JTUK

Depends on your idea of slap...but mostly you should be a million miles away from a Gibson bass for slap....especially if your mentor and influence is MK... Thunk and dunk is mostly the sound you'll get..and that could be quite inteesting but as I say, no where near MK.

It sounds like things have to change or things will change for you... so at least you have a mandate for being pretty forceful getting what you need... Things can't...and don't look like they'll..carry on as they were.

who is more valuable, this gtr or the singer..?

If the rehearsals are too loud and nobody can hear anything...does everyone realise the same thing...that this is not achieving anything, and surely you aren't the only one who is fed up with this situation. I've known gigs to get out of hand, but rehearsals..??? IIf the sitiation is as half as bad as it sounds, then defo band meet time..

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1450472197' post='2933250'] Ease of repair doesn't even figure on my radar when I'm buying stuff - I buy stuff because of how well it works when it works not because it will be easy to repair when it goes wrong. In 35 years of using various guitar and bass gear all the failures I've had have been commodity/low-tech gear like valve amps. [/quote] My cabs got dropped...not much you can do to legislate for that, accidents happen. I believe you can still get JBL recone kits on their classic old lines but if you can't that writes off the chassis. No chassis is indestructible, so it is a factor for me... in the past 7-8 years, I've had to replace 3 chassis. 2 were impossible which took me down the NEO route and one was a manufacture swap out under warranty It is easiliy done..especially if you have unknown varibles in place..like room, new amp, one cab isn't fully plugged in..and you can't hear it working as a pr..without getting on your knees..

[quote name='scalpy' timestamp='1450514096' post='2933442'] I know! Plus he's a really great singer, books gigs, actually really does 'networking' at the end gigs that really actually does get more work and rehearses properly and takes criticism etc really well. All round top bloke. I cannot believe my luck! [/quote] Marry him.... Networking is as important as being able to sing.... you normally have to pay these guys very well to keep them

Pub work here pays between £50 and £100 per man for your 2 hrs. I think it would be hard doing 3 of those a week...but not impossible, but there is no let up. That is £150-300 pw... so if you had a few lessons or another income that chipped in then you might do ok...depends what ok means to you... I doubt you'd get a mortgage on that, but you may be able to still make payments on an existing one. A friend of mine chucked everything in after his marriage broke down and decided to go full time. I know how busy he is and I also know he has a sideline but I wouldn't say he lives well.. But HE is happy, I think. How many times doe he makes £500 pw, ..?? well, he is self employed so he wont pay as much tax as a PAYE figure, but I think it is a long hard hussle to get that money week in-week out, 48 weeks a year... and he wont get paid for holidays. How fully legit/legal he is...probably akin to many Sparkies and builders..? But, most guys I know all struggle to a degree... except the guys who have blagged a world tour with a name outfit. After that, there is a raft of gigs where the guys will tour in fits and starts, but they'll still need a fun gig in a pub that can pay £80 each for top-ups.. but they can 'afford' to be a bit picky who and where they play.

Not so much now but I used to play whole albums by artists years ago..in my formative years. Now, I just goof around on Youtube looking for ideas. All building blocks for when I do play live.

Mine arrived today.... look very very good for the money, Can't believe the price and quality, and can't believe they'll stay at that price. 76 eu for 2 inc 10 pp.

A friend has one and loves his....

[quote name='sunburstjazz1967' timestamp='1450444427' post='2932891'] If the player and audience are happy and the only person moaning is the tone obsessed bass nerd sat at the back moaning about everything from the lighting to the gauge of strings the guitarist has then I'd still rather it bee that way around. If you came up to me mid gig and said the bass is a bit boomy I'd happily cut some lows though. I think people struggle with anything other than how they would have it as being wrong? [/quote] Or, spin that around..the only people that think it is good... are the player and a couple of copyist mates. No one else has an opinion, mostly because it is just blah.. I must admit, my pet thing is sounds. I know when a gtr sounds good..and also drums and keys, vox and P.A. The fact that other people don't get it to any degree is a 'problem' for them.

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1450446314' post='2932926'] My hunt for lightweight ceramic cabs was doomed to failure until I stumbled across TKS. Happy days ever since: [/quote] Well, I'd agree that the S112 is a great little cab, a real tone monster and as light as they come @ 10Kgs which is about as light as it gets.... ?? AND it is ceramic which I currently prefer. I'm sure they could be a downside, but that doesn't register at the moment. Very well built so not about to take one apart anytime soon. I think to be able to engineer cabs of this kind you need a consistantly good ear. I'd suggest Bergantino as another cab maker who knows what he wants to hear in a cab.. or at least, recognises something when it works. Not wanting to harp on about this but the S112's do have a magic little x factor in the mid range..either by accident or design..but that is why I bought them Would I cal them both boutique...?? probably, does that matter...not really, IMO.

