tegs07

Huzzah for European socialism. I would not say for one moment I prefer the US economic model! Give me a higher tax, more public services model anytime. I’m just relaying a simple point that the labour costs add to the price of the US instruments and those costs are increasing.

Personally I don’t think US basses are expensive, particularly from a historical perspective. They are just expensive when compared to instruments produced in low wage countries that don’t have to factor in workers rights such as health and safety, pensions etc. Economies of scale come into play as well. Ernie Ball produce far less instruments than Fender.

Not really. It’s an average. Doesn’t say if mode, mean or median. I would think your estimate of $20 an hour would probably be about right for a factory worker. Bearing in mind labour costs are the main reason USA basses are more expensive. It’s a big reason why nobody wants to pay for them. It’s all well and good supporting pay rises, but if people won’t accept the costs involved in the end products and services then it doesn’t look promising for the workforce. I would guess this is a big reason 300 were sacked in 2022. Corporate greed is only one factor. Consumer choice is the other issue. Since GATT and later WTO agreements western manufacturers have a tough time making products that can compete with labour costs in other countries.

subterranean homesick blues - dylan

waiting in vain - bob marley

riders on the storm - the doors

dig lazerus dig - nick cave

“200,000 sq. ft. facility employs close to 1,000 employees. The new facility, located at 345 Cessna, will add hundreds of jobs to support Fender’s Custom Shop and “Made in the USA” production lines across Fender®, Gretsch®, Jackson®, Charvel®, and EVH®products”. Unfortunately around 300 staff were laid off in 2022. Google suggests average US Fender salary is $56,000. I would hazard a guess that the Mexican factory pays less and the Chinese and Indonesian factories way way less and produce far more instruments.

catch - the cure

people are strange / doors

I had a custom bass made. It was nice to support a local luthier and see the work in progress. For some inexplicable reason though I keep getting active basses and never gel with them. The one I had made was active. I don’t know why I keep repeating this? Maybe eventually I will find one I like or get broke trying?

It’s worth noting that a custom luthier doesn’t have to pay the wages of around 3000 employees. As with most things retail it’s a race to the bottom dollar. Consumers have massive choice and want the best price they can get. It’s a tough and competitive business. Personally I like a no frills instrument and the no nonsense P works well for me. It doesn’t need to be a Fender but the one I have is a keeper.

I would guess that they do it by a combination of rock bottom Chinese labour prices and the distribution capacity and relative low cost web based sales of Thoman’s online platforms. The couple I have tried have been very good for the price but a little on the heavy side.

I’m pretty sure Reverend instruments are made in South Korea where labour is cheaper ( and if squid game or parasite are indicative inequality fairly rife). It’s not looking great for US or European manufacturing if inflation continues on its current trajectory.

rosetta stoned - tool

free nelson mandela - special a.k.a

nah it was right the first time. never trusted that roger daltry fella.

Well the USA in particular got away with it for years due to the petrodollar (world reserve currency). They could buy commodities in $, get the host countries to re-invest the profits in US treasuries then print and debase the currency at will as it wasn’t backed by anything substantial (gold). These IOUs on maturity were later worth less. This ruse is all but over with the BRICs moving away from the $. This won’t help inflation or price increases one bit. Banks haven’t needed to pay interest. Deposits are not required in the same way when central banks are offering QE liquidity at rock bottom rates. As for manufacturing well that takes energy and the gas and oil is largely imported and though the prices have stabilised they are still historically high. This is not good for inflation. I think people sense that they are being scammed but don’t quite understand by who.

A picture tells a thousand words and all that. I’m really not sure what is so controversial about the fact that there has been a massive rise in public and private borrowing over the last two decades and interest rates have been far below their historical average. It seems fairly basic economics to me that: a) a huge increase in borrowed money would mean prices would increase. b) At some stage interest rates would rise and the debt would need to be paid back at a higher cost than it was borrowed for. c) this would cause big problems. d) anything that could be done to slow down the rate of interest rate rises should have been done well in advance. Slamming the brakes on was never going to be smooth.

👆😂

So are you saying that prior to central banks massive liquidity injection to rescue the financial system in 2008, followed by massive increase in commercial banks lending as the housing market started its next bubble phase in roughly 2011 onwards there was a corresponding rise in the price of things but interest rates were kept at near zero? I’ve been preaching that message for a while. This is basic economics. Massively increase the money supply and keep rates at near zero for a couple of decades and there will be huge consequences. We are now experiencing them. Edit. As this topic is predominantly about USA products I have replaced the graph with a US one. Same pattern. If anyone is interested though check out positivemoney.org they are some of the good guys.

shake, rattle and roll - snooks eaglin

I have a Sandberg and it’s by far the best build quality on a bass I have ever had. The finish is amazing…. but I just don’t love it. Possibly because I don’t seem to gel with active basses. For whatever inexplicable reason I have a Fender Nate P and it just works for me. Expensive, mass produced worth the cash? For me yep. For hours of enjoyment provided it is unbelievably cheap.

The problem economists have is that human behaviour is hardly rational or predictable so making a science of it is bound to fail. I’m not a great fan of central banks. I think they have meddled and messed up in a very big way and we are all now paying the price for their mistakes and shortcomings. Anyway back to price rises of basses or cars or whatever. Everyone finds the economy and geopolitics dull even though they are the invisible hand behind most of these issues.

Which was probably a months salary so a reversal to the norm?