Musicman20

[quote name='alexclaber' post='576743' date='Aug 21 2009, 02:59 PM']In this thread the only mention of my own cabs has been: "You can have tons of bottom and tons of clarity - that's what the Big One does, that's what my Acmes did (less midrange punch but a bit more air on top) and that's what any good PA system does." The reason I stuck my oar in is that I regularly rehearse through an old TE 4x10" combo and I know what it sounds like and what it can do. And I like what it does - possibly the best old school 16th note fingerfunk sound I've had - but to claim it has big bottom is deluded (and probably an honest mistake because people simply do not listen - like they perceive a lack of highs as more bottom - you can't trust your ears until you understand your ears). I was just googling to see if I could find an old TE catalogue I'd seen recently, which illustrated their various suggested rigs, including things like the 18"+10"+tweeter cab, and monster stadium rigs like 2x15"s+4x10"s, dual 18"s plus 10"s and the 4x5" bright box, etc. To wrap any brand up as "sounding like X" is inaccurate when it runs the full gamut from punchy but bottomless monsters like the sealed 4x10" combo, through honky but amazingly loud bandpass 10" combos, through enormously thick and deep valve powered 2x15" rigs to the hi-fi rigs of the day like their biamped stadium gear or even their BFC swansong. What TE did do is advance the art of the bass AMP. They never really dug into the cab designs, lots of bright ideas but not the soundest acoustic thinking behind them, but still much better than most other bass gear in their prime era. Comments like this are just ill informed: "even though my Little Mark 3 has got serious low end....you cannot beat the sound of those full weight amps/cabs. Sometimes, they are just NECESSARY!" If that is implying that this old gear has something special about it in producing deep weighty lows, then it's plain wrong. I know it's not easy describing tone in words - most bassists couldn't even tell the difference between a 40Hz and 80Hz tone, so once you get into talking about fat bottom, punchy mids, etc, what hope is there? Alex[/quote] We are only stating from our opinions. I have little experience with the highly technical side of how an amp/cab works I'm afraid. Bass playing is a massive part of my life, but I leave the technical side to the designers....as im not being paid to look into it; that side of my life is already hugely complex as I am training in my legal profession. I don't think my comment was ill informed in the slightest, maybe just not qualified. Some of these old design amps/cabs do just sound right to me, even if that might be a psychological effect. And, as much as specs are specs, we all know the LM3 has serious arse kicking low end compared to most lightweight amps....there are tons of threads on Tbass about this. Thats why I bought it. This old gear, to me, especially Trace, does sound right, hence why thousands of people love what they do. I will still buy heavy amps and cabs no matter what light gear I buy, whcih I will buy! And, to quote a few experts on talkbass, you do lose something, every so slighty, with neo speakers. Thats why Ive seen a few guys buy neo cabs like the AE410 and then switch to the HS410.Whether you do or you dont on a scientific level, its what the listener/player thinks. I'd prefer to keep it to a test of my ears....I have A/B'd a few neo and ceramic cabs, and the ceramic edged it....but we will all have some sort of opinion. That Trace 4x10 might not have huge bottom end, but it does have a fair whack. I don't like 'huge' bottom end from my cab setup, I like a 'normal' amount. Whether this is down to the fact all my favourite players tend to have an aggressive cutting sound I just don't know. When I did hammer the lows up with the Orange 1x15, it sounded very very special....but I wouldnt use that much low for gigging, unless Metallica asked me to join. LOL. Its all just tastes I guess

I agree we all want bottom end, but I really don't want a muffled reggae/dub type low end. Some players love it, and it 'feels' great when you hear it live, but I love that sound of a cutting bass. Again, sometimes this changes....P bass with tone down, little more bass on amp = lovely. The only graphic I got on with was Trace. Sometimes it did feel sterile though...but once you messed around a little it suddenly felt right. I must admit I am not of fan of pre-shapes, lots of buttons, loads of options. Hence why my amps sounded good as soon as I plugged in, (with the Orange I barely ever move the EQ...simple and awesome). So yeah, the only thing with Trace was sometimes its amount of options! And, the amp heads weighed SO much. Never had a Trace cab, but I always enjoyed borrowing and testing them. I hope they stick around and make more of an impression with their next line.

Wow.... I want a custom shop I think I want one more than a Sadowsky...!

Nice colour. What P is it? Matches the amp.....not only that...but good photos!

Just thought 'lets be different and play bass....and do it properly'. I was a young grunge kid at the time. The I learnt to play punk 'well'....and not just follow the guitar. Bass to me always just seemed right. I do like guitar, but it never feels as good as bass.

I think it makes me realise that as much as I do like some fat low end, I also like to concentrate on having a nice cut through crisp sound.....sometimes anyway...not always.

even though my Little Mark 3 has got serious low end....you cannot beat the sound of those full weight amps/cabs. Sometimes, they are just NECESSARY!

Glad to see there is some love for them. To be fair, I dont know how anyone can worry about volume with a 4x10...ever. Unless its a stadium.

