JTUK

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1357073902' post='1917261'] The 3012LF is 12" driver. No 12" driver is the best thing for the job over about 2k because they become directional above there. Thus to do the best job, you use the 12s up to the point they are the best and use something else higher. [/quote] Thank you. So a cab with chassis' that have a top useable frequency of 2k needs another unit to produce the higher end. We agree. Just as well I use 10's with a horn then...

In all seriousness.. I don't think I lost a gig with my Sei Flam5 but I know my current basses, which are 5 and active, are far better suited for everything I hear, and therefore play. Shame I don't get called as much...

if someone had offered us £8 ..we'd have been there.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1357063797' post='1917037'] 5 string Jazz? [/quote] way to go, Pete Gotta agree.

[quote name='0175westwood29' timestamp='1357071223' post='1917201'] ok ill get my coat [/quote] have a beer.

I am only complaining about the fact that no one was willing to pay what we were 'worth'.

what have I missed..??? Late skimmer........ Technique is a wonderful thing to have... but is it the be-all and end-all..?? Not if you haven't got anything else... And you can have all the energy and passion under the sun... and it gets you no where with a decent facility to put that across. It is all about what you bring to the party.... and if you will carry the P.A, lights etc ....you're in..

Not me... I think we set an unreasonable price for the two prime nights and came up with zilch... !!! I am in two minds about it... a) easy money and could I be bothered wit the lottery of drunks..?? oh well............. hope you all did well out of it. The TV has been crap this xmas

[quote name='0175westwood29' timestamp='1357069083' post='1917142'] can i just stumble in and say that i use a 112 and a 115 together and they sound awesome! surely thats all that matters? andy [/quote] No....

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1357069109' post='1917143'] Different to what? The flagship Barefaced cab is the Big Twin, it used a pair of 3012LF and a mid driver I've forgotten, that costs about the same as one of the LF drivers. The Super 12 uses a pair of 3012 and no separate mid. It isn't hard to figure by looking at the website, and some basic logic. [/quote] I was talking about the 12's..I quoted the 12's in the link..was only ever referring to 12's.. and said the higher priced 12 was limited to 2k. Where you get the 8k figure in relation to 12's in the cab config, I don't know.... unless they use a different chassis ..which again, wouldn't be a crime, but then it wouldn't be the top end spec range either according to price... which also assumes that top end price means best chassis for the job.. I have not got a problem with that, which ever way it lines up..... But hey, if it suits your argument, fill your boots

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1357063764' post='1917035'] If it was magic, it wouldn't come from anywhere. It comes from the speaker. The one that does the higher frequencies, because 8k is a quite high frequency, in the scheme of things. [/quote] So, different speakers then...?? So a 212 with different spec chassis...??? not unreasonable. so which model would that be..??

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1357048161' post='1916694'] I don't get it. Why would a sealed 8x10 handle bass bleed better than any other non sealed cab of any other configuration? [/quote] You don't want the bass to bleed at all...but it is very hard to control, so the less amount the better. This is why bass heavy cabs aren't really wanted on large stages with lots of mics. The bass is going to get there anyway but you want to cut the amount down if poss... This is also why engrs would not want cabs on stage ...in an ideal world...but their approach is the get the best sound which isnt unreasonable in itself but at odds with a lot of the musos that have to create it. So, it becomes a game of managing your 'compromises'

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1357044825' post='1916635'] Why's that? You keep telling us that your opinion, built up over years of experience, is valid - so why shouldn't anyone else's be, even if you disagree with it? [/quote] It wasn't even the content of it... it was the way the 'point' was 'qualified'..

Playing bass is arty but also technical.... I put it down to envy that the business is often very arbitary about who it rewards and that many here think they could cover a gig that earns some people a lot of money, better, or at least as good. I don't think you should waste your time thinking about it too much.... but we ike to chat so the subject is fair game It's banter..who cares..? you have other things in your life.

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1356998361' post='1916298'] Yes, I found that out a good while back. Set up, great sound on stage, full of bite, go out front for sound-check, full of boom & mush. I now find that to get a good sound out front, I have to get a clanky/middy/scratchy/nasally sound on stage which I don`t particularly like. Then when I stand where the audience are, it sounds just right in the mix. [/quote] This is why the Goliath 410 was such a revelation way back when.... you had to adjust your sound if stood near by and relearn to play, in a sense, with the sound...but you knew it worked at a distance. That is why they are a stage rig cab...as ideally you want enough room to stand off them. Imagine doing that with a 215 or 118... Not sure your mon engr is going to love you which is why the industry standard is a sealed 810... which should handle the bass bleed better, IMO.

laughable post.... can't begin to...well, I can't stop laughing....

