Can some one explain the whole Musicman, Stingray, Sterling thing

[OutToPlayJazz]

Hey Mart, I'm talking about just using the humbucker. The piezo is a different story altogether. Bass of two heads!

[dave_bass5]

Well its been a while now and i must admit i didnt think i would come back to this thread.
Ive been pretty happy the the DJ5 recently but after a few days of not finding a clear tone (as opposed to a good one) at home i started looking around again.
Pros and cons aside of playing at home through headphones, its what i do most and so need to feel good about the tone. At gigs the bass is working but still not inspiring me much. I think gone off the P tone, this could be my problem.

I came across Ed Friedland's (and that German guy who i cant understand and the Italian guy who had way too much low end but a nice jacket) video reviews of the Sterling by MM SB14 and SR34 and i must say, im impressed with the tone, more so the SB14 than the SR4
I think this may well be what im looking for.
Although Ed reviewed both together i thought the SB14 sounded better and has more variation in tone. Also i believe it has a more Jazz like neck as opposed to the SR4 having a more P like one.

Ive still to actually play one but i think this is the tone im now looking for, plus at these prices i may be able to keep my DJ5 for a while longer. Ill probably take a big loss on it if i sell it although i would rather have a bass im happy with than one im fighting with.

Just musing as im bored and working this morning.

[warwickhunt]

[quote name='niceguyhomer' post='656821' date='Nov 17 2009, 11:41 AM']I liked the Sterling I had, it was very bright, punchy and aggressive - the neck was sublime and had a Jazz profile. It hung well in the mix and smelt of toffee (no kidding).[/quote]

[u]That[/u] bass really did smell of vanilla/toffee didn't it!


[quote name='dave_bass5' post='688961' date='Dec 19 2009, 11:32 AM']I came across Ed Friedland's (and that German guy who i cant understand and the Italian guy who had way too much low end but a nice jacket) video reviews of the Sterling by MM SB14 and SR34 and i must say, im impressed with the tone, more so the SB14 than the SR4
I think this may well be what im looking for.
Although Ed reviewed both together i thought the SB14 sounded better and has more variation in tone. Also i believe it has a more Jazz like neck as opposed to the SR4 having a more P like one.[/quote]

I'm glad you're going to actually go out and try these basses as it's a HUGE mistake to listen to someone else play them and imagine that's how they'd sound in your 'hands' (as that's where the main difference can lie). I've known people play my basses, through my gear, and still manage to get a completely different sound to the one that I get! Though I accept if you are listening to someone do an A/B between two basses then at least you can hear a difference between the two.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='warwickhunt' post='688972' date='Dec 19 2009, 11:51 AM']I'm glad you're going to actually go out and try these basses as it's a HUGE mistake to listen to someone else play them and imagine that's how they'd sound in your 'hands' (as that's where the main difference can lie). I've known people play my basses, through my gear, and still manage to get a completely different sound to the one that I get! Though I accept if you are listening to someone do an A/B between two basses then at least you can hear a difference between the two. [/quote]

Yes, ill definitely try one or two out first, assuming i can get to a shop that has them in stock. Its all still up in the air right now but if i dont have to sell my DJ5 to finance it then there will be less pressure.

Ed's tone is completely different to the German guy and i felt the Italian review was very unimpressive, but still informative.
What impressed me with Ed's review was he used a pick, so at least i got an idea of how it "cloud" sound in my hands.

I smiled when i first heard it so thats a good start.

[Jacqueslemac]

Very informative thread. Thanks guys.
With a P-bass (Mike Dirnt signature) and a Stingray, it looks like I've got most basses covered (excuse the pun). Still hankering after a Warwick Corvette $$, though, to add to the collection!

[Linus27]

Hey Dave, hope your well. The fact that you have returned to this thread shows you're still not happy with the Laky. I know what you mean about it being uninspiring. Despite how great they are as a bass and a make, I felt like you did about my DJ4. Something else for you to think about is the Fender 75 re-issue Jazz. I adore mine. So much so that I think it is the perfect bass. In fact, I recorded with mine today playing with a pick and it somehow sounds very precision like. A bit odd but also pretty cool. I will be putting a clip up on Youtube soon so you can have a listen. To me the Lakland DJ4 was uninspiring, boomy, rigid and very dead sounding. The Fender MIA 75 re-issue is the total opposite. Inspiring, exciting, flexible and sounds fantastic. Something to think about anyway.

