Busking, batteries and bass amps

[Papabull]

Hi all

Can anyone give me some advice/help regarding the best soloution for portable busking ie without access to a mains supply. I've been told that using an inverter with a car battery is ok but am unsure how thus would work also how long I could get out if it using a small combo, and lpedal looper. Also unsure how many charges a car battery could take using it this way before it got knackered !!!

If an inverter is the way to go what one / type would be best?
Any help gratefully received

Cheers all
PB

[JamesXP]

A leisure/marine battery is much better for his purpose than a car battery as they are much better at being full depleted and recharged over and over again.. whereas car batteries don't like this one bit!

[Papabull]

Thanks James for this. That makes great sense. Do you or anyone know anything about inverters and how much Ii could draw from such a setup?

Cheers all

PB

[Jonnyboy Rotten]

I am going to be getting a Roland Micro Basscube RX which seems to be the ideal mini combo with battery power option if you can't afford the PJ Briefcase.

[url="http://www.gak.co.uk/en/roland-bass-micro-cube-rx/18487"]http://www.gak.co.uk...o-cube-rx/18487[/url]

I don't think it would be as loud as a dedicated busking set up with battery/inverter and cab, but depends where you are busking I guess.

Edited April 11, 2014 by Jonnyboy Rotten

[oggiesnr]

[quote name='Jonnyboy Rotten' timestamp='1397205017' post='2421686']
I am going to be getting a Roland Micro Basscube RX which seems to be the ideal mini combo with battery power option if you can't afford the PJ Briefcase.

[url="http://www.gak.co.uk/en/roland-bass-micro-cube-rx/18487"]http://www.gak.co.uk...o-cube-rx/18487[/url]

[/quote]

Plenty loud enough, if you try and play at gig levels in the street you'll be asked to move on.

Is it just you or are you in a group? Leisure battery and small amp are the standard ways to go especially if you want to power effects and loopers. Inverters come in a variety of power sizes so get a fairly hefty one. Maplin or MachineMart do a range. Bear in mind that you have to have enough headroom for peak loads (when you switch on) not just for when it's running.

Be aware of any local rules for busking, Camden have just banned amplifiers for example and have fun.

Steve

[Papabull]

Thanks Steve,
Is there any significant difference between a standard inverter and one that puts out a pure sine wave?
(not really sure what I'm talking about) but I've heard there can be a difference.

[Papabull]

Also thanks to Johhnyboy too!

[pete.young]

Try doing a search on the site - there are several threads about this, many of them featuring Mcnach!

[JapanAxe]

[quote name='JamesXP' timestamp='1397184418' post='2421587']
A leisure/marine battery is much better for his purpose than a car battery as they are much better at being full depleted and recharged over and over again.. whereas car batteries don't like this one bit!
[/quote]

This. You need one that can 'deep cycle'.

[spacey]

Smart phone apps and Buetooth speakers are getting used by some of the more serious buskers these days.
Anyone know anytjing about them ?

[PaulWarning]

just got back from a Busking trip in Nottingham, I use a roland mobile cube that works off 6 AA batteries, a very apologetic policemen asked my to move a long as they'd had a complaint that I was too loud, Rock and Roll

[uncle psychosis]

This thread may help:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/212137-portable-solution-for-busking-on-bass-new-amp-or-batteryinverter/page__hl__busking"]http://basschat.co.uk/topic/212137-portable-solution-for-busking-on-bass-new-amp-or-batteryinverter/page__hl__busking[/url]

[Slaphead]

As already said a caravan / leisure battery and a pure sign wave inverter with plenty of headroom wattage wise, ensures a good signal for the gear. Most towns are happy for buskers ( I live in Poole Dorset ), but you have to move on after about an hour. Some dont like amps others are OK as long as noise levels are kept reasonable.

Best of luck

Alan

[ambient]

The Roland battery amps get a lot of praise from Chapman stick buskers, they'd work fine for bass.

[mcnach]

[quote name='ThePapabull' timestamp='1397175850' post='2421571']
Hi all

Can anyone give me some advice/help regarding the best soloution for portable busking ie without access to a mains supply. I've been told that using an inverter with a car battery is ok but am unsure how thus would work also how long I could get out if it using a small combo, and lpedal looper. Also unsure how many charges a car battery could take using it this way before it got knackered !!!

If an inverter is the way to go what one / type would be best?
Any help gratefully received

Cheers all
PB
[/quote]

I was weighing options last year, and I was very tempted by one of the several options that revolve around a battery plus inverter, so that I could use any amp. In particular my small MarkBass combo. However, I got tempted by one of these:



QTX QR10PA, from Amazon, at just under £150. Small, light... it claims it lasts several hours... so I pulled the trigger, and I am VERY happy with it.

