Fodera's - Are they worth the money ?

[edstraker123]

Just seen a picture of the Fodera Monarch in the basses for sale section along with a number of extremely positive comments but to me it looks butt ugly.
The back looks like it's come off a 70's wardrobe and you could use the head as a shovel if you ever got stuck in the snow after a gig.
(Beauty is in the eye of the beholder I know and I'm sure some people will love it ).
Having never played a Fodera, I'd love to know what their appeal is and what differentiates them from other custom basses which could be bought at half the price.

Edited February 18, 2009 by edstraker123

[YouMa]

I dont know really i suppose its like an aston martin if you can afford it go for it. I suppose you are paying for the hours worked on a fodera cause a slab of exotic wood and some electronics are deffo not worth that much.

[Deep Thought]

I generally hate the shape of most 'boutique' basses, but I had a chance to play one of these a while ago, and I thought it was one of the better looking examples. Gorgeous bass, too, lovely to play, and a fantastic sound through an Epifani rig. Not for me, but I acknowledge that (Monty Python and the Holy Grail Frenchman voice) it's-a...very nice!

[rjb]

[quote name='edstraker123' post='413219' date='Feb 18 2009, 04:17 PM']Just seen a picture of the Fodera Monarch in the basses for sale section along with a number of extremely positive comments but to me it looks butt ugly.
The back looks like it's come off a 70's wardrobe and you could use the head as a shovel if you ever got stuck in the snow after a gig.
(Beauty is in the eye of the beholder I know and I'm sure some people will love it ).
Having never played a Fodera, I'd love to know what their appeal is and what differentiates them from other custom basses which could be bought at half the price.[/quote]

Tried one in a shop. Lovely neck, but I found the tone a bit polite.

Edited February 18, 2009 by rjb

[Kiwi]

The aesthetics are a matter of personal taste, the Beez Elite is the sexiest single cut I've ever seen. If someone considers a fender or musicman their ideal bass then it stands to reason that they probably won't see much value in a Fodera. I personally think they sound a little dry although the necks are reputedly super stable as they're glued up and left to settle in for 2-3 years before being used in an actual bass. I've toyed with the idea of owning a Fodera in the past but there are a lot of other basses out there which are nearly as good and the difference isn't worth £2000 extra to me, personally.

[mrcrow]

how do they sound
using a squier or mim fender as 1

can the fodera reach 4 or 5 on an upward scale

i looked on their website and they seem to be going overboard on woody impressions

can you see that on a CD

[size=1]<grins jealously>[/size]

[XB26354]

In a word, no.
However I played a 6 string Emperor (I think) and it was the nicest, best sounding bass I've ever had in my hands in 25 years of playing (and I've owned a few boutique basses - Wals, Status, Warwick NT, Ken Smith, Sadowsky etc). At £4.5K secondhand, you'd have to be very rich or eat beans for a few months to afford it. After all you could get a top quality bass, rig and enough change for a holiday If money were no object I would own a 6 purely because they feel just right, never really played another 6 string that came close. Stupid money though! $17000 for an Anthony Jackson Presentation anyone?

[flychris]

I would say no...

I owned one in the past ...
And I sold it ...

They surf on the name and on endorsees, that's all...
There are a lot of basses at the same level of quality for less price...
And I found in little boutique company or luthier what I wanted to have without the need of a "name" on the bass...

And I would say that my JP bass is at the same level without problems...

[urb]

I've played some lovely Foderas but I've also played some duff ones, to get a great one is bit of a lucky dip when ordering through a middle man, like the Groove Shoppe, but I personally think the main problem is supply and demand, in that far too many people want one for the number that they can produce. So regardless of actually how good they are the wait time is over three years now, (unless you are a top name player who benefits from a little star treatment), and at a starting price of 4K for even the most basic model, an NYC or Monarch bolt on, I just couldn't handle that. I played Gwilym's F Bass 5 string and it had to be one of the most stunning off the peg designer basses I've ever played, a steal at £1800... my Sei for my money matches the playability and sound of most Fodera's I've played, and given the same wood combinations I'm sure the tone can be matched etc... in short there are now so many great boutique basses available Fodera is just one of many options... but as XB said, $17,000 for an AJ bass anyone?