As for the Stingray, well worth giving one a go. I adore mine but do struggle to get a comfortable sound out of it.

[KingPrawn]

I'm sure its all been covered but My experience of MM has always been a very comforting one. I have a 3 eq, and every time i pick it up it just feels right. The eq is very responsive, really easy to pick out diffrent tones. I also think its a bass made with the player in mind. i love how easy it is to adjust the truss rod and on the new ones how easy it is to change the battery. Those little things are well thought through.. The necks are mint, very P like with some of the bulk taken off. I have had mine a long time and like many have tried many basses. expensive and cheap. these days i have just two. The MM being my very reliable number 1....

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Linus27' post='689276' date='Dec 19 2009, 06:21 PM']Hey Dave, hope your well. The fact that you have returned to this thread shows you're still not happy with the Laky. I know what you mean about it being uninspiring. Despite how great they are as a bass and a make, I felt like you did about my DJ4. Something else for you to think about is the Fender 75 re-issue Jazz. I adore mine. So much so that I think it is the perfect bass. In fact, I recorded with mine today playing with a pick and it somehow sounds very precision like. A bit odd but also pretty cool. I will be putting a clip up on Youtube soon so you can have a listen. To me the Lakland DJ4 was uninspiring, boomy, rigid and very dead sounding. The Fender MIA 75 re-issue is the total opposite. Inspiring, exciting, flexible and sounds fantastic. Something to think about anyway.

As for the Stingray, well worth giving one a go. I adore mine but do struggle to get a comfortable sound out of it.[/quote]

Hi Michael, im good thanks, hope you (and everyone here) are.

Im going to give Fender a miss this time. I already have a Jazz that i dont use and ive done the P thing so i feel i need to look for a new tone.
Not really looking for that old school tone anymore. And if i keep the DJ5 ill still have something a bit more mellow (and i still have the HW1 Jazz of course).

Your description of the DJ4 is exactly what im hearing, even with the new pups. But i still get good compliments at gigs and from the band so i know its a good tone, just not one for me.

Last night at the gig the DJ5 worked really well, nice and solid but i adjusted the EQ for a much brighter sound. Guess i still had the MM tone in my head and while i didnt get that close i think it worked really well. More aggressive than i would normally go for but it filled out the mix nicely and i was a bit more inspired. A good thing although i think the 1066 also helped inspire me ;-)

It still lacked the punch im looking for but i noticed its on the higher strings. Notes on the D and G just seem to lack the depth and punch of the other 3 (both pups so its not a pup height thing, ive tried all that) although they are ok volume wise.

I'm definitely going to try some MM's as soon as i can and i think because of my (lack of) budget the Sterling by MM will be ideal. Probably go back to 4 string so its down to the SB14 or Ray34 and for me i think the neck will be the main factor. I quite fancy a smaller neck but im happy to try the SR4 as well as i like the look of it more.

Cheers all. Merry Christmas etc

[Linus27]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='689653' date='Dec 20 2009, 12:13 PM']Hi Michael, im good thanks, hope you (and everyone here) are.

Im going to give Fender a miss this time. I already have a Jazz that i dont use and ive done the P thing so i feel i need to look for a new tone.
Not really looking for that old school tone anymore. And if i keep the DJ5 ill still have something a bit more mellow (and i still have the HW1 Jazz of course).

Your description of the DJ4 is exactly what im hearing, even with the new pups. But i still get good compliments at gigs and from the band so i know its a good tone, just not one for me.

