Musicman20

Any P bass will get pretty close.

I did look into these a year back when looking for a new 5 string bass. As nice as I think they are in the aesthetics, I knew all I wanted was either a good 5 string Jazz, or a Stingray 5. Ive wanted a Ray 5 for 15 + years, so I took the plunge. Probably the best decision Ive made for a while, but its all subjective. I went for white/brown tort (not red)/rosewood. HS pickups give lots of sound options, but the traditional MM H...well, its awesome. The B is clear, easy to get used to (as I was learning) and doesnt override the other strings. If you want a Jazz, then it would have to be a passive with active option Jazz for me...or pure passive. Anything with a H? In my eyes, Musicman!

I figure if I want a 2x10, I can just use the TC RS210, which is actually a really nice cabinet, hence why Im keeping two and selling the RS212. I stupidly thought Id use all three TC cabs together. Never happened. Sod it, NY122 it is. In the long run its cheaper as I dont have to add another cabinet.

I got another email from Peter Murray, and he said the NY122 should cover a lot of ground. If I was to have both the 122 and Club 102 in a test, the 122 would sound significantly larger and will go much louder without breaking a sweat. The Club 102 is great for smaller gigs or just monitoring, but it wont have the sheer grunt of the 122.

Hi Dave You are completely right, I know. Its a case of having basses with a lot of power and thump in the low end, with an amp thats also very bass heavy....which can lead to a certain muddyness. Never had it with other amps. I think a few people might be shocked that id consider going back to an amp with less features and less power, but lets face it, its about sound quality, not anything else. Ive just had a look at the 1212L size, and you are right. I never knew they were similar sizes. Your 1212L will be shorter if stood on its end by about 4-5 inches so they can get that driver angled. But then its bigger in other areas, so a fairly similar footprint. The NY122 is longer and thinner. Do you find it quite easy to get to gigs? The 1212L is about 3 lbs or so lighter, not that its a big deal, but similar size.

My other option here is to keep the Streamliner 900, and buy the LM3 outright with the money from the RS212. Whichever way, I get the LM3 again, but its whether I try a Markbass cab or keep the STL 900. Its a nice amp...sometimes a bit too thick and syrupy, which I cant believe im saying!

It isnt really heavy though, its just the same wood they use for the other cabinets, apart from the Club cabinets (tolex covered, thinner/lighter wood). 49lbs is still light for a 2x12, IMO. The Genz competition Neo X212T is 52lbs, and the Bergantino AE212 is around 56lbs. Being extremely lightweight isnt my goal, I just a fairly compact and well made 2x12.

[quote name='alexclaber' post='1337496' date='Aug 12 2011, 12:22 PM']And Usain Bolt runs fast because he has big feet. I despair... [/quote] I think what he means is, the cabinet is more heavily braced, with heavier woods, so the cabinet is more dense and has more weight to it. He did also say the 12s and the fact its 4 ohms/bigger box adds to its volume and fuller tone. I can see what he means, because some of the really thinly made/featherlight cabs do sound quite thin and midrangey. It might not be exactly why the NY122 has more low end and grunt to it, but I imagine it adds to it. Just like comparing a Marshall 4x12 guitar cabinet with a very heavy/thick wood Orange 4x12. Admittedly, more to it than that, but there we go.