M

[YouMa]

I like the little butterfly on the headstock.

[4000]

[quote name='edstraker123' post='413219' date='Feb 18 2009, 04:17 PM']Just seen a picture of the Fodera Monarch in the basses for sale section along with a number of extremely positive comments but to me it looks butt ugly.
The back looks like it's come off a 70's wardrobe and you could use the head as a shovel if you ever got stuck in the snow after a gig.
(Beauty is in the eye of the beholder I know and I'm sure some people will love it ).
Having never played a Fodera, I'd love to know what their appeal is and what differentiates them from other custom basses which could be bought at half the price.[/quote]

A Squire isn't worth the money if you don't like it. Similarly a Fodera is worth the money if you think it is.

[XB26354]

I think I've tried 14 Foderas (to date). Only one really felt special.
A Squier is £200+. A new Fodera (neck through) is £5000+. Most people can afford the Squier, few can afford the new Fodera.
As Mike said, Fodera can charge the big money because the people that play them - Anthony Jackson, Victor Wooten, Richard Bona, Matt Garrison, Lincoln Goines, Tony Grey etc... Just about all the top names amongst "players". The fact that the quality seems to be as variable as any other manufacturer seems to indicate that there isn't really something special about Fodera, other than the name. Sei, Overwater, GB, Shuker and ACG all build [i]custom made[/i] instruments of equal or higher quality for half the price or less...

[YouMa]

If i became a famous bass player i think i would probably stick with a nice relic fender but customised to my needs,some people like AC cobras and some people like the latest ferrari. If i was rich enough i would buy some boutique basses just cause i had the choice.

[Kiwi]

I think the thing to bear in mind is that if you want "the best" then someone out there is going to persuade you they're giving it to you and ask for a huge amount of money in return.

Part of the mystique of Fodera comes from the exclusivity, there aren't enough instruments around for everyone to try and form a consensus. In such situations, the rumour tends to form the consensus and that can be augmented by over excited individuals who have managed to save enough to buy the instrument and want to justify their expenditure.

The hype feeds itself in these situations. Its a very clever and cunning psychological marketing strategy based on a premise of exclusivity, aspiration and added value. Try before you buy otherwise don't believe the hype. They're definitely nice instruments but...how much are you prepared to pay for "x" improvement in quality?

I would love for BGM to do a blind test of a reissue 62 Fender Jazz against a preCBS 62 Fender Jazz against a 20 year old Jazz bass (which is what preCBS Fenders were when the whole nostalgia thing originally kicked off in the 80's). Even if you noticed a difference, would you be prepared to pay £4000 more for the improvement? What are you buying for your money? Bragging rights? Have you looked at how much it costs in insurance alone to OWN a 62 Jazz? (All rhetorical questions, I might add)

[OutToPlayJazz]

As a big Victor Wooten fan I'm very disappointed with Foderas. I love the look of some of them, but I've played two. A Yin-Yang Monarch & an Empire 5. Both were okay, but no more special than a JayDee. I found the sound very unsubtle & particularly harsh on the Empire.

I'll stick with what I know & what I'm looking into at the moment.

Rich.

[YouMa]

[quote name='Crazykiwi' post='413756' date='Feb 19 2009, 12:33 AM']I think the thing to bear in mind is that if you want "the best" then someone out there is going to persuade you they're giving it to you and ask for a huge amount of money in return.

Part of the mystique of Fodera comes from the exclusivity, there aren't enough instruments around for everyone to try and form a consensus. In such situations, the rumour tends to form the consensus and that can be augmented by over excited individuals who have managed to save enough to buy the instrument and want to justify their expenditure.

