Hard working music educators seeking bass talent pool

[AMS Birmingham]

I run one of the 8 branches of the Academy of Music and Sound, a contemporary music school running Performance and Music Tech BTECs for ages 16+ and Degrees for 18+. My question to the wise is where on earth to seek out new bass playing talent. In our 12 years working so far, it has always been an enormous struggle to find bass players about to finish GCSEs.

We've exhausted the school careers fair route, sent flyers galore, run open events and attended countless battle of the bands/open mics for under 18s; but the cupboard is invariably bare.

ANY ideas would be most welcome! I run the Birmingham branch.

Thanks,
David
CENTRE MANAGER

[JamesBass]

[quote name='AMS Birmingham' timestamp='1402056370' post='2469580']
I run one of the 8 branches of the Academy of Music and Sound, a contemporary music school running Performance and Music Tech BTECs for ages 16+ and Degrees for 18+. My question to the wise is where on earth to seek out new bass playing talent. In our 12 years working so far, it has always been an enormous struggle to find bass players about to finish GCSEs.

We've exhausted the school careers fair route, sent flyers galore, run open events and attended countless battle of the bands/open mics for under 18s; but the cupboard is invariably bare.

ANY ideas would be most welcome! I run the Birmingham branch.

Thanks,
David
CENTRE MANAGER
[/quote]
My advice would be to go out on to your local scene and speak to people. Face to face is always good.

[AMS Birmingham]

Thank you JamesBass. We have had some success face-to-face at gigs, so naturally we'll keep on doing that. We also pay referral fees to our own students if they recommend a friend (better a 17 year old approaches a 16 year old than I guy in his late 30s I think!). I guess I'm really asking whether there are any online places (alongside Basschat) that are worth us using to promote ourselves?

[CamdenRob]

I guess it's hard with kids these days... with so much popular music (not just chart stuff but music that is actually popular amongst teenagers) not featuring traditional band instruments (bass, guitar drums etc..) I'd imagine there are far fewer kids taking up the bass.

With the vast amount of popular music being produced electronically, fewer and fewer kids are inspired to take up an instrument... of those that do many probably wouldn;t choose the bass guitar.

[madshadows]

[quote name='AMS Birmingham' timestamp='1402058102' post='2469616']
Thank you JamesBass. We have had some success face-to-face at gigs, so naturally we'll keep on doing that. We also pay referral fees to our own students if they recommend a friend (better a 17 year old approaches a 16 year old than I guy in his late 30s I think!). I guess I'm really asking whether there are any online places (alongside Basschat) that are worth us using to promote ourselves?
[/quote]

Might be worth posting on places like Facebook and Twitter bass related groups/people, Bass Guitar magazine for example have FB & Twitter accounts, hope it works out for you

John

Edited June 6, 2014 by madshadows

[AMS Birmingham]

You're right of course. I always tell any young bass player that their odds of success as a session musician are better than those of the average guitarist or singer, simply due to the ratio of people to opportunity. That usually switches on a lightbulb in their head, so to speak. I think maybe I/we at the Academy need towork harder on providing earlier years tuition, so free weekend band workshops and the like. We're up for that, but my focus right now is filling our BTEC for September, so I need a short term fix. Thanks for your input and time.

[AMS Birmingham]

Thank you John. Facebook has been a healthy source for us following up student referrals, but I haven't really delved deep into bass forums on there. I'll get to work. Any suggestions for ones to go for? Thank you for your advice and help.

Best wishes,
David

[CamdenRob]

Yeah of course, I understand the need for a short term fix...

As a suggestion, I'd try leafleting gigs in the local metal scene (I'm assuming Birmingham has one?) In my experiance there still seems to be an awful lot of kids into the heavier side of music and a lot of those that are interested also seem to play an instrument... metal is one form of modern music that actually includes regular band instruments.... albeit buried under a wall of distortion...

Edited June 6, 2014 by CamdenRob

[AMS Birmingham]

I'll go for that CamdenRob. A bit of queue bothering never did anyone any harm!

[lobematt]

Hi David

Have you been to the local music stores, Dawsons and the like? That's where I used to hang out when I was that age! I teach at a Liverpool guitar school and at a school in Stockport offering guitar and bass lessons. At the Liverpool school I have around 15 guitar students and there is another two guitar teachers with smilar numbers, there are ZERO bass students at that school! And at the Stockport school which is bigger, they have around 400 students in total doing mainly guitar but also drums, vocals and bass. Out of those 400 students I think there's only actually 14 bass students!