Last night at the gig the DJ5 worked really well, nice and solid but i adjusted the EQ for a much brighter sound. Guess i still had the MM tone in my head and while i didnt get that close i think it worked really well. More aggressive than i would normally go for but it filled out the mix nicely and i was a bit more inspired. A good thing although i think the 1066 also helped inspire me ;-)

It still lacked the punch im looking for but i noticed its on the higher strings. Notes on the D and G just seem to lack the depth and punch of the other 3 (both pups so its not a pup height thing, ive tried all that) although they are ok volume wise.

I'm definitely going to try some MM's as soon as i can and i think because of my (lack of) budget the Sterling by MM will be ideal. Probably go back to 4 string so its down to the SB14 or Ray34 and for me i think the neck will be the main factor. I quite fancy a smaller neck but im happy to try the SR4 as well as i like the look of it more.

Cheers all. Merry Christmas etc[/quote]

Hey Dave, I totally forgot you have the HW1 Jazz. That makes my earlier comment pointless regarding the 75 Jazz. So in that case, I would seriously look at the Stingray but do try before you buy. Can you not afford to get a second hand SR4. Mine was £670 this time last year. By the way, one of the best sounding basses I played recently was a Warwick Corvette $$ through a MarkBass rig. It has twin MM style humbuckers and totally blew me away. If I fall in love with my passive Corvette when it arrives and love the whole Warwick thing, then thats the bass I am going to work up to getting next .... maybe

[phil.i.stein]

hi dave,
i bought a brand new sterling 4 h piezo last year. it cost a lot more than i had intended to pay due to the exchange rates, but i had my heart set on one after playing a few different mm's round my mates house.
i ended up with the single pup configuration ,as when i tried popping the d and g strings on his bongo v hh (two soaps) , i found that there was a lack of space under the string near the neck. not having a neck pup made me assume that i might lose some bottom end & mid growl, which would have been a problem. how wrong i was ! this bass can achieve any balance of eq that i want to get out of it. also rolling the piezo on can instantly create a good slap tone with the right e.q. as it seems to scoop mids and brighten tone.
I play it through a markbass compressor into a genz shuttle 12.0. and recently received bf compact and t'midget - a great, versatile rig with a power to weight ratio like Lance Armstrong. I am still toying around with my settings whenever i get to play it at anything near the volume it is capable of, but i always know that i have enough versatility with the sterlings own 3 band eq that i can go from dub to slap with the same amp eq if i needed to !
all in all i can't recommend the mm enough. i couldn't say anything about the difference between a sterling and a stingray other than the sterling is narrower in profile and smaller in body. i hear that the stingray is a bit more bass heavy, but i find that i get all the bottom end i need anyway. the bongo , however, was very different in feel, huge sound and i like it's marmite appeal, but i couldn't get on with the body shape when sitting down, it just felt wrong due to the small cutaway in the body not sitting on the thigh comfortably.
hope you have a good x-mas & keep trying stuff out !

Edited December 20, 2009 by phil.i.stein

[dave_bass5]

Cheers guys.
Michael, I can afford (well, hopefully) a second hand one and im willing to go that route but its the trying out that might be a problem, especially if the seller is out of London etc.
I guess i could try a few news ones first to get an idea of how each model plays, sounds etc and then i can decide on what to go for.
As you know im pretty impatient so getting a Sterling by MM is just a matter of sitting at work on my PC, find the best price on line and whacking it on the card, then it arrives the next day. Not the best way of buying a bass i know.
With going the second hand route it will mean waiting for one to come up and then having ot have some "real" money available. Not a problem but its just too tempting going for option 1.
Ive seen a couple in the classifieds already that i quite fancy but with not having played any MM's yet, and having Christmas standing in the way of my happiness i will have to wait until after the new year.


Phil, I also dont like the look of the Bongo so that's definitely out of the question but i do quite like the idea the Sterling has a narrower neck. I cant get on with normal P necks and while im sure the MM necks are different for me its going to be the narrower the better. Could all change one i try some though.
I was tempted to order something from Thomanns, just to try it out for a few weeks and then send it back but I dont feel 100% about doing that. If i was thinking of keeping it but didn't like it i would send it back but with no intention of keeping, well, its not cricket as they say.

Funny, all this talk of getting a 4 string has me quite excited. I will miss the 5 string but im sure ill cope. And ill be able to play more wrong notes a lot faster than i do now.

