Half fretted, half fretless

[Roadybus]

i already felt a bit sorry for itu that he sacrificed his fr/fl idea to the bands traditional hearing. 

which sounds suits which music.. ?! 

would have anybody expected to hear fretless in Black Sabbath, or Whitesnake, hm?

 

we should dare to have our personal sound, not only following long set paths. isn't it THEIR iconic sound we all love with our heroes?! 

let's say Stanley Clarke plays with the brown bass a roots reggae song! 

i guess we won't miss the wobble, would we? 

 

the same is with the transitional points, you mention. all that would make no difference anymore following my thoughts above.

(if i got you right emg456) 

 

one neck, two worlds, one sound

 

Chris

[EMG456]

I’m just being the voice of reason for you! 😂

 

Should you choose to proceed with it, I will applaud you! And make sure to let us know. 

[Maude]

The only way I can see that any fretted/fretless combo board can work satisfactorily is to have the tops of the frets and the fretless board at the same height. If you simply remove the frets, from say the 6th fret upwards to create a fretted low end, fretless high end board, then the fretless part would have far too high an action to be useful. Therefore, the simplest way I see to create a fretted low/fretless high board is to use an already fretless neck, then use a radius jig and router to lower the board from which fret you choose, saw and install frets in that routed down section and then level and crown those new frets to be the same height as the fretless section. Both sections should then play as normal. 

This should be possible to do with as many fretted or fretless sections as you wish as long as the tops of the frets and the fretless boards are all level. 

Edited 5 hours ago by Maude
Clarity, possibly 😁

[JPJ]

There was of course that crazy design with flippable frets that went from fretted to fretless at the flick of a switch from Mickey Guitars of Toronto. There was quite a bit of noise about this system in the early naughties. 

[dmccombe7]

1 hour ago, JPJ said:

There was of course that crazy design with flippable frets that went from fretted to fretless at the flick of a switch from Mickey Guitars of Toronto. There was quite a bit of noise about this system in the early naughties. 

That sounds very interesting. Would love to know how he did it.

Dave

[Beedster]

On 09/08/2018 at 16:53, BassApprentice said:

Something like this?

 

Wow, a promo video that turned me off a bass I'd always wanted  

[Beedster]

1 hour ago, JPJ said:

There was of course that crazy design with flippable frets that went from fretted to fretless at the flick of a switch from Mickey Guitars of Toronto. There was quite a bit of noise about this system in the early naughties. 

 

6 minutes ago, dmccombe7 said:

That sounds very interesting. Would love to know how he did it.

Dave

 

IIRC the board was levered and could be raised a few mm to make a fretless and lowered the same amount to allow the frets to engage. I may have got that wrong though  

[itu]

Guild Pilot bass was available with interchangeable fretboards, Novatone. Magnetic attachment. A short lived idea. 

talkbass.com/threads/crazy-project-still-in-the-works.482904/ 

[Hellzero]

16 minutes ago, Beedster said:

 

 

IIRC the board was levered and could be raised a few mm to make a fretless and lowered the same amount to allow the frets to engage. I may have got that wrong though  

Wrong, Chris, it was the opposite, the frets were getting back and forth in the neck/fretboard thanks to a lever.

 

 

There's was also the Neuser NFS with switchable sitar like saddles allowing for a fretless tone.

 

 

And the two custom orders Leducs basses, half fretless / half fretted vertically for one and horizontally for the other.

[Roadybus]

the canadian version, also as the czech seem to work. 

the flipping frets may be hell-of-a-lot-work to be build properly and you got to deal with the high strings from the fretted version.

the fl bridge i actually tried, but not switchable. It was good, but no proper fl playing. the Neuser idea seems cool and would be simply the cheapest...bridge change. thats it !?

 

both are pretty close to the goal somehow

[Beedster]

1 hour ago, Beedster said:

I may have got that wrong though  

 

43 minutes ago, Hellzero said:

Wrong, Chris

So I was right 😂

[Roadybus]

@Maude: 

yes, correct

raised, or lowered fretboard is needed.

this is possible and not too complicated.