So I feel you're pain, there's not many! I don't know if Stockport is a bit out of the way for what you're trying to do but I will definitely pass on any information, flyers, links or whatever else you have to my younger students if it will help at all?

Cheers

Matt

[AMS Birmingham]

Thanks Matt. Glad I'm not the only one struggling! There's an outside chance we could open in the North West before too long, so the invitation to send info will be taken up with enthusiasm if/when that time comes! We have Professional Music Technology and Hobgoblin down here, both of which run their own lessons, so it's tough to get them to back us. I think an event in house might work. We're running a mini festival in the centre on June 21st and our bass tutor Dave Storer is putting on a clinic as part of it. Hopefully that will be attractive to a few!

[fretmeister]

I play with the Northampton Music & Performing Arts Trust (a series of centres run at school premises across the county) on a saturday morning.

There are tons of guitarists but still not enough bassists. The teachers (not me, I attend to play as my kids are members) are more than happy to provide multiple bass arrangements for single pieces to make sure there is something for every ability.

Maybe bass just isn't cool enough for teenagers! There are loads of guitarists, saxophonists, drummers, pianists, brass and woodwind players, but not bassists.

Still - on the plus side, it means I get to play as much as I want!

[AMS Birmingham]

Loving your work there fretmeister! I'll look up the Northampton Music & Performing Arts Trust. We have a student from Brackley studying here at the moment, with three more interested for September. We could really use some drummers for our Degree too if you know of any great ones who are feeling lost after their A levels!

[CamdenRob]

[quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1402063206' post='2469692']
Maybe bass just isn't cool enough for teenagers! There are loads of guitarists, saxophonists, [b]drummers[/b], pianists, brass and woodwind players, but not bassists.
[/quote]

There is a place with loads of drummers? surley not... around here it's nigh on impossible to find a drummer and when you do find one he's already in seven bands and can only rehearse between 3 and 5am on a tuesday...

The world definitely needs more drummers....

Edited June 6, 2014 by CamdenRob

[razze06]

Many of us have started musical life as guitarists. Perhaps there is the possibility to convert some of the many young would-be guitarists into bassist? Especially after the consideration that the people in question are prospective professional musicians, and that is much easier to get work as a session bassist...

[CamdenRob]

[quote name='razze06' timestamp='1402064636' post='2469716']
Many of us have started musical life as guitarists. Perhaps there is the possibility to convert some of the many young would-be guitarists into bassist? Especially after the consideration that the people in question are prospective professional musicians, and that is much easier to get work as a session bassist...
[/quote]

I'm not sure if that would work with kids though.... they are more likely to see it as *not good enough to make the grade at guitar so I had to play bass*

[Geek99]

[quote name='razze06' timestamp='1402064636' post='2469716']
Many of us have started musical life as guitarists.
[/quote]
But with time, and antibiotics, you do get better ...

[AMS Birmingham]

Oddly enough we have converted a couple of guitarists into tidy bass players over my 6 years in the job, but it's a rare thing. Nice idea though. I'll think of a way to badge it and give it a go!

[fretmeister]

[quote name='AMS Birmingham' timestamp='1402066137' post='2469740']
Oddly enough we have converted a couple of guitarists into tidy bass players over my 6 years in the job, but it's a rare thing. Nice idea though. I'll think of a way to badge it and give it a go!
[/quote]

Just ask them if they want to be guitarists... or whether they want to play an instrument that will let them pitch up with any band of any kind and know there is room to join in...

[AMS Birmingham]

I like that and will use it. Have a good weekend all. Thanks for your input.

[Jonnyboy Rotten]

Dunno what its like now but when I grew up out of all the kids in bands I knew (most of my friendship groups) only one was a bass player. All the other bands had a guitarist on bass who felt he had drawn the short straw.

May be you could use some reverse psychology for your advertising and marketing etc and play on the fact that bassists are sometimes seen by the uninitiated as the least cool and valuable member of a band but in fact we are all part of this secret society who secretly runs the world from backstage.

An example of this was a song we played at band practice last night. At the end of the song the last line is repeated a couple of time but it was me as a bass player who controlled how many times this happened as to whether I resolved to the root chord at the end of the line or used the minor 4th (I think!) which left it hanging so everyone had to play it again until I decided otherwise - it was pretty fun and I got some funny looks from the band leader who had effectively lost control if he didn't want a rubbish, abrupt and confusing ending to the song!