[phil.i.stein]

hi dave,
here's mine but with someone who can explain slightly better than me..
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rNKuYuex1I"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rNKuYuex1I[/url]
it will only give a very basic idea of the bass sound, but is a good start..
and one found at 7.27 [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We_EeO9FrP4&feature=rec-LGOUT-exp_fresh+div-1r-1-HM"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We_EeO9FrP4...esh+div-1r-1-HM[/url]
the guy who does 'em is fairly modest but good ! enjoy..

Edited December 20, 2009 by phil.i.stein

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='phil.i.stein' post='689955' date='Dec 20 2009, 06:20 PM']hi dave,
here's mine but with someone who can explain slightly better than me..
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rNKuYuex1I"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rNKuYuex1I[/url]
it will only give a very basic idea of the bass sound, but is a good start..
and one found at 7.27 [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We_EeO9FrP4&feature=rec-LGOUT-exp_fresh+div-1r-1-HM"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We_EeO9FrP4...esh+div-1r-1-HM[/url]
the guy who does 'em is fairly modest but good ! enjoy..[/quote]

Cheers Phil. Nice clips, especially like the first one.

I play with a pic most of the time so all this slapping doesn't really help but i like his style.

[Musicman20]

I definitely think the Stingray is one of the best one trick ponies ever. Thing is, they are not, as you stick flats on it, and it's instantly fatter and more old school...less aggressive.

The necks, IMO, are much quicker than people think. They are less chunky than a P.

The attention to detail is also really good.

I think the low second hand prices are crazy. No way would I sell any of mine below 800, but if you find one, it's a bargain!

I think these basses will make a cone back soon, with Fender getting a lot of attention recently.

I tried a Warwick 5 $$, and the wood and finish was stunning. Too heavy, and the neck was just not for me. Far too chunky and massive. Lovely low action, but Stingray wins for me. Then again, I just cannot deal with smaller bodied basses.

The Gallery had loads! Have you been in to try any? I reckon a H will do, I agree with the above, 2 Hs are a little too much. Maybe a H+S?

Another thing, despite Ed Friedland loving Genz, when I A/Bed my LM3 with the Shuttle 9 I had for a bit, the LM3 was a superb match. Markbass and MMs just work!

[phil.i.stein]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='690115' date='Dec 20 2009, 08:29 PM']Cheers Phil. Nice clips, especially like the first one.
no worriies, but don't let a wannabe funkster like me put you off , as these basses are capable of a lot more stuff than my feeble ass can play..

Edited December 20, 2009 by phil.i.stein

[Linus27]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='689879' date='Dec 20 2009, 04:32 PM']Cheers guys.
Michael, I can afford (well, hopefully) a second hand one and im willing to go that route but its the trying out that might be a problem, especially if the seller is out of London etc.
I guess i could try a few news ones first to get an idea of how each model plays, sounds etc and then i can decide on what to go for.
As you know im pretty impatient so getting a Sterling by MM is just a matter of sitting at work on my PC, find the best price on line and whacking it on the card, then it arrives the next day. Not the best way of buying a bass i know.
With going the second hand route it will mean waiting for one to come up and then having ot have some "real" money available. Not a problem but its just too tempting going for option 1.
Ive seen a couple in the classifieds already that i quite fancy but with not having played any MM's yet, and having Christmas standing in the way of my happiness i will have to wait until after the new year.[/quote]

To be honest, any Musicman you try will probably sound exactly the same. What I mean is if you try a bunch of 3EQ Rays, they will more than likely all sound and feel like 3EQ Rays. Not much difference if any between them all. They are not like Fender's where each one can feel and sound very very different. If you do get a bit desperate, then you are more than welcome to try mine over the Xmas period. This week especially I am doing nothing so you are more than welcome to pop down and have a play. You are always welcome.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Linus27' post='690301' date='Dec 21 2009, 12:17 AM']To be honest, any Musicman you try will probably sound exactly the same. What I mean is if you try a bunch of 3EQ Rays, they will more than likely all sound and feel like 3EQ Rays. Not much difference if any between them all. They are not like Fender's where each one can feel and sound very very different. If you do get a bit desperate, then you are more than welcome to try mine over the Xmas period. This week especially I am doing nothing so you are more than welcome to pop down and have a play. You are always welcome.[/quote]


This is a good idea!