[quote name='Clarky' post='573999' date='Aug 19 2009, 12:32 PM']FYI, that is the exact same colour scheme of Beedsters' 09 Jazz (formerly mine). Looks great in the flesh.[/quote] Also the same as mine. Very good colour...looks even nicer in the flesh.

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='573328' date='Aug 18 2009, 06:57 PM']I can probably bus up one evening if you are passing town on the way somewhere, give me an excuse to play with your nice basses. And if you wanna play with pedals or something too. I'm trying out for some cheesy thing this weekend and might need a sensible cab.[/quote] Sensible...does that mean NON-DOOM?!

I used a backline provided Trace 4x10 Series 6 Combo on Saturday. Just got to say, I played on one third volume with gain set so it wasnt at all going into the red. It competed against 2 4x12s and a drummer no problem....I was sometimes too loud! Very loud and full clear Trace sound. Weighed a LOT though...good job I wasnt moving it around. Still sometimes miss my old Trace 400W SMX Amp.... Sorry, no idea why I put a thread up about this. How does the new Trace compare to the old?

Amp head wise, get a Shuttle 6.0 or Little Mark 2/3.

Bump

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='573485' date='Aug 18 2009, 09:07 PM']Doom.[/quote] Full on Doom!

I dont see what the anti-4x10 is about....to me they are very good and extremely capable of a good volume and low end if you buy the right one. 2x12 is also great, but a different sound. 4x10 seems to have a lot more zing and high end....little bit more punch.....

The neck pockets on both my new Fenders are excellent. No problems whatsoever. They have both been looked over by a professional and said to be 'spot on'.

Ive not used my Stingrays for while....until I plugged one into my Mark Mass LM3 and Berg HS410....then and only then did I realise the amazing sound the amp/cab and bass produce. Certain amp/cabs/basses just dont mix, and i've no idea why. I find Stingrays need that massive low end thump to match their cutting mids....which the Mark Bass does in spades. Sorry I cant help with the settings...

[quote name='Beedster' post='571922' date='Aug 17 2009, 06:54 PM']Funny you should ask......... The '09 Fender compares well in the following: Build quality & finishing: Feel & weight Playability and set-up. I can get the same buzz-free low action and intonation on the Fender I got on the Sadowsky It doesn't compare so well on: Sweetness of tone. The Sadowsky just has that little something that it's hard to put your finger on (note that I'm talking passive; I'm not so sure than in active mode the distinction might not be less obvious. I'll be putting a J-Retro in soon so I'll let you know). Its better on: Grunt. It has the potential for a nasty funk tone, even played passively, that I could never get out of the UV70, even in active Looks and authenticity. The UV70 looks like a Fender copy (it is) and was simply too boutique for me Case. The Sadowsky case is good, the Fender case is awesome Up to you whether those differences are worth £1000. I'd say not but then I kept finding that I had a sense of being let down by every top end bass I owned (Modulus, Sadowsky, Status) which I don't have with this bass. Then again, perhaps my expectations were lower and my natural pro-Fender bias has crept in? Chris[/quote] Thanks! Im thinking of maybe just sticking with Fender like you, and trying Sadowskys whenever I see one, not just ordering one on because of their very good name. I like the fact the 09 Fender gives that grunt better! All in all, I want another Jazz in 6 months, and it was going to be a Lakkie or a Sadowsky....but to be fair, I think I might just stick with what I know and spend more on cabs and amps. Ill only be frightened of gigging a really expensive high end bass anyway.

[quote name='Beedster' post='571721' date='Aug 17 2009, 03:54 PM']I've recently picked up an '09 model (maple board). I have, to be honest, been blown away by it. Firstly the build quality is a huge improvement on both recent and vintage Fenders I've owned, it's seriously very close to Sadowsky quality (the neck pretty much stays put in the pocket without the screws and the finishing and playability of the neck are outstanding). I've owned around 20 Fenders, five of which were Custom Shop models, and recently two Sadowskys, so I feel qualified to make the comparison. Secondly the tone seems hugely improved, OK, perhaps a function of the build quality (and possibly materials and High Mass Vintage Bridge), but I can't help thinking the PUPs are improved on previous versions. The slap tone is so good it sounds active. OK. it doesn't have the smoothness of tone of the Sadowsky UV70 I recently owned, but neither did that Sadowsky have the in-yer-face grunt that this bass has. The addition of the Vintage High Mass Bridge no doubt helps although as I've pretty much always installed Badass bridges on my Fenders anyway this is perhaps less of a factor in any direct comparison I'm making here. The neck is slightly chunkier than standard Jazzes, no wider but a little deeper and consequently more solid feeling, in fact, it feels somewhere between a Jazz and a Precision. It's a lovely weight - when I say it's not too light and not too heavy, which is not always helpful, what I'm saying is that it's perfect for me, bearing in mind I let a '69 Jazz go because it was too light for me (I've never got the tone I want from light basses). The finish on the body seems lovely and thin, giving the impression that more of the tone is coming from the wood. It also looks like it's wood and not plastic like so many of the 90's Fenders The only thing I'm troubled by at present is that the new tuners don't hold their tuning anything like as well as those on my vintage basses. This could be a function of the fact that I NEVER have to tune either of those basses - I'm not even sure of the tuners work any more - but I do have to tune the Jazz, so perhaps I've been spoiled? As you can probably guess, I'm mightily impressed - and somewhat reassured - by the bass, reassured because Fender seemed to be becoming a company known for having once made great basses rather than a company who still do. I'm pretty sure the likes or Ernie Ball, Lakland and even Sadowsky, all of whom have perhaps had some mileage out of Fender's poor recent record, will be watching carefully. Chris[/quote] Stealing the thread slightly, but how would you compare the 09 F Jazz to a UV Metro Sadowsky? Worth that extra £1K on retail price?

