slab neck it was very heavy, like a baseball bat. It could affect tone somewhat, but I don't think to a great degree. I personally think his IoW My Generation solo sounds a lot closer to Leeds than say his Monterey one, which has some growl (the player?) but isn't as close. The key being the different amps. Then again, we have to rely on our ears for this one [quote name='Cosmo Valdemar' timestamp='1480415408' post='3184125'] In my youthful naivety I always took JE's comments about the Slab as gospel but it does seem highly unlikely that that pickup and circuit is reponsible for the unique tone. Which brings us back to the neck. I'll have to try and cobble together some recordings of my Yamaha to see what everyone thinks. It's definitely got something extra going on. [/quote] that would be cool. I'll try record that slab if I get a chance

[quote name='stinson' timestamp='1480361995' post='3183744'] Andy Rourke of The Smiths played one for a while [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1viBJ_ih64"]https://www.youtube....h?v=e1viBJ_ih64[/url] [/quote] cheers for this. Even though hes a totally different player to John, it sounds different to your usual P bass

[quote name='Cosmo Valdemar' timestamp='1480352222' post='3183616'] I think one of the problems we have when discussing the Slab tone is that there is very little recorded evidence to hand - most of it comes courtesy of JE and then it is quite overdriven. We have to separate how much of the tone is coming from the bass from what the amp is responsible for. From the two clips you posted, they both sound like Slabs but through different amps. Admittedly one is Frankenstein, which to me discounts the importance of the slab-style body. I think we can discount JE's playing style as being responsible for the tone as there's recorded evidence of him playing a standard Precision and it sounds different. As we know, Frankenstein was cobbled together from various parts and stil retained that tone, and the only Slab parts used were the neck and the electronics, so... [/quote] yeah, its an interesting one indeed! Then again, going back to IoW, take the My Generation performance, if someone told you that was a slab, you'd believe it. The solo sounds near identical to Leeds (My Generation starts at 1:28:48): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVf5wW5J_uA And this was a stock Precision with rosewood neck. The constants here are John himself and the Hiwatts. Perhaps the slab sound is there within the bass, but most of it is John?

[quote name='Cosmo Valdemar' timestamp='1480349537' post='3183592'] Maybe there's more to it than just the neck, but I don't think volume or choice of amp has any bearing on the real discussion here. The overdrive from the Hiwatt (or Marshall, or Vox) has little to do with the inherent tone of the instrument - when you played the original Slab and noticed the difference in tone, was that at Entwistle volume? [/quote] With my above comment, I was trying to explain John's slab sound in particular. I get what you mean that the overdrive of the amp has little to do with the instrument, but then again when we listen to the slabs, they're through these amps, so it does affect the tone we're hearing? Its been a while since I played it, but I got just as much of the slab bark from the original as I did from the reissue I played from what I remember, I'll try and play it again soon and report back. I still believe it really depends how you play, that is the overriding factor in my opinion. Live at Leeds is cited a lot on this thread for the slab tone as its made out of slab parts, but the body itself was an Alder P. Listen to this (I'm sure you guys have) live at the Marquee is 1967, this is an actual slab played through a Marshall https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdRs1gKpeGg This is his Frankenstein played through Hiwatts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgfiW5XcOUw Its mainly the player. Which then had me thinking - we're attributing John's playing to the slab sound here, but could others at the time get that sound? If not (which I would not be surprised if they couldn't) then again its the player. I'll try out the original again, but putting this player rhetoric that I'm banging on about aside, I think the electronics must be different. Either in the bass, or its just his amps. Otherwise any old maple capped neck Precision would do the job

having played John's 66 Slab and remakes, I'm not so sure that the tone can be put down to just the neck. I think at the end of the day it comes down to the player. You have to remember John was playing at a volume we'll never play and was really pushing the Hiwatts to the limit - the distortion he got with the slab he could get with any Precision given his equipment and general skill level.

don't want to hijack the thread, but if you were to pick one, who would you say was the 'best' in the band?

love Pink Floyd. I first discovered their Barrett stuff before DSOTM (not a hipster, don't worry) and loved it, but I think DSOTM and WYWH are masterpieces. I think a cult built up around Barrett which means he can do no wrong in people's eyes. Piper was a great album, but some get carried away and praise his weaker tunes as sheer genius. 70s Floyd was cool, I haven't heard all their stuff properly, as I'd imagine it takes a while to get into those long tracks (plus I wasn't a musician when I first got into them, I will probably see them in a whole different light now). My favourite track has to be Echoes Live at Pompeii, such an incredible performance. The whole 24 min live video was on Youtube, but this will have to do. Still the full performance https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVDVWFQ2IO8

great work Andy! Fantastic stuff

some superb Precisions on here! I love how each one is so unique I've posted before in my own thread, but here's mine, had it a couple weeks now [url=https://postimg.org/image/9dy43404f/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/68dicwhi7/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/s8tutj067/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/ku4j15ean/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/xzk179867/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/h0b2rzwyn/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/yezwe0jhb/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/9a8w0lk0v/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/jll8t9bq7/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/kp5d57wdb/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/agcvze8bj/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/iadhksg4f/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/81l0eys2n/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/rxgzui93z/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/u3bap0ckf/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/5bbohrvdr/][/url] [url=https://postimg.org/image/uhholq2zj/][/url] [url=https://postimage.org/]free upload[/url]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1476886553' post='3158131'] Does a Hiwatt DR205 and an HH 2x15 count..? Not that we play loud at all; our amps have volume pots that work. [/quote] Corr, if you ever feel like selling that rig....

[quote name='bigsmokebass' timestamp='1476316961' post='3153356'] I shall wait for one of my basses to sell and then invest in it anyway, for the price I'm sure to be amazed anyway and I shall also include a video for YouTube as there's nothing out there (that I can see) thanks for the help Ox [/quote] No worries! I hope you get on well with the bass! For what its worth, I'd higjly recommend a gotoh bridge, endless Entwistle sustain and harmonics!

just tried this at a band audition, cut through the mix of two lead guitarists like a knife through butter!

[quote name='bigsmokebass' timestamp='1476302199' post='3153241'] Thanks Ox. Don't know whether I'd be looking to replicate the JE sound £325 or seriously my mind would be blown. Just wondering as to whether the model is any different to the standard model as for neck, tones... whether it would have a classic 50's or 60's neck- anything closer to the JE model as to a colour scheme similar to it. [/quote] no worries. Ah yeah fair enough, replicating it for £325 would seriously be impressive! If you do try one let us know how you get on!

I can't say I've tried it, but in my opinion it doesn't seem to be a kind of bass that would produce his sort of tone! It may very well be a good bass for the money however I just don't see any particular connection between John's frankenstein and that bass apart from the aesthetics. But just my thoughts

thank you guys yeah I was skeptical too, but this gets close! Perhaps a maple would get even closer! I'll try do the demos, even if its just filmed off my phone. I'm ampless at the minute!