What does adding a 2 x 10 to a 1 x 15 do to the sound?

[Linus27]

I have an Ashdown 300H MAG amp and an Ashdown 1 x 15 speaker. I am going to add an Ashdown 2 x 10 to it. What sort of difference will adding this 2 x 10 make to my overall sound? Fatter or more treble or punchier or not much difference?

Thanks

Edited February 12, 2009 by Linus27

[alexclaber]

Depends entirely on the specific cabs and how they work together - suck it and see!

Alex

[fretmeister]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='407538' date='Feb 12 2009, 12:57 PM']Depends entirely on the specific cabs and how they work together - suck it and see!

Alex[/quote]


+1


I have a 2x10 and a 1x15.

Sometimes I use the cabs on their own - some times together. Depends what I want / can be bothered to carry.

At the moment I am fretlessing with just the 15 for some super deep jazzy tones.

[chris_b]

[quote name='Linus27' post='407525' date='Feb 12 2009, 12:47 PM']....I have an Ashdown 300H MAG amp and an Ashdown 1 x 15 speaker. I am going to add an Ashdown 2 x 10 to it. What sort of difference will adding this 2 x 10 make to my overall sound? Fatter or more treble or punchier or not much difference?....[/quote]
This combination has been successfully done many times with Ashdown and other makes. I think you will get a punchier, tighter sound, so try it out and let us know what you find. You could also think about a 4x10.

[Rich]

This has been discussed in the past, although searching for said discussion is a pain in the arse. If memory serves, I believe the word from those in the know was that mixing speaker sizes does not necessarily have a beneficial effect & the best results are had from keeping a uniform speaker size. If I'm wrong with this recollection, please correct me!
Certainly from personal experience, my rig sounds loads better with two 1x15s than it did with a 1x15 plus a 2x10 -- but YMMV. As the man said, suck it and see!

[Linus27]

[quote name='chris_b' post='407579' date='Feb 12 2009, 01:43 PM']This combination has been successfully done many times with Ashdown and other makes. I think you will get a punchier, tighter sound, so try it out and let us know what you find. You could also think about a 4x10.[/quote]

I liked the idea of a 2 x 10 as its so much smaller.

[Linus27]

[quote name='Rich' post='407587' date='Feb 12 2009, 01:47 PM']Certainly from personal experience, my rig sounds loads better with two 1x15s than it did with a 1x15 plus a 2x10 -- but YMMV. As the man said, suck it and see![/quote]

Interesting point. Did you find that you had to dial in a lot more top end or mids running two 1 x 15???

[Adrenochrome]

[quote name='Linus27' post='407593' date='Feb 12 2009, 01:51 PM']Interesting point. Did you find that you had to dial in a lot more top end or mids running two 1 x 15???[/quote]

I use a MAG210 as an extension cab (or stood on end on its own in tiny venues) and it's got the deepest sound of any cab I've had (could be a bit shy in the high-mids and highs perhaps?).

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='Rich' post='407587' date='Feb 12 2009, 08:47 AM']Certainly from personal experience, my rig sounds loads better with two 1x15s than it did with a 1x15 plus a 2x10 -- but YMMV. As the man said, suck it and see![/quote]
+1. There are so many variables involved that it's impossible to predict what any particular combination will do. The advantage to using paired identical cabs is that you'll get just what you have now, but a lot more of it. Those with 1x15s who want to add tens to the mix assume that the top end will be better. For a variety of reasons it's just as likely that the opposite will be the result.

[Linus27]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='407605' date='Feb 12 2009, 01:58 PM']+1. There are so many variables involved that it's impossible to predict what any particular combination will do. The advantage to using paired identical cabs is that you'll get just what you have now, but a lot more of it. Those with 1x15s who want to add tens to the mix assume that the top end will be better. For a variety of reasons it's just as likely that the opposite will be the result.[/quote]

Oh, this has certainly got me thinking now. I do love the sound of my 1 x 15 but do have to dial the treble on lots and a little bit of mid to get the perfect sound.

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Linus27' post='407593' date='Feb 12 2009, 01:51 PM']Interesting point. Did you find that you had to dial in a lot more top end or mids running two 1 x 15???[/quote]

Two 15"s will usually sound like they have more midrange than one on the floor because by stacking them you get to hear more of the on-axis response from the top speaker. To hear what your current cab really sounds like tilt it back and then stand far enough away that your ears are exactly on-axis (in the direct line of fire of the cone). If you like that sound then two of those cabs will be more than twice as good.

Alex

[Linus27]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='407615' date='Feb 12 2009, 02:04 PM']Two 15"s will usually sound like they have more midrange than one on the floor because by stacking them you get to hear more of the on-axis response from the top speaker. To hear what your current cab really sounds like tilt it back and then stand far enough away that your ears are exactly on-axis (in the direct line of fire of the cone). If you like that sound then two of those cabs will be more than twice as good.

Alex[/quote]

Thats a great idea. Will try that later. Thanks.

[henry norton]

Speaker lore used to say a 15 will have more bass (obviously) and also more treble (bizarrely, but due to the much larger cone distorting), whereas multiple 10s will add more mid-upper mid and punch (which could be down to the same mids). Nowadays cabinet porting and speaker design have moved on a bit and the boundaries are now less defined. I would say choose whatever setup suits your transport needs and storage options. Most modern amps/speaker cabs are pretty good and remember, if your sound is lacking in any particular areas you do have tone controls.

[bass_ferret]

There are lots of threads on this - some of them quite hot.

