Wilco Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 Hi All, I would be grateful to hear from anyone who uses one of these amps, particularly in relation to background 'hiss'. I had an Ashdown Little Giant 1000 which I loved until the thing recently went up in smoke The LG was virtually silent when on but not playing, with no audible hisses, pops crackles etc... Ashdown no longer make the LG so I had to look for an alternative & based on an internet full of positive reviews, I went for the Hartke LH500 which arrived today. The tone is fantastic & the thing has oodles of power, but to my ears it is quite hissy. This is dramatically increased when turning up the volume control rather than when the treble is increased which is the usual culprit for hiss. It's [i]very[/i] noticeable with the volume on 5 & over - get the volume knob to 7 & it's just hiss city! I've reduced the hiss by turning down the gain on the active Maverick basses, but it's still very noticeable even with the passive Fender plugged in. It may be just the way these amps are which is why I am keen to hear from any other users, or is it a preamp problem I've got (are these shipped with low quality valves does anybody know?) Any words of wisdom would be much appreciated. (nb: I live in a fairly new house so the electrics are good & I only use good quality cables. New speaker cables bought for this amp - Klotz cable with Neutrik jack plugs) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisnameistaken Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 My LH500 is dead silent, even with my lousy Squier jazz plugged in the front. Honestly I've never heard a peep out of it. Do you have a lot of treble boost in your bass sound? Always-on distortion or something? It sounds like something is up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 [quote name='Wilco' post='1003118' date='Oct 27 2010, 10:37 PM']I've reduced the hiss by turning down the gain on the active Maverick basses, but it's still very noticeable even with the passive Fender plugged in.[/quote] If turning down the bass reduces the hiss, then some of the hiss is coming from the bass. Does your cab have a tweeter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_Bass Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 Is your power chord connected to a socket with ground connection? 99.9% of the hiss and static cases are caused by this! Make shure you have ground anywhere you plug your amp! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 [quote name='Ghost_Bass' post='1003976' date='Oct 28 2010, 04:14 PM']Is your power chord connected to a socket with ground connection? 99.9% of the hiss and static cases are caused by this! Make shure you have ground anywhere you plug your amp![/quote] The UK mains supply is in general pretty clean and it is actually unlikely that 'hiss' is caused by bad earthing. Hum can be caused by earth loops or bad earthing in an environment, along with strip lighting near to the equipment. A quick tip for helping to isolate where the hiss is coming from:- With your gear plugged in normally (so that you can hear the hiss) get another good guitar lead and plug just one end of the lead into the 'Effects Return' on the back of the LH500. Does the hiss go away? If it does, then the hiss is caused by either the preamp or whatever is plugged in to the amplifier (e.g Bass). If this is the case AND the hiss doesnt go away when you unplug your bass - it's liable to be the preamp causing the issue, not the bass. The LH500 has a very simple preamp and I would then suspect a possibly noisey valve. If the hiss *does* go away when you unplug your bass, there's the culpret! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilco Posted October 28, 2010 Author Share Posted October 28, 2010 Many thanks for your posts guys. Dood - tried your process. Connected active & passive basses into their respective inputs (separately obviously!) & amp hissed way merrily. Put a good instrument cable in the effects return socket & the hiss went (mind you, doing that muted the whole sound - was that to be expected?). Unplugged both basses & the hiss was still there. Didn't actually try it previously with nothing plugged in the front end - the hiss was quieter, starts getting noticeable at about 5 on the volume control, but to me, still way to loud at 7 (although will I ever need to have it that loud is another question.....). I think the basses are a contributing factor, particularly an active one, but as a couple of the other posts are saying their LH500's are silent I'm thinking I have a noisy pre-amp. As you say, possibly the valve is the guilty party. I've mentioned it to the retailer & he was going to get some advice from the distributor so I'll await their response & take it from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 [quote name='Wilco' post='1004369' date='Oct 28 2010, 08:56 PM']Many thanks for your posts guys. Dood - tried your process. Connected active & passive basses into their respective inputs (separately obviously!) & amp hissed way merrily. Put a good instrument cable in the effects return socket & the hiss went (mind you, doing that muted the whole sound - was that to be expected?).[/quote] Yep, exactly. Good stuff! [quote]Unplugged both basses & the hiss was still there. Didn't actually try it previously with nothing plugged in the front end - the hiss was quieter, starts getting noticeable at about 5 on the volume control, but to me, still way to loud at 7 (although will I ever need to have it that loud is another question.....). I think the basses are a contributing factor, particularly an active one, but as a couple of the other posts are saying their LH500's are silent I'm thinking I have a noisy pre-amp. As you say, possibly the valve is the guilty party. I've mentioned it to the retailer & he was going to get some advice from the distributor so I'll await their response & take it from there.