Edited June 6, 2014 by Jonnyboy Rotten

[fretmeister]

[quote name='AMS Birmingham' timestamp='1402064136' post='2469705']
Loving your work there fretmeister! I'll look up the Northampton Music & Performing Arts Trust. We have a student from Brackley studying here at the moment, with three more interested for September. We could really use some drummers for our Degree too if you know of any great ones who are feeling lost after their A levels!
[/quote]

There are a couple of very good drummers, but they've already got their degree plans sorted out.

The centres are brilliant - and when the kids turn 16 they can even get a paid job as a student helper. IIRC minimum wage for 16-17 year olds is still under £4. The centres pay over £7 per hour. So the student helpers keep learning and get way more than they would with a shelf stacking job.

Main Website: http://www.northamptonshire.gov.uk/music/Pages/default.aspx

and the individual centre I go to: http://www.dmpac.co.uk/


I had no intention of joining - about 2 years ago I tried to deliver my eldest daughter for her first session and her clarinet teacher (and the bloke who runs the local one) press ganged me. I've been going ever since.

Massively wide range of music - over the last few months I've done (trying to remember)

Paranoid
The Dam Busters March
Habanera (Bizet)
James Bond theme
Imperial March
Sweet Home Alabama
Eleanor Rigby

and apparently tomorrow I'm going to get ambushed with 3 tunes from 'Fiddler on the Roof' - to perform in 3 weeks (bastards!)

Even when the kids leave to go to university, their parents can continue to attend to play if they want.

[NJE]

A lot of friends of mine have done music courses so I can probably speak from their point of view.

Firstly none of them have gone straight from school into music courses/degrees, partly because they were sensible and knew that there was little to no chance of making music as a career (two of them now do though) and mainly because their parents told them it was a stupid idea and they would need a proper jobs one day. This was the main reason I never went to college or University to do music.

When they did eventually decide to do a music course they sought out the best/most well known places to go. I don't know your music school and I am sure the courses are of a good standard but friends of mine went to Berklee in Boston, Academy of Contemporary Music and The Royal Welsh College of music (although they don't do electric bass as far as I know).

I think one other factor is that not many musicians want to actually go and really study their instrument, learn theory etc and really commit to lengthy courses. It is much more exciting to sling a guitar or bass on, join a band and think you will become a pro musician writing and recording your own material.

I guess my point is, for the small amount of bass players that want to do music courses, my guess is it will be something they do after completing a 'normal/sensible' course, and when they do want to do a course and take it seriously, they will probably seek out the better known places to do those courses.

Edited June 6, 2014 by NJE

[skankdelvar]

16-18 year old prospective bass students are an incredibly narrow target market so getting to them is always going to be difficult

Direct approaches, etc., may throw up a few individuals in the short term but most students don't suddenly decide to do a bass course because they were handed a flyer. They'll have arrived at the decision to pursue a musical education over a period of time.

At some point they start to do some research and the same big name schools will keep coming up. They construct a mental 'long-list' and dig deeper into those names. They narrow it down to two or three schools and make an application. Game over.

The only way to disrupt this process is by addressing the potential student's awareness and pre-disposition at a very early stage. This means having a year-round presence in a narrow range of highly specific media, both on-line and traditional. A good example might be to buy a monthly fixed number of views in the BassChat Technique section and in the Tutorial section. Another approach might be to approach BGM or iBass and offer an unpaid monthly 'lesson' column in exchange for a free ad elsewhere in the publication.

One stitches together a number of media deals like this then sits back and waits. It's the best way (IMO) to address the problem of low awareness in a narrow target market. This approach also supports any tactical initiatives like flyers, master-classes, gig-mugging etc., because when people see the name they think 'Oh, yeah, I've heard of them. Might be worth a chat.'

It may not address this September's shortfall, but get something long-term in place over the next couple of months and next September will be much less of a problem.

Edited June 6, 2014 by skankdelvar

[floFC]

Is there anything like that near Nottingham? My son, 13, is in his school band with two of his mates. He plays the guitar and considers a career in music. Now, the bass player IS a bass player, not a frustrated guitarist, the drummer is looking to buy himself a bass after I lent him one and even my son has nicked my practice amp and has been playing the bass since I bought one he approves the look of!
Maybe Nottingham is a hotbed for bass players?