Old Mesa Diesel 115 EVM cab... upgradeable?

[Jaybeevee]

So I took a punt on an early Mesa 115 Diesel having read about the mid range prowess of the EVM 15L and B woofers. I remember them back in the day, but could never afford one and knew no one who could. And so the enthusiast in me decided why not. Got it cheap, so picked it up. 

It works great, is as loud as anything and has all the lower mid range grunt I read about. Trouble is, I miss the deep bottom of everything I´ve owned in the past 10 years. Anywho, I´m wondering if simply changing the driver for a modern 15 into the mesa enclosure will do the trick. I fancy a dabble with 15s and so having the Mesa cab and another non-descript TL606 design cab I´m thinking new drivers will do the trick. Any thoughts.

 

just so it's said, I know there is a world of science behind enclosure design, build quality, ports etc, but having read some on this, it seems accepted by more than a few that Kappalite 3015 & or Faital pro PR400 woofers work with Mesa Diesel cabs. I´m a layman and looking to plug n play, so I´m not really looking for more technical awareness.. Just anyone with experience. Should I go down the upgrading route, or just buy used cab(s) designed and manufactured and with a known track record..

any thoughts?

[Downunderwonder]

I seem to recall something about blocking out half the shelf port at the same time.

[Beedster]

I have the Diesel 2x10 and it certainly doesn’t lack bass, surprised you find the 15 does?

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

Low end response is 1/3 driver, 2/3 enclosure. If the enclosure won't support deep bottom no driver will give it. BTW, the Kappalite 3015 response isn't much different from the 15B. The 15L is weaker in the lows, being optimized for guitar.

[Jaybeevee]

6 minutes ago, Downunderwonder said:

I seem to recall something about blocking out half the shelf port at the same time.

yeah I read about that, to do with tuning the cab from 55Hz to 40Hz. I was thinking to test it with the standard drivers.

 

[Downunderwonder]

23 minutes ago, Jaybeevee said:

Should I

Probably not going to excite much past the first outing. Even if you tweak the port to optimise extra lows all you can hope for is a heavier not as loud notsowundercab.

[Jaybeevee]

7 minutes ago, Beedster said:

I have the Diesel 2x10 and it certainly doesn’t lack bass, surprised you find the 15 does?

Yep, in my chat group threads search I´ve read this a few times, but the 15 certainly lacks the deep lows I get from my current (and previous 12s). I´m guessing around 80Hz and up is what It delivers.. Thou I´ll likely be corrected about this.  But goodness its loud..

[Jaybeevee]

2 minutes ago, Downunderwonder said:

Probably not going to excite much past the first outing. Even if you tweak the port to optimise extra lows all you can hope for is a heavier not as loud notsowundercab.

Thanks, yeah, likely good advice. 

[Jaybeevee]

10 minutes ago, Bill Fitzmaurice said:

Low end response is 1/3 driver, 2/3 enclosure. If the enclosure won't support deep bottom no driver will give it. BTW, the Kappalite 3015 response isn't much different from the 15B. The 15L is weaker in the lows, being optimized for guitar.

Thanks Bill, the 1/3 2/3 is a big number. I know I said there are a few folk saying the drivers I mentioned worked well, but they are of course opinions, and the drivers are also bloody expensive. I should be more sure of the specs I guess before I start ´experimenting´. just the type of advise I was hoping for.

[Shaggy]

The EV drivers were mostly what raised the MB Diesel cabs a notch above everything else.   I’ve got the Diesel 1x15 RR (with matching 2x10) and it has all the low end I could want......although have to say the 1516 I also own and 2x15 cabs I used to own go even deeper, so must be down to cab design I guess.  Even though the Diesels are old school now, they’re quite compact compared to (for example) Trace Elliot cabs of the same era.    Have you looked at the driver to check it is the original EV15L?

 

I’d be inclined to leave as is, and if not happy go with a more modern cab. 

[Beedster]

4 minutes ago, Shaggy said:

The EV drivers were mostly what raised the MB Diesel cabs a notch above everything else.   I’ve got the Diesel 1x15 RR (with matching 2x10) and it has all the low end I could want......although have to say the 1516 I also own and 2x15 cabs I used to own go even deeper, so must be down to cab design I guess.  Even though the Diesels are old school now, they’re quite compact compared to (for example) Trace Elliot cabs of the same era.    Have you looked at the driver to check it is the original EV15L?

 

I’d be inclined to leave as is, and if not happy go with a more modern cab. 

Wise words👍

[Jaybeevee]

7 minutes ago, Shaggy said:

Have you looked at the driver to check it is the original EV15L?

Ah.. I haven't actually.. that I must do.. cheers

[Downunderwonder]

The TL606 isn't very big but built like the proverbial brick outbuilding. Ideally you would be looking at a cab with some size to it to get the low bass loud.