[quote name='Platypus' post='570015' date='Aug 15 2009, 03:57 PM']Can't see how you could import a Sadowsky Metro form the US for less that the UK shops are quoting. Bass Central sale prices for 4 string Metros range between $2100 and $2600 (this for the UV series) They charge almost £300 shipping then there's import duty and vat to pay [url="http://www.basscentral.com/2003/sadowsky.shtml"]http://www.basscentral.com/2003/sadowsky.shtml[/url][/quote] Direct from Sadowsky themselves is a bit cheaper...esp shipping wise. Im looking into it as I type right now. If its not a huge saving ill go with a UK shop. If its £200+ then US it is Then again Im gassing for so many basses, I dont know if Ill have the money for one!

[quote name='Beedster' post='571721' date='Aug 17 2009, 03:54 PM']I've recently picked up an '09 model (maple board). I have, to be honest, been blown away by it. Firstly the build quality is a huge improvement on both recent and vintage Fenders I've owned, it's seriously very close to Sadowsky quality (the neck pretty much stays put in the pocket without the screws and the finishing and playability of the neck are outstanding). I've owned around 20 Fenders, five of which were Custom Shop models, and recently two Sadowskys, so I feel qualified to make the comparison. Secondly the tone seems hugely improved, OK, perhaps a function of the build quality (and possibly materials and High Mass Vintage Bridge), but I can't help thinking the PUPs are improved on previous versions. The slap tone is so good it sounds active. OK. it doesn't have the smoothness of tone of the Sadowsky UV70 I recently owned, but neither did that Sadowsky have the in-yer-face grunt that this bass has. The addition of the Vintage High Mass Bridge no doubt helps although as I've pretty much always installed Badass bridges on my Fenders anyway this is perhaps less of a factor in any direct comparison I'm making here. The neck is slightly chunkier than standard Jazzes, no wider but a little deeper and consequently more solid feeling, in fact, it feels somewhere between a Jazz and a Precision. It's a lovely weight - when I say it's not too light and not too heavy, which is not always helpful, what I'm saying is that it's perfect for me, bearing in mind I let a '69 Jazz go because it was too light for me (I've never got the tone I want from light basses). The finish on the body seems lovely and thin, giving the impression that more of the tone is coming from the wood. It also looks like it's wood and not plastic like so many of the 90's Fenders The only thing I'm troubled by at present is that the new tuners don't hold their tuning anything like as well as those on my vintage basses. This could be a function of the fact that I NEVER have to tune either of those basses - I'm not even sure of the tuners work any more - but I do have to tune the Jazz, so perhaps I've been spoiled? As you can probably guess, I'm mightily impressed - and somewhat reassured - by the bass, reassured because Fender seemed to be becoming a company known for having once made great basses rather than a company who still do. I'm pretty sure the likes or Ernie Ball, Lakland and even Sadowsky, all of whom have perhaps had some mileage out of Fender's poor recent record, will be watching carefully. Chris[/quote] Chris nailed it right there. I own two new Fenders....after not buying one for a LONG time worrying they would not be QC correctly. After the new series came out, and I saw the reviews, my GAS went sky high. So, I finally got THAT Jazz...and THAT Precision in my collection. My review [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=53990"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=53990[/url] They both really are very good basses. Now I think twice about a Lakland, considering the Fenders have the F passive tone absolutely spot on, have good upgrades, VERY good cases, and are cheaper. Just to aid you...goto Darren @ Bass Merchant. I did, and he sourced me two brand new ones and made sure they were spot on. He also had them set up and checked over. Not only that, his prices were far below anywhere else. He matched the best net deal I could find...and included service with a smile and a few coffees. Highly recommend both new Fenders and Bass Merchant. Now...I am gassing for another Jazz, but I wil probably get a rosewood 4 string USA Fender Jazz instead of jumping ship to a Lakland. Cheers! Gareth

I dont understand how people expect musicians to give up a night, lift gear around, and arrange everything for virtually no money. Im in the same boat.

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='571548' date='Aug 17 2009, 12:55 PM']Their singer looks like Matt Berry in that video.[/quote] He looks like Russell Brand as well....!