Greggo Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Good afternoon, Tried to do a search on this but not seen anything similiar.. Has anyone tried changing the magnets in their pickups in their basses before (rather than replace pickup comletey) I've discovered that magnet swapping can be pretty easy and thanks to a thread on jemsite. Im going to be doing this on an ibanez guitar ive got where im swapping the magnet in neck pickup to the one in the bridge and vice versa. I thought I would also try this on my bass, but buying a repalcement magnet (the website [url="http://www.cermag.co.uk/buy_guitar_pickup_magnet.html"]http://www.cermag.co.uk/buy_guitar_pickup_magnet.html[/url] sells guitar/bass magnets and they seem reasonable) I've got a MM style bass which has a wilkinson ceramic pickup. It sounds pretty decent, but has quite an aggresive tone as stock and wouldnt mind taming it. I've heard good things about the alnico 5 seymour duncans, so thought this would be a cheap mod that would put it in same ball park (hopefully) as one of theirs. Does anyone know if MM humbuckers use rod magnets or bar magnets? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 MM buckers have big magnetic poles, pretty sure. Not sure how much benefit there will be to swapping magnets, new different pickups is often cheaper (because you still have the old pickup), more predicatble/known quantity, less effort, and you haven't destroyed your old pickup if you don't prefer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 If it's wired in series you could try switching it to parallel. You'll lose some volume and some of those aggressive mids. It's easier than changing magnets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 Just realised after reading more into it the mm pickup is magnetic pole pieces rather than a singular bar magnetic bar like in the guitar humbucker I'm planning on modding so will shelve this idea! It's an interesting mod though if someone has an Ibanez rg series with v7 and v8 pickups - the bridge as stock has alnico whereas neck has ceramic and when swapping bar magnets over from one to other is meant to improve tone of each pickup respectively, as the pickups are known for being muddy in stock configuration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomBass Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 (edited) I'm sorry I don't have anything to help here, but I was just attracted by the thread title... Edited February 25, 2013 by RandomBass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted February 26, 2013 Share Posted February 26, 2013 [quote name='RandomBass' timestamp='1361836284' post='1991873'] I'm sorry I don't have anything to help here, but I was just attracted by the thread title... [/quote] Don't find that funny at all. Obviously we're poles apart. Anyway, I thought old magnets sounded better? Or is that just with guitars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomBass Posted February 26, 2013 Share Posted February 26, 2013 [quote name='discreet' timestamp='1361841963' post='1991916'] Don't find that funny at all. Obviously we're poles apart. [/quote] Yes, it must be a North - South thing... Sorry lol... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted February 26, 2013 Share Posted February 26, 2013 Good grief you lot are repulsive... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted March 12, 2013 Author Share Posted March 12, 2013 Loving the puns! I took pickup out to look at adding more foam to raise height and this particular mm pickup has bar magnets. Think I may be back on for A potential swap from ceramic to alnico? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted March 12, 2013 Author Share Posted March 12, 2013 Loving the puns! I took pickup out to look at adding more foam to raise height and this particular mm pickup has bar magnets. Think I may be back on for A potential swap from ceramic to alnico? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 there's loads of info [url="http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/town8019/mycustompage0019.htm"]here[/url] about MM pickups which could be of interest. anyway...f**king magnets ? how do they work ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowregisterhead Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 This is the underside of the alnico pickup on my MM Stingray 5 Classic, taken today during a string change because I'm also confused by the ceramic/alnico debate! I suspect it will be very difficult, if not impossible, to introduce pole pieces into a ceramic pickup unless the 'framework' is the same. A straight swap with a SD Basslines or similar would be infinitely easier, and as an earlier posted suggested, much easier to swap back if you don't care for the results! Ernie Ball famously don't sell replacement pickups, so your options are a little limited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted March 12, 2013 Author Share Posted March 12, 2013 (edited) I'll post some pictures if anyone's interested. The Wilkinson musicman humbuckers uses steel pole pieces and ceramic bar magnets so a different set up to eb mm pickups. I did this mod on an Ibanez guitar and it was very easy and results noticeable. In that situation the neck had ceramic and bridge had alnico bar magnets so switching them over led to a hotter bridge and warmer neck. I'm hoping alnico magnets in this wilkinson will give a warmer tone and take away some of the aggressiveness. Edited March 12, 2013 by Greggo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted March 14, 2013 Author Share Posted March 14, 2013 Attached is pic of underside of pickup. As you can see it has two bar magnets, which I'm planning on swapping out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowregisterhead Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 Yikes! Looks like they're set in epoxy of some sort - I hope you've got a sharp knife and steady hands... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted March 14, 2013 Author Share Posted March 14, 2013 Haha yeah. I need to measure them up first before looking into swap. I'm hoping it will be worthwhile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted September 29, 2013 Author Share Posted September 29, 2013 This endeavour is back on... Using a flat blade screwdriver I took out the ceramic bar magnets and I should receive the alnico replacements any day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iiipopes Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Back in the late '60's, before there was such a thing as an after-market pickup, the first experiments were those who sold ceramic magnet bars to replace the alnico magnet bars in Gibson humbuckers. This was easy, as all a person had to do was unsolder the cover, loosen the bottom plate screws, and switch out the magnets. Well, the ceramic magnets, not having any electrical conduction properties, had the effect of lowering the inductance of the pickup. This made the pickup brighter, but could also cause magnetic coil saturation and harshness. Later, companies like Larry DiMarzio and Seymour Duncan (who was working in Fender's London shop, learning how to fix pickups and other aspects of guitar repair) took those same magnets, but wound the coils differently, whether with more of the same wire, or a different wire, or even developing different magnets, and started the after-market pickup market. (Mighty-Mite was there, also, but went into necks instead). Others, like Dan and Kent Armstrong, first started as a repair shop, then expanded: Dan with the plexiglas guitars, and later Kent with the pickups. And so it goes with the rest of the famous after-market pickup names. Alnico II: darker, smoother tone. Alnico III: good presence. Alnico V: top end and clarity; Alnico VIII: Ballsy, can be difficult to control, depending on the windings; Ceramic: no conductive interaction, so the same gauss will lower the inductance, increase brightness and clarity, but taken over the edge with gauss or the wrong coil can sound harsh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowregisterhead Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 [quote name='iiipopes' timestamp='1380552785' post='2226960'] Back in the late '60's, before there was such a thing as an after-market pickup, the first experiments were those who sold ceramic magnet bars to replace the alnico magnet bars in Gibson humbuckers. This was easy, as all a person had to do was unsolder the cover, loosen the bottom plate screws, and switch out the magnets. Well, the ceramic magnets, not having any electrical conduction properties, had the effect of lowering the inductance of the pickup. This made the pickup brighter, but could also cause magnetic coil saturation and harshness. Later, companies like Larry DiMarzio and Seymour Duncan (who was working in Fender's London shop, learning how to fix pickups and other aspects of guitar repair) took those same magnets, but wound the coils differently, whether with more of the same wire, or a different wire, or even developing different magnets, and started the after-market pickup market. (Mighty-Mite was there, also, but went into necks instead). Others, like Dan and Kent Armstrong, first started as a repair shop, then expanded: Dan with the plexiglas guitars, and later Kent with the pickups. And so it goes with the rest of the famous after-market pickup names. Alnico II: darker, smoother tone. Alnico III: good presence. Alnico V: top end and clarity; Alnico VIII: Ballsy, can be difficult to control, depending on the windings; Ceramic: no conductive interaction, so the same gauss will lower the inductance, increase brightness and clarity, but taken over the edge with gauss or the wrong coil can sound harsh. [/quote] Fascinating stuff! When it comes to Stingrays specifically, I've personally always preferred the sound of pickups with alnico magnets to ceramics, but there are so many variables, I find it all a bit bewildering. Best of luck to the OP with the changeover, and I look forward to hearing about the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-basser Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Out of interest what size where the magnets in your pickup and where are you getting the replacement Alnicos? I am currently sourcing parts for a build and finding the right size of Alnico bar magnets is proving to be pain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted October 1, 2013 Author Share Posted October 1, 2013 (edited) [quote name='d-basser' timestamp='1380620237' post='2227833'] Out of interest what size where the magnets in your pickup and where are you getting the replacement Alnicos? I am currently sourcing parts for a build and finding the right size of Alnico bar magnets is proving to be pain [/quote] The magnets in my MM type pickup are 80 x 15mm, but the ones Ive ordered are a bit smaller (62 x 12mm) but will still cover all the steel pole pieces as I measured. The tech guy from AxesRus gave some good advice - he said to dip the new magnets in melted wax thats still warm then place in pickup - the wax will seal them in better with them being a bit smaller size and will pot them as well, which is a bonus. I got magnets from this site in the end as bit cheaper than axesrus for the alnico set :- [url="http://www.cermag.co.uk/buy_guitar_pickup_magnet.html"]http://www.cermag.co...kup_magnet.html[/url] Edited October 1, 2013 by Greggo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 [quote name='Greggo' timestamp='1380622526' post='2227875'] The magnets in my MM type pickup are 80 x 15mm, but the ones Ive ordered are a bit smaller (62 x 12mm) but will still cover all the steel pole pieces as I measured. The tech guy from AxesRus gave some good advice - he said to dip the new magnets in melted wax thats still warm then place in pickup - the wax will seal them in better with them being a bit smaller size and will pot them as well, which is a bonus. I got magnets from this site in the end as bit cheaper than axesrus for the alnico set :- [url="http://www.cermag.co.uk/buy_guitar_pickup_magnet.html"]http://www.cermag.co...kup_magnet.html[/url] [/quote] The coil needs potting, rather than the magnet, magnet isn't made of various loose bits that can move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted October 1, 2013 Author Share Posted October 1, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1380628044' post='2228003'] The coil needs potting, rather than the magnet, magnet isn't made of various loose bits that can move. [/quote] Coils are not exposed when I took the magnets out, just the metal slugs that the magnet will sit on. Edited October 1, 2013 by Greggo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-basser Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 I think what Foxen meant was that the magnets do not really need potted. I personally would test fit the magnets dry and if you like the sound then more securely fit them using epoxy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggo Posted October 1, 2013 Author Share Posted October 1, 2013 [quote name='d-basser' timestamp='1380635813' post='2228204'] I think what Foxen meant was that the magnets do not really need potted. I personally would test fit the magnets dry and if you like the sound then more securely fit them using epoxy. [/quote] Ah ok - yeah sounds like a plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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