JTUK Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 Which is what gtrs have been doing for years. I don't know what your end goals really are regards sound but I suspect an awful lot of players don't or can't want ultra clean sounds. Ampeg have made their name on their version of a bass sound, which to some is still a benchmark. My theory is that Aguilar have stolen it and moved things on. Other bass players will put a drive pedal in front to dirty things up that the natural break-up of a cab used to do.. so there is a use for colour in the signal chain. Unless you are used to studio monitors for bass, I don't really see why you go for that, tbh... and even then I'd have to hear what you are trying to achieve to get a feel for it..?? The TH500 is a good amp and works with many cabs..IMO. it depends how expensive it will be to go thru a load of amps to find one which does what you have in your head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 (edited) [quote name='JamesBass' timestamp='1429778521' post='2754762']The TH500 tone certainly isn't modern or super clean by any stretch of the imagination. It's very old school, and very warm and I can see how some people might think it's clipping or just not right for them as the bass frequencies are VERY pronounced! Have you got any amps in mind Conan? I always thought the TC Electronic heads were ridiculously clean, same with Hartke, if thats any help! [/quote] I don't find the TH500 particularly "bassy" - but then again I leave the bass control on flat or slightly cut. It certainly has the capability to do huge amounts of bass boost, but that is not what is causing the distortion in my case. Amp-wise, I'm pretty much looking exclusively at second-hand. Ironically I started with a Hartke LH500 and the only reason I moved it on was that I couldn't get enough mids out of it! It was definitely clean and loud enough! Next amp I tried was a TC RH750. I sounded pretty good, but it was too complex for my (simple) needs, with too many features that I wouldn't need and just found distracting. [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1429778716' post='2754766']I don't know what your end goals really are regards sound Unless you are used to studio monitors for bass, I don't really see why you go for that, tbh... The TH500 is a good amp and works with many cabs..IMO. it depends how expensive it will be to go thru a load of amps to find one which does what you have in your head. [/quote] I have never used studio monitors for bass! For years I used Trace Elliot, them moved via Ampeg and Ashdown to Hartke and Barefaced. I was happy with that for several years too - but always wanted to get more midrange from my tone. The Big One could reproduce it, but only if the bass and amp were putting it out. As I mainly use Jazz basses with both pickups on full, obviously the bass is not chucking out a whole lot of mids! The Hartke's tone stack is notoriously mid-shy and the combination of the two was frustrating me. I tried various outboard graphics and EQ pedals - and even a Marcus Miller J bass with onboard J-retro preamp, but wanted an amp that could do it. Hence this frustrating quest to find an amp that is simple, powerful, clean, mid-capable and (most importantly) within my budget! I never thought of my tone as being particularly pure or clean, but maybe it is. I like to think of it as the sound of my bass(es), but maybe a lot of other bass players like to hear a bit of "warmth" or "grit" or "hair" around that sound too. That's not for me. I guess my ideal would be something along the lines of the LH500, but with sweepable or 2/3 band mids. Does such an amp exist for around £450 used? I have my eye on an old Fender 800 pro on here, but I know nothing about Fender amplification. At least it should have the power on tap to drive the Big One more efficiently... I have also been looking at two Ashdown heads with 12 band graphics - the MK500 and the JJB500. Again, I have no experience of either - but they are available at good prices and seem (from what I have read) to offer a clean tone with plenty of tone-shaping capability. I would love to like the TH500. It's lightness and looks are fantastic! It has a range of great sounds that, with a different cab, I would be able to use. But I just can't live with it in the real world Edited April 23, 2015 by Conan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 That 800 Pro would be nice - a very warm rich tone, but for the descriptions on the thread, very clean. I had the combo version of it and it was a great sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBass Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1429780269' post='2754794'] I don't find the TH500 particularly "bassy" - but then again I leave the bass control on flat or slightly cut. It certainly has the capability to do huge amounts of bass boost, but that is not what is causing the distortion in my case. Amp-wise, I'm pretty much looking exclusively at second-hand. Ironically I started with a Hartke LH500 and the only reason I moved it on was that I couldn't get enough mids out of it! It was definitely clean and loud enough! Next amp I tried was a TC RH750. I sounded pretty good, but it was too complex for my (simple) needs, with too many features that I wouldn't need and just found distracting. [/quote] Interesting, so the clipping is with the input then? What about going for another Aguilar head? But going for the AG500 if it comes up, it's more mid favoured, I think there is one in the FS section? Yeah I completely understand the issue with the TC range, they pack loads of features in and it can get frustrating when trying to get a tone out of it as there are so many knobs to play with! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1429780269' post='2754794'] I have never used studio monitors for bass! For years I used Trace Elliot, them moved via Ampeg and Ashdown to Hartke and Barefaced. I was happy with that for several years too - but always wanted to get more midrange from my tone. The Big One could reproduce it, but only if the bass and amp were putting it out. As I mainly use Jazz basses with both pickups on full, obviously the bass is not chucking out a whole lot of mids! The Hartke's tone stack is notoriously mid-shy and the combination of the two was frustrating me. I tried various outboard graphics and EQ pedals - and even a Marcus Miller J bass with onboard J-retro preamp, but wanted an amp that could do it. Hence this frustrating quest to find an amp that is simple, powerful, clean, mid-capable and (most importantly) within my budget! I never thought of my tone as being particularly pure or clean, but maybe it is. I like to think of it as the sound of my bass(es), but maybe a lot of other bass players like to hear a bit of "warmth" or "grit" or "hair" around that sound too. That's not for me. I guess my ideal would be something along the lines of the LH500, but with sweepable or 2/3 band mids. Does such an amp exist for around £450 used? I have my eye on an old Fender 800 pro on here, but I know nothing about Fender amplification. At least it should have the power on tap to drive the Big One more efficiently... I have also been looking at two Ashdown heads with 12 