wateroftyne Posted November 25, 2011 Author Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='cd_david' timestamp='1322172403' post='1447660'] [media]http://youtu.be/hOPxZ5NF-aM[/media] [media]http://youtu.be/KYVbekOQCYs[/media] Heres 2 that I think are brilliant but have the flamenco and chordal work all over them but still full of energy and drive. [/quote] Ah - I forgot about Driven. OK.. Driven it is. Freeze though... I've just had another listen in case I'm missing anything, but that song to me is everything I don't like about a lot of the stuff of this era. A load of snippets pro-tool'd together, with Geddy awkwardly trying to fit a melody around it. Bleh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) Mypick would be 'How it is' from Vapor Trails. I also reckon it's their best song of the last decade too. The bass part is insistent and driving, yet in the bridge and chorus it backs off and does a wonderful counterpart to the vocal melody. Geddy is really pushing the whole song along, backed by beautiful guitar and drums. If Geddy insists on the flamenco parts, they should be like this. Sadly, although I still love Rush and I enjoy their current output, their music has become a little bit simple. Maybe it's a hangover from Counterparts. They embraced the heavy rock sound on that record and left behind the beautifully arranged, melodic style they had perfected with Hold Your Fire. Since then, they've not got that back. I want Rush to sit down and talk about arranging something, a song that is lengthy and intricate and beautiful. They can still knock out a good riff, but I long for the 'old' Rush, who would write a song that was both catchy and engaging but also very deep, rewarding repeated listens. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IDqj0YYa9g Edited November 25, 2011 by Chris2112 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr.Dave Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='silddx' timestamp='1322150436' post='1447276'] Or harmony. Their songwriting is very poor these days. I don't like his vocal melodies, the awful mixing and mastering. There's no sweetness to their songs anymore, no energy, no beauty. They seem to have so little to say. [/quote] Interesting you put it that way - only last week a mate of mine said the same thing to me - my reply was that I think they've said enough. I understand and respect totally their attitude in not wanting to turn out a nostalgia set year in year out but I think the years have caught up with them and they can't live up to their own high standards regarding new material. Geddy's playing?? I think he continues to contribute colour to the songs the way he always did. As Rush has evolved he has evolved into more of an all round musician than his original 'bass player who sings'. I'm all for that. The song comes first. Always the song. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted November 25, 2011 Author Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='Dr.Dave' timestamp='1322230269' post='1448293'] Geddy's playing?? I think he continues to contribute colour to the songs the way he always did. As Rush has evolved he has evolved into more of an all round musician than his original 'bass player who sings'. I'm all for that. The song comes first. Always the song. [/quote] I actually think the song comes second with them these days...! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr.Dave Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1322230383' post='1448298'] I actually think the song comes second with them these days...! [/quote] [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1322230383' post='1448298'] I actually think the song comes second with them these days...! [/quote] In which case , maybe it's time for them to retire before their shield gets any heavier. I always figured Rush for a group of guys who would know when that time comes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bassman7755 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) Well the way I see it that is that for the first 20 years they churned out album after album of mostly brilliant and varied material. Most bands/artists over that period struggled to produce one album that would stand up well against the top 5 or 6 rush efforts. And along the way they have brought enormous pleasure to millions and inspired a generation to pick up and/or improve on their respective instruments. Given all that I'm quite happy for them to have a "working retirement", having fun producing new stuff and going out to play it even if much of it isn't upto the standard of some of the old stuff. Edited November 25, 2011 by bassman7755 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1322234407' post='1448391'] Well the way I see it that is that for the first 20 years they churned out album after album of mostly brilliant and varied material. Most bands/artists over that period struggled to produce one album that would stand up well against the top 5 or 6 rush efforts. And along the way they have brought enormous pleasure to millions and inspired a generation to pick up and/or improve on their respective instruments. Given all that I'm quite happy for them to have a "working retirement", having fun producing new stuff and going out to play it even if much of it isn't upto the standard of some of the old stuff. [/quote] I like your post, it has real warmth and spirit And I agree for the most part. However, how many more live albums, DVDs, repackaged box sets, repackaged/remastered CD/DVD box sets, anthologies, special edition box sets with original artwork, tour programmes, etc. etc. should one band put out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1322234407' post='1448391'] Given all that I'm quite happy for them to have a "working retirement", having fun producing new stuff and going out to play it even if much of it isn't upto the standard of some of the old stuff. [/quote] I couldn't agree more. I think they've earned the right to do as they please, and we can't be too harsh on them these days for merely turning out albums of good songs, as opposed to their old habits of consistently churning out