In addition, I'm moving to Royal Arsenal in Jan so that's an option also.

[pegasus14]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='656806' date='Nov 17 2009, 11:24 AM']After spending a small fortune on my DJ5 recently im just not liking it. I think its down to the wood but its got a very deep tone that i really cant get in to.
I expect ill sell it and take a huge loss but i think its for the best.

The Musicman type of bass is the one area ive never looked at and it seems very confusing. I know i do like the tone and i played a 5 string recently that felt really nice but i have no idea what it was.

So im really just looking for some ideas on whats what in this type of bass. what's a good one to go for, anything to be avoided etc.

I guess price wise im looking at what ever i can get for the Lakland or failing that around £500 if i decide to keep it.

Not bothered if its 4 or 5 string at the moment. How do the necks compare to, say a Fender P or Jazz?

Cheers for any info.[/quote]

Checkout the Cult, live at the lyceum on you tube.......... Jamie Stewart's stingray played with a pick is for me one of the greatest sounds of all time, up there with Geddy lee, Chris Squire,and John Entwhistle. Neill

[Hutton]

[quote name='Linus27' post='689276' date='Dec 19 2009, 06:21 PM']To me the Lakland DJ4 was uninspiring, boomy, rigid and very dead sounding. The Fender MIA 75 re-issue is the total opposite. Inspiring, exciting, flexible and sounds fantastic. Something to think about anyway.[/quote]

You see it's all about individual preference and probably a bit of playing style and what music you play. I am the new owner of the "uninspiring, boomy, rigid, and dead sounding" DJ4. However, I have found it to be "inspiring, exciting, flexible and sounds fantastic".

I also used to own a 2eq Stingray which I found to be lifeless in the treble department. My SUB4 however is a marvellous bass which will be with me as long as I am able to play.

It all goes to show that the ideal way to investigate your own choices is to get out and play individual basses and make up your own mind. We are all different and look for different things in our basses. These forums also show that individuals can be extolling the marvellous sounds and features of their basses one minute and selling them the next.

Trust your own ears and hands.

All the best!

[dave_bass5]

Cheers again guys.

Michael, you make a good point about a MM sounding like a MM etc. I dont think ill go looking for "the one", just something comfortable to play. It could take me too long to find one that sounds just right, especially as i wont be taking my rig around so its really going to be down to the neck more than anything. and the colour of course.
Im working right up to christmas eve so cant get to you before christmas but thanks again for the kind offer. Im going to try and get to the Gallery at some point. They seem to have a few on their new website although at £900 for a second hand one they are a bit out of my price range at the moment.

Gareth, thanks also to you for the kind offer. Glad to see you now have a destination although that area came out of the blue didnt it?

Pegasus, cheers, thats a great clip and a fantastic tone. We sometimes play Sancutry at weddings so maybe i can use that as an excuse when the other half realises i have a new bass.

I forgot to mention before but one of the reasons i came back to this thread i is was watching Queen live in Montreal the other night and thinking what a great tone JD has and how he manages to do a whole gig with just the one bass. Went to the toilet, came back and thought his tone was even better on Another one bites the dust, looked at the TV and lo and behold, he is playing a StingRay of some sort.
The GAS had started again.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Hutton' post='690474' date='Dec 21 2009, 11:06 AM']Trust your own ears and hands.

All the best![/quote]

Agreed. Im not saying i have a bad tone, just not one im over the moon about.

Can anyone confirm that the G string is a bit quieter on a SR? Its just something i read last night on TB but i haven't read about it before.
A few people were saying its a known "feature".

