peteb

[quote name='KingBollock' timestamp='1349905817' post='1832220'] One problem I have with all of this is that the ones who claim bands playing for free take money from "better" bands, in the same breath will say that if you don't charge, you're obviously crap and who would want you to play for them anyway? It's two faced and both faces are wrong. [/quote] If I put a band together to play pubs and go out for, say £200 to £250 (average pub gig fee these days around here), then we will not competing with the likes of Jake or Doddy who will be playing, for example, corporate / function gigs that pay much better. But neither will we be competing with bands that will play for free or go out for £80, as they will be playing the pubs that the better local bands avoid because they won’t pay the going rate! The problem is that this starts to distort the market for live music, which is rather fragile at the moment. The new landlord at an established music venue may be tempted to think that he can get away with paying bands less as that is what the the pub down the road is doing and then wonders why his attendances are dropping alarmingly. He then stops putting on bands and changes to karaoke or some other abomination before going out of business six months later. Similarly punters wonder why the quality of bands isn’t as good as it used to be and stay in on a Saturday night with a DVD rather than going out to watch live music……….

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1349876875' post='1831639'] I can't ever get past the fact that a great cover is only a cover. There is a simple buzz to be got from a job well done but it has always remained a shallow victory for me. [/quote] I appreciate that it might not be the same as creating your own material but surely you must admit that it is great fun to get to grips with the music that your favourite bands made. Even players of the caliber of Paul Gilbert, Billy Sheehan & Mike Portnoy (along with various singers) get together to play tribute gigs of their heroes (Led Zep, The Who & Rush, etc) just for fun! Some of the best moments of my recent musical life have been in a rehearsal room playing in a band with a s*** hot guitarist jamming Highway Star or working out Led Zep, Van Halen & Randy Rhodes era Ozzy material note for note, seeing how it was put together and knowing that you are doing these great pieces of music justice. Almost gives you an idea of what it was like to have been in that rehearsal studio when the songs that made you want to play in the first place were put together! Sometimes it is satisfying enough to simply know that you are standing in the footsteps of giants…..

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1349795413' post='1830638'] It's just half step back, i say keep the same strings. You'll notice the slightest diference on the first couple of times you use the bass after detuning but you'll grow acostumed to it. IMHO i don't think there will be much difference in sound to justify raising the caliber of the strings on such a small detune. It will all come down to your preference, try it and see for yourself if you can live with the diference, don't forget to do a full setup if needed. [/quote] The trouble is if you have a bass with a very low action then it does make a big difference - as I found out when I did a last minute dep with a band who tune down! There are loads of top bands with quality bass players who play in E flat and I doubt that they put up with floppy strings or a high action, so presumably there must be a way of setting up a bass properly when it's tuned down!

Just to go against the perceived wisdom here, but for me the Badass is a significant improvement over the BBOT! Whenever I've had a Fender I have always replaced both the bridge and pickups.....

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1349717194' post='1829561'] Simple economics around her are something like this.. Venue has to sell the equivalent of 200 pints per night to pay an band £300..and if they have security, maybe that is more..depends if that is sorely on the music night. In my town of around 130,000 there can be 5 regular town venues with recognised bands..and then any number of other efforts. There are only 2 fully regular and recognised venues/pubs that all the better bands in the county would acknowledge... altho you could sub-divide the county into 3 or 4 regions. These venues have worked very hard over a long period..18 months plus, to get where they are now..which is simply to be mostly in a position to book..AND PAY.. for any band on the circuit. They are in the position to pick and choose the bands that will draw and therefore perpetuate the whole process with a degree of certainty. If any bands offer to play these places for free, they'd get laughed at..the standard is higher and you need to convince you are worth booking...but by the same token, the venue isn't going to even look at you if you haven't got a decent pitch and everything else to comvince him you'll sell 200 plus pints..at least..!! I understand pubs/venues putting down their fees..or trying to... but no punter should mind 30p a pint going on for music nights. You get what you pay for... and that extra can keep the standard and fees up, hopefully. I am against more music venues if it waters down the whole set-up..ditto cheap licensing. I think there are too many bands already chasing gigs and too many of those forces some of them to desperately seek gigs via any method..including playing for free. They should make PLI and PAT compulsory and also a mimimum electrical standard for venues..not make it easier to bypass these useful requirements. Or, ban all bands who can't read from playing unless they pass their pratical [/quote] Good post - apart from your last statement because if every band had to read there would be a lot of good bands round here who wouldn't be able to gig! [quote name='Dr.Dave' timestamp='1349720217' post='1829628'] We sometimes play for a grand plus , we also play for £80. That's at a tiny bar that can barely squeeze us and 40 people in and it's all they can afford. After petrol money that's maybe a 20 spot a piece. None of us are short of a 20 spot. We do it because we love playing there and the punters and management love having us. Accepting money has nothing to do with 'greed'. Suppose I broke a bass string that night , Mart punctured a drum skin and Rodders guitar lead went tonto. That would effectively be pay to play for us. Another venue we play - we take a lesser fee than we might because they let us have practise space. There are many ways to be 'paid'. We live in a world that primarily values our skills and products by giving us money or by trading services and products. Our precious , precious time has a value far beyond any amount of cash , but it does at least recognise that we give of our time and skills. Don't anyone ever sell yourself short. [/quote] Spot on again....!