masterpieces. We're lucky to have them, after all. Just over a decade ago, it looked as though they might have been gone for good, and under a cloud at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 New album due next year, and according to Ged in a recent interview, the producer is trying to encourage an older-style Rush record...epics were also mentioned. They put out a taster last year, the Caravan/BU2B single. If that's what's called a working retirement, they sound more alive on those two tracks than bands half their age IMHO! [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btoEgIlhbUc"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btoEgIlhbUc[/url] [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSgiFuGOZW4"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSgiFuGOZW4[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Another vote for "driven" here. Great line, especially the version on the "Different Stages" live album. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted November 26, 2011 Author Share Posted November 26, 2011 [quote name='spongebob' timestamp='1322242179' post='1448582'] New album due next year, and according to Ged in a recent interview, the producer is trying to encourage an older-style Rush record...epics were also mentioned. They put out a taster last year, the Caravan/BU2B single. If that's what's called a working retirement, they sound more alive on those two tracks than bands half their age IMHO! [/quote] I quite like Caravan, but it's not 'great'. IMO. Y'know, I'd like to hear them stripped back. Just the three of them doing their thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassmurf Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 My vote would have to be for "Far Cry"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbn4001 Posted November 26, 2011 Share Posted November 26, 2011 It is tough for me to contribute to this thread. Geddy was/is my bass hero. He is THE reason I bought a bass guitar and spent months shedding and shedding to be able to play some of his lines (incidentally, I do still practise, but possibly never with the same intensity as when I was so inspired by hearing Geddy's basslines for the first time as a teenager). I will agree with the sentiments of others on this thread in that we are lucky that they have pumped out so much good stuff in their time and darnit, they've EARNED the right to lay back and not be that productive these days.. back in the day, for the first 20 yrs of their career, they created and toured with incredible intensity and quality combined. My wife and I often look disparagingly on so many newer bands that only put out an album every four years right from when they start as youngsters.. beggars belief. ANYWAY - to get to the point. Geddy's basslines. Massive +1 to the guy that posted Freeze.. THAT and a couple of others on Vapour Trails were the last decent bassline from Ged.. Test for Echoes had Time and Motion. Vapour trails, production aside, was a great album IMO.. possibly their most creative and striving effort since MP, likely borne of Neil Peart's multiple personal tragedies combined with the desire to prove themselves after a long break. Snakes and Arrows was a complete contrast. An appalling album which I think came about through comfort and happiness after the last album and tours - and a producer who was a massive Rush fan telling them that everything they did was great. Alas they're using the same producer for next album. Finally they're believing their own hype. But let's face it, it took a long time for this to happen. Back to the basslines.. for me it is not so much the innovative basslines that I miss.. if only because I think he can still knock it out when he wants as per Freeze et al I've just mentioned .. the tragedy for me was seeing them live this yr at O2 arena.. and DAMN if I didn't think their playing was sloppy. and DAMN if I didn't think Geddy's perpetual one finger flamenco dan-an-ana-nana-nana-nana-angering over the OLD tunes, let alone the new, P*ssed me off big time. In short, I know where OP is coming from, but I still think he produces good stuff, albeit in smaller quantity. But he and the three of them as a whole have earned the right to sit back more than any other rock band IMO, period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted November 27, 2011 Author Share Posted November 27, 2011 [quote name='jbn4001' timestamp='1322340497' post='1449730'] DAMN if I didn't think Geddy's perpetual one finger flamenco dan-an-ana-nana-nana-nana-angering over the OLD tunes, let alone the new, P*ssed me off big time.[/quote] Yeah... me too. When it hit home for me was the instrumental break in Between the Wheels on the R30 tour. [quote name='jbn4001' timestamp='1322340497' post='1449730'] In short, I know where OP is coming from, but I still think he produces good stuff, albeit in smaller quantity. But he and the three of them as a whole have earned the right to sit back more than any other rock band IMO, period. [/quote] The thing is, they can only get away with it 'cos there's thousands of people like me who will continue to throw money at them regardless of what they put out. They're almost unique in that regard. (Oh, and Alex... stop pretending to sing. It looks silly.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted December 5, 2011 Author Share Posted December 5, 2011 There's hope yet.... from a new interview with Geddy in Rolling Stone: [quote]The first two [single] releases from this album, "Caravan" and "Brought Up to Believe," are a great indication of where this album's going, although there's much more variety than just what those two songs offer. When I look back at [2007 album] "Snakes and Arrows," as happy as we were with that record, in retrospect I feel we kind of overdid it with overdubs. We'd like to simplify that, just in terms of making sure the guitar, bass and drum sounds are big and loud and clear, and any time we are going to add an overdub, to make sure that it definitely is adding and not subtracting.[/quote] Here's hoping.