[/quote] Ok, interesting stuff. Well in the design the master volume control is placed before the effects loop but after the valve. So if the hiss progressively gets louder as you turn the volume up without a bass plugged in - and the hiss is pretty loud, then I deduce you do indeed have a noisey lil valve! - It's a ECC83 / 12AX7 in there and very lilely to be one of the Sovtek rebadged valves such as 'electroharmonix' or you could even have a JJ valve in there - but any 12AX7 will be ok (though I'd recommend getting the best valve possible to go in that slot!) - The distributor is Korg and they are brilliant - it's likely they will pop a preamp valve in the post for you, which is dead easy to swap out. I and many others on the forum are here to help you should you need assistance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_Bass Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 I changed my trace's original valve for a [i]EHX 12AX7 electron tube[/i] - comes in a black box - and my sound improved a lot! The valve pre (named as valve drive) in my amp comes after the SS pre and has a on/off switch. Does your ashdown have the same switch? Try and turn it off to see if that hiss desapears... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted October 29, 2010 Share Posted October 29, 2010 [quote name='Ghost_Bass' post='1004601' date='Oct 29 2010, 12:20 AM']I changed my trace's original valve for a [i]EHX 12AX7 electron tube[/i] - comes in a black box - and my sound improved a lot! The valve pre (named as valve drive) in my amp comes after the SS pre and has a on/off switch. Does your ashdown have the same switch? Try and turn it off to see if that hiss desapears...[/quote] The OP is refering to a Hartke head with hiss issues. - The Hartke unfortunately does not have a valve bypass, as the circuit uses the valve exclusively for amplification - as opposed to the Ashdown and Trace Elliot design of using the valve more as an 'effect' like drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted October 29, 2010 Share Posted October 29, 2010 (edited) Call Larry Hartke? Seriously! [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=686428"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=686428[/url] 2nd post in, is Larry, offering his cell phone number. Genuinely amazing CS.... As an aside PLux's LH500 is pretty darn quiet (more hissy with the Bright switch in but not too bad) Edited October 29, 2010 by 51m0n Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_Bass Posted October 30, 2010 Share Posted October 30, 2010 [quote name='dood' post='1005568' date='Oct 29 2010, 06:19 PM']The OP is refering to a Hartke head with hiss issues. - The Hartke unfortunately does not have a valve bypass, as the circuit uses the valve exclusively for amplification - as opposed to the Ashdown and Trace Elliot design of using the valve more as an 'effect' like drive.[/quote] OK, my bad! Don't know enough about hartke gear and i must admit i was too tired to search it before my post! Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted October 30, 2010 Share Posted October 30, 2010 I've got the LH1000 and found that replacing the valve with one of higher quality made a difference. Also attenuating the horn in my 4x10 reduced the hiss too. I also found that I had some noise from the effects board too (not using the FX loop of the amp though). I'm not entirely sure whether I eliminated all of it as I've recently been using a compressor with a built in gate which has killed ANY background noise, maybe not the solution for everyone, but worked for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilco Posted October 30, 2010 Author Share Posted October 30, 2010 [quote name='paul_5' post='1006457' date='Oct 30 2010, 05:10 PM']I've got the LH1000 and found that replacing the valve with one of higher quality made a difference. Also attenuating the horn in my 4x10 reduced the hiss too. I also found that I had some noise from the effects board too (not using the FX loop of the amp though). I'm not entirely sure whether I eliminated all of it as I've recently been using a compressor with a built in gate which has killed ANY background noise, maybe not the solution for everyone, but worked for me.[/quote] Thanks for your post. Interesting that you felt the need to change the valve, so valve noise may be an issue with some of these amps. I think I will order a top quality valve & see what happens. I've actually turned both horns off in my cabs as I can get a trebly enough sound from this amp without them on! From the sounds of it though, most of your noise was coming from your effects board / instrument - if you are not using the effects loop & plugging into the front end + all noise has gone by introducing a noisegate, then most of the noise must have been pre input. Mines got loads of white noise with nothing plugged in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted October 30, 2010 Share Posted October 30, 2010 To be fair, I changed my valve for a tonal variation on some recordings, and the noise reduction was a welcome side effect. I think you're right about the nise from the pedal board - currently up to 6 different distortion pedals etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilco Posted October 31, 2010 Author Share Posted October 31, 2010 Genalex 12AX7 Gold Lion on order - will let you know the outcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted November 1, 2010 Share Posted November 1, 2010 I've never noticed any hiss on my LH500, but I mostly use it at full band rehearsals at pretty high volume, so any background hiss would not be noticeable anyway.... I have heard other users refer to hiss from these amps, but I can only speak as I find! Then again, my Status is beautifully screened and uses quality components so it doesn't produce any hiss. I don't use any effects either, so there's another source of noise eliminated. I would have thought that it was only a real problem if you were recording the bass through a mike rather vthan DI'ed - particularly if the speakers themselves are contributing to the hiss... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilco Posted November 3, 2010 Author Share Posted November 3, 2010 (edited) Well the Genalex Gold Lion valve turned up today &...........................it made hardly any difference to the hiss. For anybody that might want to know, the valve I pulled out was a Sovtek 12AX7-WA. What I have noticed now is that the amp seems slightly louder at any given point on the volume control & that notes are tighter a better defined. Low notes are controlled better & the treble is a bit 'glassier' - so not a total waste of £35 then.... (& at least I have a spare valve in the original Sovtek). So what now? I've only tried this amp out at home in a fairly small room & I'm thinking that in a band environment, this hiss may not be an issue (thankfully in a loud rock covers band). Our next band get together is at the end of the month though so I won't know that for a few weeks More research & posts on this thread indicate a mixed response - some LH500's hiss & others don't. This could be a quality control thing, although when I had the lid off replacing the valve, the internals looked very well put together - everything was totally neat & tidy. Bearing in mind the hiss on my amp occurs with nothing plugged into the input too, the only other variables I can think of are the cables & the speakers. I bought new cable for this amp due to the 1/4 inch jack outputs - Klotz cable with genuine Neutrik jacks so I'm thinking they should be fine. The amp is outputting to two Ashdown Klystron/Classic cabinets - these are excellent quality cabs so perhaps their transparency is just letting more white noise through. Or I could just have a faulty head in some other way.... On balance I think in a band environment all should be ok though. Thinking of the tone & volume from this amp for, let's face it, a very reasonable £299. (NB: item bought from Soundslive - a company I've bought from many times. A bit disappointed then that they were very quick off the mark when I was on the 'phone wanting to buy, but clearly a punter who is not entirley happy with his purchase is a bit of an inconvenience to them....... Big difference to The Academy of Sound who bent over backwards when my Ashdown went tits up, & gave me all my money back (in warranty) when they ran out of options) Edited November 3, 2010 by Wilco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 [quote](NB: item bought from Soundslive - a company I've bought from many times. A bit disappointed then that they were very quick off the mark when I was on the 'phone wanting to buy, but clearly a punter who is not entirley happy with his purchase is a bit of an inconvenience to them....... Big difference to The Academy of Sound who bent over backwards when my Ashdown went tits up, & gave me all my money back (in warranty) when they ran out of options)[/quote] Interesting that you've had an Ashdown that went the way of all flesh; I had one for just under two weeks, did two gigs and some studio work and it started falling apart (still sounded great though), so took it back (again to Academy of Sound) who did the same for me. Genuinely helpful chaps. Haven't bought Ashdown kit since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted November 6, 2010 Share Posted November 6, 2010 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='1003894' date='Oct 28 2010, 02:37 PM']Does your cab have a tweeter?[/quote] This could be an indicator. Are those who don't notice any/much hiss not using a tweeter? - Or are those who notice hiss, have a tweeter and is it iturned right up / particularly sensitive? - as this could help to make the natural hiss of the amplifier more prominent. All amplifiers create noise as a byproduct of amplification, though some are inherently noiseier than others due to design and quality of components. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisnameistaken Posted November 6, 2010 Share Posted November 6, 2010 [quote name='dood' post='1014587' date='Nov 6 2010, 06:16 PM']This could be an indicator. Are those who don't notice any/much hiss not using a tweeter? - Or are those who notice hiss, have a tweeter and is it iturned right up / particularly sensitive? - as this could help to make the natural hiss of the amplifier more prominent. All amplifiers create noise as a byproduct of amplification, though some are inherently noiseier than others due to design and quality of components.[/quote] I'm using a 1212L but I turn the tweeter down quite a lot, so maybe I am attentuating the hiss, but I literally can't hear anything - I can't tell how loud my amp is until I start playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lollington Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Hijacking the thread somewhat, but recently picked up a LH500 myself. Does anyone else notice a notice jump in volume around the 6 mark? Seems to be pretty quiet up till then.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 (edited) [quote name='lollington' post='1109859' date='Jan 31 2011, 06:59 PM']Hijacking the thread somewhat, but recently picked up a LH500 myself. Does anyone else notice a notice jump in volume around the 6 mark? Seems to be pretty quiet up till then....[/quote] There are dozens of posts on BC and TB noting this characteristic of the volume pot. Edited February 6, 2011 by Sparky Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mog Posted May 18, 2011 Share Posted May 18, 2011 Sortabump!?? Just noticed an oscillating whistle coming through the speakers connected to my LH500 when I was not playing. Very strange. Could it be bad juice going to the head from the power outlet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted May 18, 2011 Share Posted May 18, 2011 [quote name='Mog' post='1235290' date='May 18 2011, 09:57 AM']Sortabump!?? Just noticed an oscillating whistle coming through the speakers connected to my LH500 when I was not playing. Very strange. Could it be bad juice going to the head from the power outlet?[/quote] ok, plug your bass straight in to the EFFECTS RETURN on the back of the amp (Start with the bass volume all the way down and turn it up gently) Have a play through and see if the oscillating has gone away. By plugging in to the return socket you are plugging directly in to the power amplifier section of the amp and bypassing the preamp. I suggest this as it will allow you to get an idea if it's a preamp problem, such as a 'microphonic valve'. If the noise stops when you plug in to the poweramp then you have possibly isolated the cause. Given that I can't hear the noise this would be be initial thought. Should you need to replace the valve, it's a 12AX7 (otherwise known as an ECC83) and my personal preference for a budget but good quality preamp valve is the JJ ECC83S that can be picked up for 7-10 quid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mog Posted May 18, 2011 Share Posted May 18, 2011 Nice one dood. I'll give it a go at the next practice session. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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