The hype feeds itself in these situations. Its a very clever and cunning psychological marketing strategy based on a premise of exclusivity, aspiration and added value. Try before you buy otherwise don't believe the hype. They're definitely nice instruments but...how much are you prepared to pay for "x" improvement in quality?

I would love for BGM to do a blind test of a reissue 62 Fender Jazz against a preCBS 62 Fender Jazz against a 20 year old Jazz bass (which is what preCBS Fenders were when the whole nostalgia thing originally kicked off in the 80's). Even if you noticed a difference, would you be prepared to pay £4000 more for the improvement? What are you buying for your money? Bragging rights? Have you looked at how much it costs in insurance alone to OWN a 62 Jazz?[/quote]


With old fenders and things i think its more of a spiritual thing. My uncle derek had a 62 strat that he never played it was imported from a guy who lived just outside nashville when i picked it up it sounds stupid but i just though about all the guys who played it and the gigs they played,when i wasnt even a twinkle in my teenage fathers eyes.

Edited February 18, 2009 by YouMa

[Kiwi]

[quote name='YouMa' post='413760' date='Feb 18 2009, 11:37 PM']With old fenders and things i think its more of a spiritual thing. My uncle derek had a 62 strat that he never played it was imported from a guy who lived just outside nashville when i picked it up it sounds stupid but i just though about all the guys who played it and the gigs they played,when i wasnt even a twinkle in my teenage fathers eyes.[/quote]
I think that's fair comment. If anyone buys a vintage Ferrari, the astronomical price tag is justified by the history. That kind of reflects on what kicked off the whole preCBS Fender thing in the first place, namely nostalgia and affluent baby boomers. However how much is that history worth? Bass players are considered by many luthiers to be more open minded than guitarists but where does the line between open mindedness and gullibility lie?

[YouMa]

[quote name='Crazykiwi' post='413776' date='Feb 19 2009, 01:03 AM']I think that's fair comment. If anyone buys a vintage Ferrari, the astronomical price tag is justified by the history. That kind of reflects on what kicked off the whole preCBS Fender thing in the first place, namely nostalgia and affluent baby boomers. However how much is that history worth? Bass players are considered by many luthiers to be more open minded than guitarists but where does the line between open mindedness and gullibility lie?[/quote]

Im with you dude but i think the whole reason i play so well is because i have sort of bought into a dream,so many legends have started with workhorse fenders ,the old mojos a good fuel for good playing. Dont worry though if i get rich ill get a 62 jazz and a fodera,you can keep which ever wins the sound off im sure we will both go home happy.

[Kiwi]

[quote name='YouMa' post='413783' date='Feb 19 2009, 12:12 AM']Im with you dude but i think the whole reason i play so well is because i have sort of bought into a dream,so many legends have started with workhorse fenders ,the old mojos a good fuel for good playing. Dont worry though if i get rich ill get a 62 jazz and a fodera,you can keep which ever wins the sound off im sure we will both go home happy.[/quote]
I'll be keeping an eye on your posts in the gear porn forum then... I wouldn't compare a 62 jazz to a fodera though, they're dramatically different instruments. I have a 65 jazz with me at the moment and I really like it as a bass. Its lovely and warm and benign. But I don't know at the moment that its worth the asking price. The nostalgia isn't that relevant to me.

[YouMa]

[quote name='Crazykiwi' post='413794' date='Feb 19 2009, 01:22 AM']I'll be keeping an eye on your posts in the gear porn forum then... I wouldn't compare a 62 jazz to a fodera though, they're dramatically different instruments. I have a 65 jazz with me at the moment and I really like it as a bass. Its lovely and warm and benign. But I don't know at the moment that its worth the asking price. The nostalgia isn't that relevant to me.[/quote]


I dont know man im a metal detectorist and pretty obsessed with history as well. Again its more of a spiritual thing with me,i always feel when i play an old instrument its like a link with music history. I love luthiers and one day im going to start building instruments,it must be a fantastic feeling to have artists rate your new instruments,but i would hate to see the day when a 62 jazz fetched tuppence. Apart from that i would love a Fodera.