 

my guess is that all these prototypes we gathered are in full function, but the market simply too small

i could swear there are basses alike around

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hellzero]

25 minutes ago, Roadybus said:

the canadian version, also as the czech seem to work. 

the flipping frets may be hell-of-a-lot-work to be build properly and you got to deal with the high strings from the fretted version.

the fl bridge i actually tried, but not switchable. It was good, but no proper fl playing. the Neuser idea seems cool and would be simply the cheapest...bridge change. thats it !?

 

both are pretty close to the goal somehow

The problem is that Robert Neuser disappeared from the radar a few years ago, so finding an NFS will be quite hard and it's a pain in the derrière to set up, but when you've found the perfect set up, it's working great.

 

And there is also the Dominique Di Piazza fretless bridge which is derived from the NFS and will make your fretted bass sound like a fretless all the time.

 

Mike Sabre made two fiver bass models for him that you can buy.

 

A friend of mine owns the first iteration and may be willing to sell it (and as you live in Germany IIRC, the bass is in Brussels, so easier for you, should you be interested).

 

This is the second version, the first one is way more standard in terms of design.

 

 

[Roadybus]

that is the version i tried , diPiazza. 

it was nice. the very moment you played bit more powerful more 'flesh' to the string)) the sitar'ish sounds came up. tempting if i could get one of those again...even if it wasn't 'real fl-playing'. i missed the slides.

 

...and yes, difficult set up 

[dmccombe7]

1 hour ago, Hellzero said:

Wrong, Chris, it was the opposite, the frets were getting back and forth in the neck/fretboard thanks to a lever.

 

 

There's was also the Neuser NFS with switchable sitar like saddles allowing for a fretless tone.

 

 

And the two custom orders Leducs basses, half fretless / half fretted vertically for one and horizontally for the other.

That bass bridge thing is amazing. Wonder how it works.

No longer in production but i wonder why ?

Dave

[Maude]

20 minutes ago, dmccombe7 said:

That bass bridge thing is amazing. Wonder how it works.

No longer in production but i wonder why ?

Dave

My guess would be as he slid the bridge pieces back a flat plate came into contact (or very, very close contact) with the string to emulate the mwah produced by a true fretless string vibrating on the fretboard. Instead of the mwah being produced just in front of the finger itself is produced just in front of the saddle. 

It sounds surprisingly effective. Slides obviously won't work but no intonation issues as with actual fretless. 

[Hellzero]

3 minutes ago, Maude said:

My guess would be as he slid the bridge pieces back a flat plate came into contact (or very, very close contact) with the string to emulate the mwah produced by a true fretless string vibrating on the fretboard. Instead of the mwah being produced just in front of the finger itself is produced just in front of the saddle. 

It sounds surprisingly effective. Slides obviously won't work but no intonation issues as with actual fretless. 

This is exactly the principle of a sitar saddle just as I mentioned it in my post above. 😉

[Maude]

16 minutes ago, Hellzero said:

This is exactly the principle of a sitar saddle just as I mentioned it in my post above. 😉

I didn’t know that. You learn something new everyday. 👍

[itu]

So far no one has mentioned those chinese basses with two necks on different sides of one body, like brand Busuyi: "8-string bass, 5 string fretless." 

[Roadybus]

Yep and it works well as long as you set-up everything VERY correct. 

the magic of the diPiazza bridge is an piece of hard wood brought just that close to the string that it buzzes

 

the Neuser idea appears more 'solid' set-up wise, if you can shift in/out lije shown in the video, 

but diPiazza works! 

[Roadybus]

...on a guitar sometimes a silken threat was enough to get that sitarish effect, but no use on bass

 

what are these chinese basses?

[Roadybus]

@doubleneck:

 

that was my idea so far, but i fear at least one of the necks is always in a 'wrong' position.

i wanted to put 2 Hondo Alien together. 

These are cheap 80ties korean copys of a Kramer Duke. All wood. 30". Very light and small. Sound shabby, until you add an East electronic and proper PU's 👍

I really like these just by the physics! They suit my injuries well. Can't tell why. Used one of those with a midi'ish PU for years on stage. Silly me. 

The very moment i get a 2nd one i try to defret and put the 2 together, even if it's only to say 'well, i tried everything'...🤷‍♂️ let's hope best! 

This version would solve at least the different sound (fr/fl) issues 😉

 

 

now i check those chinese ones...

 

 

1. Hondo Alien

2. example of what it might be

3.vertical, done by german master luthier Magnus Krempel (RIP)