[Hutton]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='690485' date='Dec 21 2009, 11:19 AM']Can anyone confirm that the G string is a bit quieter on a SR? Its just something i read last night on TB but i haven't read about it before.
A few people were saying its a known "feature".[/quote]

That's what essentially was wrong with my SR4. No matter what was done in terms of setup the G string was just weak. It has been a widespread problem discussed many times with EBMM fanboys dismissing it as a setup problem. Again, it's one of these areas where opinion differs. Interestingly, the G string on my SUB is just fine. Maybe the only way to ensure that the problem isn't there is to play the individual SR that you may wish to purchase.

I do like MM products. I just wouldn't buy one without trying it first. Once bitten, twice shy!

All the best!

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Hutton' post='690474' date='Dec 21 2009, 11:06 AM']You see it's all about individual preference and probably a bit of playing style and what music you play. I am the new owner of the "uninspiring, boomy, rigid, and dead sounding" DJ4. However, I have found it to be "inspiring, exciting, flexible and sounds fantastic".

I also used to own a 2eq Stingray which I found to be lifeless in the treble department. My SUB4 however is a marvellous bass which will be with me as long as I am able to play.

It all goes to show that the ideal way to investigate your own choices is to get out and play individual basses and make up your own mind. We are all different and look for different things in our basses. These forums also show that individuals can be extolling the marvellous sounds and features of their basses one minute and selling them the next.

Trust your own ears and hands.

All the best![/quote]

I have to agree. The DJ and JO Jazz sound is absolutely brilliant. It is deep....but wow does it sound amazing! Its like a different take on the Fender Jazz....but still doing the aggressive J sound, with a twist.


[quote name='dave_bass5' post='690482' date='Dec 21 2009, 11:15 AM']Cheers again guys.

Michael, you make a good point about a MM sounding like a MM etc. I dont think ill go looking for "the one", just something comfortable to play. It could take me too long to find one that sounds just right, especially as i wont be taking my rig around so its really going to be down to the neck more than anything. and the colour of course.
Im working right up to christmas eve so cant get to you before christmas but thanks again for the kind offer. Im going to try and get to the Gallery at some point. They seem to have a few on their new website although at £900 for a second hand one they are a bit out of my price range at the moment.

Gareth, thanks also to you for the kind offer. Glad to see you now have a destination although that area came out of the blue didnt it?

Pegasus, cheers, thats a great clip and a fantastic tone. We sometimes play Sancutry at weddings so maybe i can use that as an excuse when the other half realises i have a new bass.

I forgot to mention before but one of the reasons i came back to this thread i is was watching Queen live in Montreal the other night and thinking what a great tone JD has and how he manages to do a whole gig with just the one bass. Went to the toilet, came back and thought his tone was even better on Another one bites the dust, looked at the TV and lo and behold, he is playing a StingRay of some sort.
The GAS had started again.[/quote]

I know. We searched high and low. We were told to 'avoid' certain areas in the south, but where we have now deposited is bloody lovely. Very quiet, modern, river views, next to the DLR, and HUGE amounts of space. Its very clean and very modern, with everything we need and amazing security. We got lucky I think....everything else we looked at was shabby and tiny. This place is like its own village away from the chaos. A good thing for me, I like to be able to get away, then go back into it at my choice.

Cheers

[buff]

[quote name='pegasus14' post='690305' date='Dec 21 2009, 12:25 AM']Checkout the Cult, live at the lyceum on you tube.......... Jamie Stewart's stingray played with a pick is for me one of the greatest sounds of all time, up there with Geddy lee, Chris Squire,and John Entwhistle. Neill[/quote]

Also check out the southern death cult on you tube, i bought one just because of how thes two players sounded back in the day. Couldnt get on with the width of the neck though. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6r65DUnLhTM"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6r65DUnLhTM[/url]

Edited December 21, 2009 by buff

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='buff' post='690603' date='Dec 21 2009, 01:25 PM']Also check out the southern death cult on you tube, i bought one just because of how thes two players sounded back in the day. Couldnt get on with the width of the neck though. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6r65DUnLhTM"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6r65DUnLhTM[/url][/quote]

Yeah, if i could get that tone i would be very happy.
I do of course realise i wouldn't, not from my rig but yeah, its what im looking for.

Cheers.