[BassmanPaul]

1 hour ago, Jaybeevee said:

Ah.. I haven't actually.. that I must do.. cheers

Be careful not to put the screwdriver through the cone. It's easy to do - unfortunately!

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

1 hour ago, Shaggy said:

The EV drivers were mostly what raised the MB Diesel cabs a notch above everything else. 

True, but that was 30 odd years ago, when very few mainstream manufacturers used premium drivers. JBL, Altec and Gauss were in the same league, hardly anyone used them. EV and JBL both made cabs back in the 70s, perhaps into the 80s, which were far superior to Fender, Ampeg and most others. They never sold well, so they were eventually discontinued. That's because back in the day you never bought amps and cabs as separates, you bought them as a matched set. Mesa was one of very few that sold an amp and cab set loaded with premium drivers. Sunn was another.

Quote

The TL606 isn't very big but built like the proverbial brick outbuilding

The TL606 was good in its day, but it was optimal with 55Hz tuning, which gave a 60Hz F3 and 45Hz F10. The step down option lowered the Fb to 40Hz, which lowered F10 to 40Hz but it raised F3 to 70Hz, so it didn't work all that well.

[DGBass]

1 hour ago, Jaybeevee said:

Have you looked at the driver to check it is the original EV15L?

Wise words from the BC community and would be first thing I would check. They don't always have a big obvious EV label on the back but should have a stamp of some type, often with a traceable OEM code. Like the TL606 cabs, the speaker chassis is fairly heavyweight. I played one of these for some years and it was the first decent cab I used my ABM's with. Must admit it never lacked delivering low end in anyway, if anything I had to moderate the amount of bottom end. It was one of the few cabs I've used that never complained or struggled with lots of bass. It was also one of the cabs I wished i'd never sold 😐

 

[chris_b]

I liked the way my Mesa 115 EV was voiced.

 

It had enough low end to be punchy and fat and never too much that my sound would be woolly and boomy. 

[Owen]

10 hours ago, BassmanPaul said:

Be careful not to put the screwdriver through the cone. It's easy to do - unfortunately!

That is a pain I am feeling. A defining moment in my cab improvement career. 

[Chimike]

Maybe give your ears time to adjust to the cab, maybe it has more mids than you are used to, not less bass !

 

Edited April 8, 2023 by Chimike
spellchecker error

[Jaybeevee]

3 hours ago, Chimike said:

Maybe give your ears time to adjust to the cab, maybe it has more mids than you are used to, not less bass !

 

I think this is the issue actually, and all the more noticeable at high volumes. Sounds lovely at lower volumes, and like a hammer at high volumes, but just not used to it and miss thickness of the bottom end. If I could get my hands on a diesel 2x10 or similar, I´d like to try that in combination, even though there are folk who disagree about mixing drivers. 

[chris_b]

4 minutes ago, Jaybeevee said:

 If I could get my hands on a diesel 2x10 or similar, I´d like to try that in combination, even though there are folk who disagree about mixing drivers. 

 

I used a Mesa 210EV, 115EV stack for many years. That combination proved to me that mixing some cabs can work.

 

I'd still be using it but for the fact that 2 x 90+ lbs cabs finally herniated a disk in my lower back!

 

Be safe!!

[Shaggy]

3 hours ago, chris_b said:

 

I used a Mesa 210EV, 115EV stack for many years. That combination proved to me that mixing some cabs can work.

 

I'd still be using it but for the fact that 2 x 90+ lbs cabs finally herniated a disk in my lower back!

 

Be safe!!

 

Likewise! 🙂. 

With current (not very loud) band I’m now using Ashdown 1x15 and 4x8 mini-cabs with Neo drivers; superbly practical / portable, but just doesn’t move the air in the way the Mesa stack did. 🙁  

Mind, if I had a roadie it’d be the Diesel 1516 every time.....

 

[Beedster]

20 minutes ago, Shaggy said:

 

Likewise! 🙂. 

With current (not very loud) band I’m now using Ashdown 1x15 and 4x8 mini-cabs with Neo drivers; superbly practical / portable, but just doesn’t move the air in the way the Mesa stack did. 🙁  

Mind, if I had a roadie it’d be the Diesel 1516 every time.....

 

Not sure I’m allowed to say this these days……

 

But that’s a real man’s rig 👍

[Shaggy]

1 hour ago, Beedster said:

Not sure I’m allowed to say this these days……

 

But that’s a real man’s rig 👍

 

 

Lol - you can still say it in Wales........🐏

[chris_b]

Hey @Shaggy. . . . that's exactly the rig I had.

 

I started with a Mesa 400+ then went to an Ampeg SVT-3PRO.  Fabulous sound and volume.

 

I also looked at the 1516 but had to say no, I couldn't fit it into my car.

 

Edited April 9, 2023 by chris_b