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1356994641' post='1916252'] The cheaper one goes to 4k, so if you are cheap, you can make a cab that goes to 4k, but Barefaced use not one, but two premium drivers in their flagship cabs so they can go as high as 8k+, and probably a fair bit lower (lots lower with any power handling) than a cab loaded with a single cheapy driver. [/quote] hmmm where does this 8k magically come from..??

Thought it was going to be a trick question.. but 810 every day of the week and twice on sundays. And no, it will not beef up your sound, IMO

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1356886648' post='1914745'] This, or a variation of it, is the most commonly used neo twelve: [url="http://www.bluearan.co.uk/index.php?id=EMIDLIT2512&browsemode=manufacturer"]http://www.bluearan....de=manufacturer[/url] This, or a variation of it, is what you'll find in BFB twelve loaded cabs: [url="http://www.bluearan.co.uk/index.php?id=EMIKLIT3012LF&browsemode=manufacturer"]http://www.bluearan....de=manufacturer[/url] [/quote] I was talking about this link...and they are both 12" and according to Eminence the cheaper 12 in the links is the one that goes to 4khz. I am sure it is a perfectly good driver.

How long is a piece of string..? First thing I would do is get the core sounds right between instruments and then EQ them to fit the band. This means a session on each instrument ..and if the drums aren't tuned well.... you might as well just plug in and hope... If you get in a war of who owns what frequencies, you end up with mush...and there is no way back from that. Don't try and over-power the room either as you'll lose that one as well. Difficult to offer much more than generalities out of context....

Hmm.. I find I either get the salesperson or I don't...and if I don't there is no chance I'll buy from them. I have still to meet up with the rep and his string factory story... so that will be a definitive meeting

And you'll live and die on your sound.. so I'd say do it properly and do it well. How much kit you'll have to carry and how much you'll have to pay is going to be your journey of discovery. We have bands round here using 4-5k rigs in pubs... but that doesn't garauntee you can hear everything....?????? but there you go, and we have guys with £200 tops which, franky, kill any chance with the vocals and the vox aren't great in the first place let alone the shagged horns not producing a nice sound. I can tell you which bands have a decent sound on the circuit and which bands have no chance...so whatever you have, you stand a better chance if you understand how to use it. I have to say, P.A and vox are a pet theme with us... and there is no way I'd sacrifice the band sound on a light carry if it doesn't deliver.. even if we are playing a pub. FWIW, we get by with KW12's and no subs for most gigs.

[quote name='Phil Starr' timestamp='1356972839' post='1915883'] We're a three piece so there's only the singer/guitarist to worry about. The drummers pretty experienced so he just plays at whatever volume we need and so far we haven't needed to mic' the drums. Gigs aren't the problem as I just roll of the bass and you hear that from the PA anyway. At rehearsals it is pushing it a bit without the PA support, You have to put up with a bit less bass and the speaker will hit the magnet if I forget to roll off. Mainly I put the Hartke into a corner and get boundary reinforcement from the walls and floors. Drummers generally only want timing information and cues from the bass and this is mainly in the midrange anyway, the way we set up he gets more midrange from my monitor than he did from the stack and because it is small I usually manage to squeeze it in behind him. I think he hears the Toms and Kick better without a lot of deep bass on stage and the bonus is a lot less spill through the mic's. He's a bit of a tone freak with his drums and likes to hear them clearly. Remember that loudness is logarithmic so 120W is only 6dB down from 500W so 6dB of bass cut allows you to be a similar volume in the rest of the range, You don't lose as much as you'd think and the increase in clarity and cleaning up the front of house sound is worth the trade. [/quote] Ok... Have to hear it in context, but not something I'd go near, tbh. We all have to hear what everyone plays so we can connect to it...and react to it and the stage volume is all part of this.

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1356910402' post='1915151'] Rendered irrelevant by the mid driver in the barefaced cab, which gives it about 4k more, especially so off axis. [/quote] Which cab or cabs are you referring to...? If you look at the spec of the 212, it will say upto 4khz..??? but no horn. If that is the case, then it uses the cheaper Emimence driver from BFM link..?? The Eminence freq stats could be wrong but that is a difference of nigh on 2k...??? not sure where that will come from..??