[Hamster]

They're really nice basses but out of my price range. I'm pretty sure I can find something that I like better for less than half the price - which is why I think I'll like it better!

[YouMa]

[quote name='Hamster' post='413802' date='Feb 19 2009, 01:32 AM']They're really nice basses but out of my price range. I'm pretty sure I can find something that I like better for less than half the price - which is why I think I'll like it better![/quote]

Agreed. I think half the thrill of being a good player is doing it on a bog standard "Tool"

[Oversoul]

I was also a little disappointed when I laid my hands on a Fodera for the first time. To this day I have tried
two imperials and the monarch 4 string, just like wooten's.

The do have what some here have described as "polite tone", very sweet high register, nice focused mids, I could definitly identify how Garrisson or other jazz guys get their tone.

The monarch was IME, the biggest FAIL ever, dull, cheap sounding, I have tried some EMG equipped asian basses that sounded very similar to that instrument.

They are definitly overrated in price, there are luthiers out there that have far surpassed them, and charge a fraction of what they ask.

Still, they have what makes people tick, nice designs, great woods, and amazing players!

I'm curious how that new pope preamp will work for them too.

[burno70]

I think the Fodera hype all boils down to the fact that they have a bunch of heavy hitters in the bass community playing them, on top of the fact that they are a relatively small outfit - the supply cannot meet the demand so you then have a certain exclusivity attached to them (I've played loads of basses and have never come across one yet!).

I have a Shuker, you may not like the look of it as the woods were chosen by me and thats a matter of personal taste, but I can't see how the build quality of a Fodera would be any better. Especially when you consider that a bottom of the range Fodera costs about 2 and half times that of the Shuker, I just can't see them being twice as good!

[lozbass]

I don't really have the time to get into detail - another busy day! However, I find this a bit of a difficult thread: there simply aren't enough Foderas around in the UK for players to get to try them and form a realistic, personal judgement. I've been fortunate enough to play a good number of very high end UK, US and European basses over the years. Among these have been a few Foderas (a couple of which have been superb instruments IMO). How do the 'good' Foderas compare with the competition?...I'd say at the top end of the bunch (but the quality at this stratospheric level is generally amazing and preferences really are a matter of personal taste). Are Foderas worth the premium price? Another difficult one and down to the individual's preferences, perceptions and desires. I think there's some hype in the equation and the exclusivity factor appears to exert a powerful influence at the level of collective and individual psyche (triggering both positive and negative reactions). However, an honest - and hopefully reasonably objective - opinion is that a good Fodera is as good as any other 'good' bass from a top luthier (with some possibly important and individual or defining characteristics, of course). Whist Fodera - as a company - doesn't need any help in justifying its prices, I can say that its basses are very complex instruments and attention to detail, build quality, jointing, timber choices and finishing is generally very high. Indeed, it's clear that a lot of thought and work goes into each (higher-end) Fodera - take a look at one if you get a chance and work out the 3D jigsaw of pieces!

As to sound, I haven't found Foderas to be as 'polite' as many other boutique basses - indeed, I've been very impressed by the fat, comressed, very 'present' tone and by the ease with which an aggressive growl can be achieved. On playability - a good set-up is important - but I'm pretty sure that any Fodera can be tweaked to play superbly well. In sum, I'm pretty sure too that Foderas can match almost anything in terms of quality - it's a personal preference issue. They're not to everybody's taste (sonically, visually, aesthetically or ergonomically) but if you're attracted, try to get to play one (or a few) - it's just a real pity there aren't more around (and that the scarcity adds to the mystique and hype that we all need to move beyond).

Edited February 19, 2009 by lozbass