band graphics - the MK500 and the JJB500. Again, I have no experience of either - but they are available at good prices and seem (from what I have read) to offer a clean tone with plenty of tone-shaping capability. I would love to like the TH500. It's lightness and looks are fantastic! It has a range of great sounds that, with a different cab, I would be able to use. But I just can't live with it in the real world [/quote] I meant playback thru studio monitors if recording as they are my version of clean and those amps don't strike me as the epitome of clean either, tbh. The Jazz on full is scooped ...and Geddy Lee's sound is definitely scooped. But then, again, everything is going to be scooped somewhere in the range as full on mids are very harsh on the ear. I think the best tone stacks are complimentary to each other, and sometimes this is not helped by having one extreme or another. That is why there are classic combinations ..like SWR and Jazz, IMO, and P Bass and Ampeg. And of course, this makes a mockery of the myth of being flat... All that means to most is that their amp is set neutrally on the controls, typically 12', but it doesn't take into account where the bias may be...and by the same token, how a cab has been tuned, what focus the pickups have, etc etc If you really want flat, then maybe you need no tone controls at all... but not many players will be able to cope with that, IMO... so it means that you need to choose and find where your 'colour' actually is... If flat meant anything scientifically, all amps would sound the same..??? and who wants that..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1429786231' post='2754892'] If you really want flat, then maybe you need no tone controls at all... but not many players will be able to cope with that, IMO... so it means that you need to choose and find where your 'colour' actually is... [/quote]I never said that I wanted "flat"! Quite the opposite in fact - I want to be able to add mids as and when required (I don't need them [i][b]all[/b][/i] of the time) without having an amp that distorts at modest volumes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 Sell the cab, get one that works with what you have :lol; That is if you like the amp.. I think it will be easier to cab match the amp than vice versa..??? Again, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1429788317' post='2754947'] Sell the cab, get one that works with what you have :lol; That is if you like the amp.. I think it will be easier to cab match the amp than vice versa..??? Again, [/quote] You may have a point there... Problem is that the used market is pretty depressed at the moment. It is a good time to buy but a poor time to sell. If I tried to sell my Big One (which I don't want to do!) I would be lucky to get £450 for it - and £375-400 would probably be more realistic. That wouldn't give me much buying power on the used cab market... I settled on the Big One after trying quite a number of cabs over the years. For me, it gives the perfect compromise in size, weight, tone and dispersion. Also, I don't have a large budget for music gear as my band is not regularly gigging and therefore not bringing in any money. So my bass purchases come out of the "family" pot - which means I would need a very good reason to invest an extra few hundred quid. Currently I can't justify that, and have no intention of trying. A pair of TKS 112s would no doubt fit the bill very nicely - but I can't stretch to buying them new right now So, on balance, it is a far wiser idea to look for another amp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSCOWBASS Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 Try a GK MB800 before you do anything with the BIG ONE. At least you can rule it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 [quote name='MOSCOWBASS' timestamp='1429796505' post='2755048'] Try a GK MB800 before you do anything with the BIG ONE. At least you can rule it out. [/quote] It's on my shopping list! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuNkShUi Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 I found MarkBass to be very clean sounding. Have you tried much of their kit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 [quote name='FuNkShUi' timestamp='1429800448' post='2755099'] I found MarkBass to be very clean sounding. Have you tried much of their kit? [/quote] Only one - an F1. I wasn't hugely impressed, to be honest. I'm not ruling them out though, if one comes along at the right price Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuNkShUi Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 I've not tried an F1 so cant comment. My LM2 through my MarkBass rig was great though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1429789873' post='2754978'] You may have a point there... Problem is that the used market is pretty depressed at the moment. It is a good time to buy but a poor time to sell. If I tried to sell my Big One (which I don't want to do!) I would be lucky to get £450 for it - and £375-400 would probably be more realistic. That wouldn't give me much buying power on the used cab market... I settled on the Big One after trying quite a number of cabs over the years. For me, it gives the perfect compromise in size, weight, tone and dispersion. Also, I don't have a large budget for music gear as my band is not regularly gigging and therefore not bringing in any money. So my bass purchases come out of the "family" pot - which means I would need a very good reason to invest an extra few hundred quid. Currently I can't justify that, and have no intention of trying. A pair of TKS 112s would no doubt fit the bill very nicely - but I can't stretch to buying them new right now So, on balance, it is a far wiser idea to look for another amp [/quote] Yes, I was kind of joking ... and you can guess why.. I saw a couple of SL112's the other day for £600... A few months ago I would have bitten the guys hand off but I have my cabs on order now... Hopefully they'll appear soon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funky8884 Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 Carvin amps have parametric mids in your price range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ern500evo Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 If you want ultra clean I think a Shuttle 6.2 or 9.2 might work well for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted April 30, 2015 Author Share Posted April 30, 2015 Well, the TH500 is gone now in a trade - and last night I used my new (to me) GK MB800. Sounding nice and clear (in that it seems free from the distortion I got with the Aggie) but it will need a bit more fiddling to get a tone that I am fully happy with. Didn't have much time last night, but I feel pretty sure that a great tone is in there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuNkShUi Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Glad it seems to be sorted for you, every bassist deserves his dream tone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSCOWBASS Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 That's a relief! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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