If you have 2 cabs the same you will always get the sum of the parts and probably then some because the cabs will couple acoustically.

If you have different cabs then you may not get the sum of the parts because the cabs may be out of phase at some frequencies.

[alexclaber]

[quote name='bass_ferret' post='408965' date='Feb 13 2009, 07:27 PM']If you have 2 cabs the same you will always get the sum of the parts and probably then some because the cabs will couple acoustically.

If you have different cabs then you may not get the sum of the parts because the cabs may be out of phase at some frequencies.[/quote]

Very succinctly put!

Alex

[Boneless]

I'd like to say, though, that phase cancellation is not always bad.
That's what happens, if I remember correctly, when you have two pickups/coils on a bass. Take a Jazz Bass for example, or a humbucker as well, for that matter.
The tone is simply "different", not necessarily better or worse.

[bass_ferret]

Nobody said it would sound bad. What we have said (ad nauseum) is the results are un-predictable. Whereas the result of adding an identical cab to your rig is predicatable. So if you are buying blind, or even if you have a low volume demo in a shop, dont be surprised if the results are not what you expected.

And that is assuming you can get far enough away from the rig to know what it really sounds like, as a lot of venues make you stand right in front of your rig so you can only hear the top cab anyway.

[redstriper]

[quote name='Linus27' post='407525' date='Feb 12 2009, 12:47 PM']I have an Ashdown 300H MAG amp and an Ashdown 1 x 15 speaker. I am going to add an Ashdown 2 x 10 to it. What sort of difference will adding this 2 x 10 make to my overall sound? Fatter or more treble or punchier or not much difference?

Thanks[/quote]

I have an Ashdown mag115 deep cab which I use with a compact Hartke 2 x 10 loaded with Ashdown drivers.
The combined sound is not radically different to either cab on it's own, just louder.
The 2 x 10 is almost as deep as the 15 and sinilar in volume level, they work nicely together if you like a smooth deep sound.
The Ashdown 2 x 10 you are looking at probably has a tweeter which mine doesn't, so you could expect more top end.
I have the 15 underneath the 2 x 10, with the 2 x 10 placed vertically for maximum dispertion.

[Mr.T]

+1 for the 'suck it and see' brigade.

... Unless you opt to go for a cabs that were designed (hopefully?) to work together as a pair.
i.e. Trace designed their 1x15 and 2x10 as a set.
I assume (some) other manufacturers do likewise.

A matching 2x10 should in theory add brightness to your 1x15.

[Linus27]

[quote name='Mr.T' post='413038' date='Feb 18 2009, 01:41 PM']+1 for the 'suck it and see' brigade.

... Unless you opt to go for a cabs that were designed (hopefully?) to work together as a pair.
i.e. Trace designed their 1x15 and 2x10 as a set.
I assume (some) other manufacturers do likewise.

A matching 2x10 should in theory add brightness to your 1x15.[/quote]

The fact that I have the treble dial turned to full on my MAG 300H head, makes me think the 2 x 10 might be a good idea. My only worry is I don't want to thin the sound out to much. Plus it will be sitting on top of the 1 x 15 and will be at ear level and might sound too thin or trebly.

[Boneless]

Usually anyway the brands design their cabs to be matched (especially cabs not commonly used as a standalone/commonly used as a pair, such as 2x10 + 1x15).
It would be stupid for a brand make a 2x10 that can't really be matched well with a 1x15 of the same brand and series

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='Mr.T' post='413038' date='Feb 18 2009, 08:41 AM']i.e. Trace designed their 1x15 and 2x10 as a set.
I assume (some) other manufacturers do likewise.[/quote]Only to the matter of sizing them to the same width for stacking. A 1x15 and 2x10 truly engineered to work together does not and never has existed.
Driver displacement and cabinet size requirements increase exponentially as frequency goes down, so while a 1x15/4x10 is a favorite combination the ratio is backwards; a well engineered system would run two to four 15s with one 10. A proper match for one 15 is one eight, or six. 'Matched sets' is a purely cosmetic matter, proper audio engineering is not a consideration.

[yorick]

One of my rigs is a MAG 300w 2x10 combo run with a MAG 1X15 Deep cab and the sound in my opinion is good enough all round for most uses. So, as others have said... suck etc!!

[Mr.T]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='413057' date='Feb 18 2009, 01:56 PM']Only to the matter of sizing them to the same width for stacking. A 1x15 and 2x10 truly engineered to work together does not and never has existed.
Driver displacement and cabinet size requirements increase exponentially as frequency goes down, so while a 1x15/4x10 is a favorite combination the ratio is backwards; a well engineered system would run two to four 15s with one 10. A proper match for one 15 is one eight, or six. 'Matched sets' is a purely cosmetic matter, proper audio engineering is not a consideration.[/quote]

Although 'technically' I am sure you are correct, they (Trace at least) do seem to work just fine with a 1x15 and a 2x10.
(To my ears)....

[Boneless]

[quote]Only to the matter of sizing them to the same width for stacking. A 1x15 and 2x10 truly engineered to work together does not and never has existed.[/quote]

Maybe from an "audiophile" point of view.
A 2x10" cab may not perfectly acoustically pair with a 1x15", but it's a common solution: there must be a reason for it, and the reason is that many people actually like this speaker configuration. It may be "wrong", but many people actually steer away from high fidelity and clarity and frequency response. I prefer a better engineered cab / pair of cabs, but in the end, it's all down to taste.

Edited February 18, 2009 by Boneless