Its not as small as the 1212L I dont think. When I unpacked it, I was a bit shocked at how easy it was to move because they have the recessed large handles either end. It was easy-ish on my own, but I imagine it would be a breeze with another person on the other handle. Size wise, the drivers have more space around them compare to the RS212, but the cab is quite a bit shallower, which is what I want. What I noticed compared to the RS212, was that it was a lot more unforgiving...as they describe, a cab with a 'flat response' on their site. Still a little bit of a mid bump like MB cabs have, but more of a full low end. It also seemed like volume was effortless...the drivers piston like crazy on the Markbass cabs, and I could tell straight away that it would handle whatever you throw at it. At the time, I sent it back as I had far too many cabs, but now Im getting rid of one, this seems like the best lightweight/small/powerful compromise out there for what I want. The other good thing was that they used a compression driver for the highs...it could get VERY trebly and snappy if needed, but I dialed it off for the testing. All my cabs are quite smooth and aimed at a vintage tone, hence I fancied something much more hi-fi, accurate, and clear. I emailed Peter Murray at Markbass, and he owns both the Club 102 and NY122. He said for sheer output and lowend, the NY122 wins hands down, because its made with thicker wood and is obviously at 4 ohms with 12s. The Club would apparently sound much more aggressive if stacked with another identical cabinet, but that unfortunately means Id have to buy two! Something I didnt want to really do.

[quote name='JTUK' post='1337404' date='Aug 12 2011, 11:16 AM']I suggested a solo Db210 to go ontop of the DB212 and be modular should you ever need to gig more than one cab/DB210. Or..AE212..altho now they have let the Neo range go...?? it might be hard to source top end drivers as replacements should this be necessary somewhere done the line. For this reason, I'd not want to pay top $ for a discontinued line now.[/quote] Ah, sorry, got ya. The only problem is my DB212 is also 4 ohm...I did have two 8 ohm DB212s, but I never needed them. The 4 ohm sounds HUGE, but its a big cabinet! It also never being sold...I really like it. The NY122 is a lot smaller, and about 18-20 lbs lighter. I nearly bought an AE212, but the Talkbass chaps said it is a bit fussy with what amp you have, and my lineup wasnt the best for an already bass heavy cabinet. I agree, I wouldnt want to pay a lot for a discontinued line, no matter how good it is. At least Markbas seem to keep lines for a while and source their own drivers from B&C (I think its them). Anyway, here is a pic when I tested the F500/NY122...quite a small setup and I think with the LM3 it would be great. Its nowhere near as deep as the RS212. [attachment=86805:F500NY122_Vertical.JPG]

Are you preferring the Musicman? This might be just a situation where you are starting to find a bass that suits you more perhaps?

Have they discontinued the cabs?! Surely they can source you a replacement?!

Interesting. Quite odd that it wasnt noticed, or that the Gallery thought it was normal. Perhaps this was to prevent any hassle, or perhaps it was a genuine mistake and they didnt know. I know these things happen in manufacturing, but it is a little worrying.

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1337187' date='Aug 12 2011, 12:59 AM']Personally the 2x12 is better option. Not the lightest I've ever picked up but the sound it makes is one of the better ones from the MB cab range. I don't know why but I don't rate markbass cabs as much as the heads.[/quote] Yeah, it's marmite with these. Again, I think their latest line is much stronger, I did try the NY122 a fee times and for the size/weight, it was damn right impressive. I don't really want to get two 2x10s as the RS cabs cover that and they do it very well, but a slim 4 ohm powerful 2x12 with a fairly light weight is a good option.

The MB 102 Combo will bury the Shuttle combos, purely because its a bigger box, two speakers, and to be fair, the Combo amp inside it LM2/3 is more poweful than the Shuttle 6.0, nevermind the 3.0

Agreed. My next decision is cab based between the NY122 (4 ohm) or the Club 102 (8 ohm). I can only get one. My thinking is that MB amps seem to 'open up' better at 4 ohms, and I didnt really want to get two more cabinets, (eg 2x Club 102) so the 2x12 would be a better option. I did briefly test an NY122 in my apartment and from the off, you could tell it would cut the mix so well, but with plenty of non-boomy bass. The speakers absolutely hammer in these cabs (they piston a lot!) and I think that 2x12 in particular can take a lot thats thrown at it. It also has that good vertical or horizontal design to it. Most the time it could go on a table at the back horizontal.