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieBenzies Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 [quote name='steve-bbb' timestamp='1322169197' post='1447601'] none of their later material has really grabbed me since moving pictures and signals - too formulaic and lacking in the charisma department - i dont dislike their material and im not against their change of style per se i just think their current style and sound hasnt produced anything of equal merit to the early and mid stuff if you get my drift edit - oops sorry forgot the answer to the original question here it is [media]http://youtu.be/wlNrQGmj6oQ[/media] listen to all 26 mins and tell me if you honestly think that any of the recent albums have any bass lines to compare with this [/quote] This is the era that I loved and am now feeling very nostalgic listening to. The ballsy composition (complete with randomly inserted diminished scales) and hilariously typical prog lyrics. Awesome. These are the riffs here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endorka Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 [quote name='silddx' timestamp='1322151017' post='1447283'] He's highly rated because he can play fast and sing at the same time while navigating some difficult arrangements. Rush are innovators and in a class of their own, they used to write some incredible music. However, what Geddy plays, while being fast is actually not very complex or difficult, it just takes good technique, stamina and a good ear. It's not compositionally amazing bass or anything, a lot of it is boxes and patterns. [/quote] I agree with this up to the point, in the sense that there is music out there that is more "advanced" theoretically. On the other hand, I once had to play YYZ for real, and I found it quite challenging getting it up to speed. In fact the last mega-widdle was always a bit hit and miss :-) Jennifer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Poor Geddy. Damned if he does and damned if he doesn't! His style has evolved over the years and he is clearly still listening to other types of music. The influence can be heard at various points in his career. As it can when he switches to another instrument. On the first couple of albums, when (I believe) he was using a combination of Fender P and Rick, he had a certain sound and style. That was very different to the much more upfront clangy Rick sound on Farewell to Kings and Permanent Waves. It changed/evolved again into Moving Pictures as the smoother, more distorted Jazz tone came to the fore. Signals was Steinberger scoopedness... Then it all went pear-shaped (IMO) with the Wals and funkmaster strings. Bleearrgh. Since then we have had the increasingly metallic clanginess of various Jazz basses... And that's just his sound, never mind his technique!! Sounds like some people would rather he has stayed exactly as he was in 1981, but that was never likely to happen with such an innovative musician was it? I still love him and his playing, but find his current tone harder to listen to. My choice I know. As far as his last "great" bass line? I really like "The Pass" from Presto. Others since then have been good in parts, but no more than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I like his tone on the new live album. Still Ged, but a bit less bright than recent live stuff - the Rush In Rio has a very bright tone indeed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velvetkevorkian Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 If by "bright" you mean "absolutely monstrous" then I agree with you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 [quote name='spongebob' timestamp='1323277301' post='1461517'] I like his tone on the new live album. Still Ged, but a bit less bright than recent live stuff - the Rush In Rio has a very bright tone indeed! [/quote] If by "bright" you mean "fizzy mess" then I agree with you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Another Geddy-related can of worms officially opened....! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RhysP Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 His best bassline was "Working Man". He should have called it a day after that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steverickwood Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Of course, we can say all we want, lets not ignore facts: like many others such as jaco etc, he set the bar higher for bass and inspired many to play. So good for him. Had I not seen them in 87 then maybe I'd be working in a bank! They won their way a long time ago and maybe they have diiferent musical aspirations now. At least theyre still playing. Bill Bruford did a talk at the university where I teach and he discussed the technical level of musicians nowadays, in an industry that to an extent crushes creativity. bands like Rush are still out there doing their thing and not conforming to 'booklearnt' writing methods, so good on them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 In reference to an earlier point, I liked Snakes and Arrows a lot more than I thought I might, though I didn't like it as much as I had hoped I might. Songs like Workin' Them Angels are just fantastic, and 'Hope' is one of my favourite solo pieces of all time. Compare Snakes and Arrows to some of the rubbish they have made like Counterparts and you'll soon realise it's a pretty good record. At least there, they have something to say whereas Counterparts was mostly drossy, naff rock. I think what Rush really need to get back to is great melodies. They need to sit and listen to Hold Your Fire over and over again and really get into those songs, and appreciate the arrangements where every instrument is producing a melody, making a catchy noise and adding to the song. I feel for the past few years they've just thought "lets crank up the gain and thrash something out and see what happens". They need to get back to arranging things, as the stock rock song format for them has become a little tired. They make great rock albums but I firmly believe from the glimmers of brilliance on Snakes and Arrows that they are capable of so much more than just being a great rock band. They've done it in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.