As i'm already using 45-105s I would prefer not to use any heavier strings if possible. Ideally I would like strings with higher 'tension' to compensate for them being tuned down. Just wondered if there are any other tricks that I need to be aware of??

SRV, Hendrix, early Van Halen, G'n'R, later Whitesnake etc, etc to name just a few all tune down - it's pretty much the norm in rock (& blues) music these days but I've just managed to avoid it!

[quote name='thebrig' timestamp='1349712408' post='1829481'] I think that we all need to get this into perspective. Some pubs get extra punters through the door because there is a band on, but a lot of pubs who have bands, don’t get any extra punters at all. I was in a pub only last week who used to have live music regularly, so I asked the manager why he no longer does, and he said, "[i]there was hardly any extra money going over the bar, so why should I pay out £200/300 for a band, and have no extra punters at all[/i], and I had no answer to it. On the other hand, if he was to turn around to me and ask, "[i]would your band play here for nothing, but the band and your partners would be ok for drinks (within reason) all night[/i]", then I would probably be tempted, after all, it’s a night out for the WAGS, a free rehearsal for the band, and more importantly, the buzz of playing to a live audience, regardless of its size. [/quote] [color=#222222]You are touching on a couple of points here![/color] [color=#222222]First of all, the landlord needs to ask himself a few questions! If he is paying out £300 for a band and getting no extra punters he is either not promoting his gigs properly and/or getting the wrong bands and probably in competition with another live music pub that does it much better or is in a better location.[/color] [color=#222222]However, pub bands do need to realise that we are in a recession and that you are not guaranteed to get the same audiences that we were used to a few years ago, at least around these parts in the frozen north! I can see it getting to the stage where bands take smaller fees with a bonus if you get a certain number of punters in on the night (the trouble is that many landlords will take the p*** on this if you give them half a chance) or a bucket going around, etc.[/color] [color=#222222]One thing that I do know is that you play for free, landlords will assume that you are totally without value and do nothing to promote the gig, etc. If a landlord has to pay a reasonably significant sum to a band, he will go to great efforts to recoup his investment. The same goes for the band getting the door receipts to be paid. I always insist on a guaranteed minimum (even if it is only £100) otherwise you will find that there will be no posters up or promotion at all…..[/color] [quote name='Dr.Dave' timestamp='1349713008' post='1829493'] That's true , but with it comes a responsibility to ask ourselves whether we should. [/quote] Absolutely!

All the bands I have been in have tuned to concert pitch (apart from a few deps) but, as certain singers are getting older, it looks like I need to start to start detuning a half-step to E flat for one of my projects! I have always struggled to get a tuned down bass to feel right in the past, so I wonder if anyone has any tips?? All my basses are strung with 45 to 105s, have a low action and very little relief on the neck. I like plenty of tension in the strings (I know that some say that it isn’t really tension, but you know what I mean – perhaps tautness is a better word). Some people might say that tuning down a half step shouldn’t make a significant difference, but it does! I have just re-strung my Streamer Stage 1 with DR lo-riders (on the basis that they are supposed to be quite stiff) but does anyone have any tips about how to set the bass up, neck relief, action, other makes of strings to try, etc to try and keep the feel of the bass as close as possible to what I’m used to??

[color=#222222]I switched from using a SWR 4x10 and a 1x18 to using two matching 4x10s after reading something on here (from Alex I think), which I interpreted as speaker cabs with different size speakers will always be slightly out of phase with each other whereas matching cabs will always have the speakers working together i.e. moving together at the same speed.[/color] [color=#222222][font="Times New Roman"][size="3"] [/size][/font][/color] [color=#222222]This seemed to make sense to me and it did seem to sound better (or at least more efficient) but had I understood the reasoning for doing so correctly??[/color]

Mars Cowling (original Pat Travers bass player)

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1349273161' post='1824084'] Have a wee read at these & things might make a little more sense to you. http://barefacedbass.com/technical-information/speaker-size-frequency-response.htm http://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/viewforum.php?f=10&sid=239e993b6a548da81514b45176b314cb Smaller drivers give a better dispersion than larger ones. 2 10" drivers vertically arranged in a cab the same size as a single 15" will give out a better dispersion. It's nothing to do with driver diameter on how low it can go, but how much it can move. The reason behind 15's & 18s is that cabs are cheaper to produce with a single driver. [/quote] You do realise that you are arguing with someone who makes his living working with high end pro audio hire / installation companies??