Is it the bass sound against all bass amps should be measured against? No, it isn't. But it is not bad at all. It is a lot louder than I have ever needed [1] and the battery does seem to last for several hours without problems. It is light, smaller than the picture suggests, and easy to carry around (forget about the wheels, just lift it and carry it).

They make a version with a 12" speaker at only about £20 more, which may be interesting too, but for busking I am very very happy with this. There is a bit of hiss coming through mine, but only noticeable at home by myself, not on the street.

The tonal shaping options are very limited, so adding an EQ pedal (or using a bass with a preamp and active EQ) might be a good idea, but I used it by itself with a Precision and it was good too. I bought a Zoom MS-60B that gives me a tuner and EQ all in one (plus a lot more), but the batteries do not last long so I stopped using that.

[1] I used it busking with a band that consisted of:

3 guitarists (typically each with a Roland microcube each, i.e.: louder than acoustic guitars)
1 vocalist (through a separate amp, or sometimes one of the microcubes, although those distort)
trumpet
saxophone
drummer playing a reduced kit: hi-hats, snare and little else.

When we played by the beach on a busy afternoon in the beach walk in Portobello, the microcubes ran out of juice and I was still going. I could have been a lot louder than I was, if I wanted to overpower everyone.

It works.

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Qtx-178-840UK-QR10PA-portable-PA/dp/B009L4KZ8I/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1400873795&sr=8-3&keywords=QTX"]http://www.amazon.co...-3&keywords=QTX[/url]

Although I put emphasis on it being able to be loud... remember it has a volume knob
At many locations you cannot play too loud, as you'll get complaints, so be sensible. But I'd rather be able to play louder and hold back, than wanting louder and having to push something else into distortion and sound bad.
I have played with this thing many times where volume was not an issue: the above beach busking session (it was an organised thing, where noise was ok), several pub "acoustic" sessions, etc.
On Sunday my band will be playing at the Knockengorroch festival, in SouthWest Scotland. In the afternoon there is a tent for "acoustic sessions" where we have secured a slot. The little QR10PA will allow me to play there easily, with my usual bass.

You can take it anywhere, and it will additionally play tracks from a USB stick with separate volume control or using an AUX input. There is actually a second input, but one single volume. If you want to use it for two instruments, best to use an external pedal to adjust the signal (like an EQ pedal). It does come with a crappy wireless mic... ignore it

Edited May 23, 2014 by mcnach

[mcnach]

tiny! compare it to the body of the bass

[BassTractor]

That Ray has a 34' scale?
(Yes, I bloody well know what I did!)

[flyfisher]

I was on a train from Cambridge recently and bunch of young lads looked like they were returning from some form of musical outing, one of whom was pushing a 'shopping trolly' with a car battery and inverter strapped to it.

I'd agree with the above comments about 'leisure' batteries though it rather depends on how much charge is taken from a car-type battery before it is recharged. My tractor has no working alternator so I use a standard battery charger once a month or so to charge it, even though I regularly start the engine, and the battery is still in good condition after more than five years.
So, like a lot of these questions, the answer can often start with 'it depends . . . .'.

As for types of inverters, probably the simplest method is to think in terms of watts and efficiencies.

In a perfect world, a 50W amplifier would require 50 watts of power to operate. In practice it won't be 100% efficient so let's be pessimistic and assume it's only 50% efficient, which means it will need 100 watts to operate.

So we'd need (as a minimum) an inverter with 100 watts of output . . . except that the inverter won't be perfect either, so let's again assume 50% efficiency, which means it will need 200 watts of power input to give 100 watts of output.

So we have a 12 volt battery that must supply 200 watts to an inverter so it can provide 100 watts to the amp so it can provide 50 watts of sound output.

200 watts from a 12 volt battery means about 17 amps.

A typical car battery might be rated at 75Ah, meaning 'amp-hours', meaning 1 amp for 75 hours or 75 amps for 1 hour or something in between. In practice it would not be good to totally discharge the battery so assume a rating of at least twice as much as will actually be required between charging.

So, from the above figures, we're assuming we need 17 amps from a car battery to power a 50W amp. Let's say we want to play for 3 hours, which means we will draw 17 x 3 = 51 amp-hours from the battery. Apply the 200% 'rule' described above and that gives a battery rating of about 100Ah.

So, a 100Ah car battery and a 200W inverter should be more than enough for a 50W amp.

I say 'more than enough' because my above efficiency assumptions are pessimistic, so make your own assumptions and recalculate the numbers above. Also, any amp is unlikely to be run at full volume, so a 50W amp might actually only be used at 25W, which would have a big effect on the above numbers. Or, a 50W amp might not be suitable at all for the purposes envisaged. Again, choose your own numbers for the above calculations.

Edited May 23, 2014 by flyfisher