I think Markbass should be applauded for fitting in SO much on the F500, but I found the EQ quite hard to gauge when I was comparing it to the LM3. Id say the main differences are: LM3 - Slightly warmer, still punchy and clear in the mids, quite a sheen up top, but no hi mid bump. F1/500 - Slightly faster, quicker response, very punchy, similar high end, but also a bump in the hi mids. The LM3 seems much more natural to my ears, a little smoother. The F1/500 definitely has a slightly different nature. As they are both so close, and I actually prefer the footprint of the LM3 (its just the right weight and size) Ive opted for the LM3 as I never used to use the EQ....it sounded so good flat with occasional VLE added. I still think quality-wise, the Italian-made Markbass is top of the pile with TC. Genz are great at what they do, but they don't 'feel' as solid and as well made as the MB/TC gear. Maybe this reflects why the Genz gear can be cheaper despite the amount they cram in, plus its made in Taiwan I believe. MB have stated they will never start production overseas; it will always be in Italy. I quite like that. I know some Talkbass members want to support USA companies all the time, but as we are over here, im more than happy to dip into European-made products. We have some great gear in the UK/Europe (eg MB, Tecamp, TC, Orange, Glock, EBS).

Im probably one of those weird people who find space for both. Why? Because they definitely feel and sound different, even same models, same electrics, etc (taking the wood variety out of it). My 5s sound great, and soon ill be gigging them, but I class the 5 as a different instrument. If I ever get back into originals, and its more rock/punk based, it will be a 4 string, because it feels and sounds how I want it to. The 5er's are more for my own personal enjoyment at the moment, but are great for pop, funk, soul, etc, where you want that subtle but nice low notes. Keep them. Believe me, you might want them back one day. I tend to see it how Ed Friedland does....why limit to one? The 5 does more than the 4, agreed, but the 4 SOUNDS and FEELS different. I dont know why, but it does, no matter which brand. Even things like tension feel different once you have a low B. If you do sell one, Id personally add a 2EQ 5er Ray, like the Classic 5. Failing that, try something else by Musicman if you want to stick with them.

I dont think I ever had the master above 1/3 with an 8 ohm cabinet on the LM3! I think if I needed more power itd be the TH RH750, but to be honest, I dont very often need masses of volume. I was told the best way to run amps like this is to not worry about the wattage and add speakers/cabs if you want more volume.

[quote name='JTUK' post='1334550' date='Aug 10 2011, 09:12 AM']Can't really say what your end-sound is, Gareth, but I think a modular idea of 2x210's would be THE end game. If you are talking single cabs with single speakers, then sorry, can't help.[/quote] This is an 8 ohm 2x10, 29lbs, re-voiced, new drivers, no piezo so it has proper compression horn, nice new tolex effect, and a great size/functionality to it. I only need one for this band, believe me, but if I were to get another it would sound fantastic no doubt. Pics here: [url="http://www.musik-schmidt.de/gb-Markbass-Club-102.html"]http://www.musik-schmidt.de/gb-Markbass-Club-102.html[/url] [url="http://www.gitarrentotal.ch/node/2081"]http://www.gitarrentotal.ch/node/2081[/url]

Ive been offered a very very good price on either the Club 2x10 (which is lighter and larger, with a better horn) or the NY122, (which I briefly tried and thought sounded MASSIVE, and at the time I didnt really need it, but now Im selling an RS212). So it looks like ill try one of these new ones...both are updated drivers and upgraded horns. Both are pretty damn light for what they are.

Yeah, its a nice system, but the TC amp I have is quite complex as it is, so I just want a solid state/flat-ish MB amp I can use that isnt overly expensive, like I had with the LM3....which I should have kept haha!

There is also the Club 102, which apparently has a fuller sound cf to the TRV102P, and a nice new tolex effect. Plus, it can be tilted like a monitor.

Exactly my thoughts, and as the majority of my gear is Musicman, it makes sense for me to go back to Markbass for an amp head at least. I dont know why it works, but it does. It seems all the character of the Ray/Sterling/Bongo etc comes out SOO clear, its brilliant. Hence why I wouldnt mind a small cabinet as well. Hmmm