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1348771090' post='1818051'] But you usually get a mediocre singer doing the same old....... I mnea, when was the last tme you saw Ronnie James Dio doing a BT gig in Lanzarote? [/quote] A mate of mine is an excellent, much in demand singer but a few years ago he was was living out in Tenerife doing a solo act with BTs for a living......

[quote name='BottomE' timestamp='1348679456' post='1816882'] Most of the Med is saturated by this type of thing unfortunately. USA has some great music cities. France has some really good open air gigs in the summer. [/quote] As does (mainland) Spain and Italy, especially the Tuscany region from what I understand.....

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1348667926' post='1816673'] If i'm fooled in to thinking a performance is entirely live (and I would include live triggers in that) then I don't care if they're playing to a click/BT - obviously I don't care because I don't know. E.G watching a band play to a click with some BVs on a BT, and someone miming the BVs - I probably wouldn't be able to tell, and it would be infinitely more entertaining than watching the lead singer sing along to a BT on their own. You'd still get to see the musicians do their thing. [/quote] FWIW - I have it on good authority that a lot of metal bands playing the big stages are using backing tracks with additional BVs & keyboards live!

[quote name='SteveK' timestamp='1348608613' post='1816045'] You're right knowing the actual names isn't important, unless you're trying to verbally communicate them to someone else. For anyone interested - a little mnemonic device (of my own creation) which helped me to remember them: [b]I[/b]onian[b]; D[/b]orian;[b] P[/b]hrygian[b]; L[/b]ydian[b]; M[/b]ixolydian[b]; A[/b]eolian[b]; L[/b]ocrian [b]I[/b] [b]D[/b]o [b]P[/b]lay [b]L[/b]ike [b]M[/b]y [b]A[/b]unt [b]L[/b]ucy [/quote] Fortunately, I don't generally need to identify them by name to other people - it's generally 'that minor scale with the natural 6th'! However, that is very useful to know so many thanks.....

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1348602971' post='1815925'] OK. So would you do that to support a particular type of chord? Or to create a particular mood? [/quote] Both, but I would say more often the former (for the stuff I play)......

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1348599680' post='1815860'] Yeah I know what they are (although I can never remember their names) but I don't know why they exist or where to use them or why that one repeating sequence of intervals can be messed with like that and still work. So I guess I know how to use two of them, that much is true. [/quote] I can never remember the names either, but it's not really important. My main use for them is that in addition to the major and minor scales you will ofter use a major scale with a dominant 7th or a minor scale with a natural 6th rather than a minor 6th.........

[quote name='Raymondo' timestamp='1348599082' post='1815845'] We play a bikers headquarters pub in Covemnry regularly and they all love the live band rock stuff.. but when we played their festival earlier this year they had a guy playing guitar and singing to backing tracks,on in the bar for the afternoon and (1) he was fabulous and (2) everybody loved it! No body is right or wrong here ....it's just providing a service for the general(and in the bikers case not so general) public. [/quote] That's the long and short of it! Out in the islands you have holidaymakers looking for some (any) entertainment after a hard day sunbathing and drinking. The bars tend to be pretty small and it makes sense to employ one man and his BT, not to mention to try to appeal to the lowest common denominator. That is not to say that bands can't do OK because some do go and get gigs out there. My understanding is that there is quite a decent demand for bands on the main land, throughout Europe. Even in this country there is still an interest in live music - but there is a recession going on that, together with the smoking ban and our over-zealous attitude to appeasing anyone who complains about noise (or anything else) regardless of how unreasonable they are means that a lot of the live music scene is struggling right now.....

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1348566487' post='1815168'] Theory just describes what your ears are telling you play. Who honestly, when they are playing, thinks "I'm going to play an 11th or 6th now". It just flows on what you know sounds right falling off that fretboard. It should be intuitive because music is an expression of yourself, an art, not numbers, dots and squiggles. [/quote] [color=#222222]Music has a strong mathematical element – even I can see that speaking as someone who is self-taught, doesn’t really read music and likes to think of themselves as having a ‘good ear’.[/color] [quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1348565096' post='1815147'] I only really know a couple of scales and don't understand modes at all despite attempting to understand them a few times. I know what different intervals sound like and I base most of what I do on that. What would the benefits be of learning modes and more scales? Presumably I'd also need to memorise the context within which to use them, and then wait for that to become automatic, it seems like a lot of information to have to retain and I can't really appreciate from my current position what the benefits would be? [/quote] [color=#222222]If you know a major and a minor scale then surely modes are not such a great leap? They are just scales made up of the same notes but starting on a different note from the original scale……[/color]

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