[quote name='sunburstjazz1967' timestamp='1450430702' post='2932650'] Someone who enjoys a clanky ric through an old ampeg might not enjoy a sei jazz and eden amp with modern cabs. Neither are good if it's not want you need, a two seater Ferrari is not better than a transit van if you are a self employed plumber is it? [/quote] But each one should be able to know what suits and fits. I'm a million miles away from a P-Bass thump with old flats thru a 15"... but I'll know who has that sound down and what context it needs to be used in. We aren't talking bad sounds because you don't like them or use them......we are talking clueless, no thought and trying to copy their fave bass player.. when they play nothing like them ... That is just totally muddled thinking to me... but there you go. Off the top of my head... I'd say I know about 3-5 guys with sorted sounds around here... as in, when you hear it, you just think they've got it sorted.. range from modern to vintagey vibe with a pick..

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1450428307' post='2932609'] That same applies to you too, of course! If I buy the gear, and I listen to it, and I like it - then it's good for [b][i]me[/i][/b]. Whether or not it rates as good in some absolute terms, or whether [i][b]you[/b][/i] think it is good is largely immaterial to me. If my band-mates enjoy my tone, and some audience members comment favourably upon it - then I must be doing something right. You can't please all of the people all of the time, after all. If some self-appointed arbiter of sound quality can't accept that, then that is [i][b]their[/b][/i] problem - not mine. [/quote] It does, but you didn't say that. But here is also a thing... a local favourite rig around here..won't elaborate much more but 3 guys pretty much copied each others rig and 'love' that sound. I'm not sure who is blowing what smoke up whose backside, but it isn't a good sound. There is no way they will make it a good sound they way they use it but these 3 are convinced. Does anyone care beyond that...not really, or I don't, but it isn't a good sound.... that is all there is to it. I wouldn't know if you have a good sound but it depends who you trust... these 3 guys obviously trust each other... doesn't make them not wrong And don't ask most gtrs either...

Narrowing this down for a decision in the New Year. I'm think the only way I get exactly what I want is a commission..but that has a 14 months wait....downside..!! It is also quite good to find something new so I'm keeping options open for a few weeks. I will extend my search to a Fender Custom Shop 5st.but need to know about things like bridging spacing, and nut width. I'd prefer a P-Bass type neck to keep the strings as straight into the Machine heads as possible. Not a total deal breaker but ??? Anyone know anything about Custom shop dimensions. I'm assuming Custom shop means a degree of Custom in this regard, but ..???

[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1450377562' post='2932247'] It's a shame your introduction to neo was with a mediocre chassis. I don't doubt your experience for a minute, but I know of no evidence anywhere that would lead me to believe that neodymium sounds any different to ceramic. There are some driver manufacturers making equivalent products in neo and ceramic and professional buyers make their choice for reasons of weight and price, but not on sound. So my thinking is that the difference lies elsewhere, and cabinet construction does make a noticeable difference to sound quality. When you listen to a speaker with no cabinet (like a Quad Electrostatic or an open baffle), it's quite amazing how much the cabinet does actually contribute. [/quote] Maybe the choice of chassis was poor...but it was a well trodden route..and seemingly very well regarded... You have to try these things.. Another thing that episode taught me... You don't want bespoke units..there is very little gain anyway if the cab is well thought through and well-built. You wont get the 'secret' design the builder tells you is there and you are hooked in to that chassis very much so..which will probably come with a price premium. Should anything go wrong further down the line after a few years and that bespoke unit is not available anymore, you have to replace it with something. The more basic the chassis, the easier it is to do. A single chassis cab is one thing..multiple speakers are another, cost wise. For me, first and foremost, what I want out of a cab is tone...and that is easily acheiveable with some pretty stock units in a well thought out cab, IMO.

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1450365138' post='2932078'] I feel the same. From the mid 1980s, when I bought my first "proper" bass amplification (Trace Elliot AH250 with 1048 and 1518 cabs - which, interestingly were regarded as pretty "boutique" back then!), through use of Ampeg, Ashdown, Fender, Randall, Orange, Hartke, Gallien Krueger, Aguilar, TKS and a few others I have forgotten about... I have always had what I would think of as a "decent" bass tone. Some better than others to my ears, but all pretty good. Since I first tried a Barefaced Compact, I have owned two Compacts, a Vintage and a Big One. I now use two Berg HS210s - not because I felt that the BFs lacked anything, but simply because the Bergs came up at a time when I was looking at alternatives, and I had always wanted to try some. Amp-wise, I am now using a Markbass LM2. To be honest, I've never noticed a "neo" sound, or the difference between Class D amps and more traditional designs. I've never noticed a lack of "ooomph" or "heft" or whatever it is called. Some amps have lacked midrange control, others have over-compensated with ridiculously complex EQ sections! I think the general quality of bass gear these days is incredibly good, and costs a lot less (in relative terms) than it used to. My old Trace stack cost me over £1300 back in 1986. For that same money [b][i]now[/i][/b] I could buy a really decent rig! It's a great time to be a bass player and all these petty arguments about which is "best" get slightly wearing. [b]If you like it, it's good. Sod what anyone else says![/b] [/quote] Well, it might be what you like, but that doesn't make it good. I make this point generally and am not picking on anyone in particular.

I don't get it.... why are betters players playing with the guy... ? Do they not see or hear the problem... and why did you join?

I quite like him.. I think he influenced a LOT of players, never really got the L42 thing myself so yes, would like to see him branch out. He was very good on the Princess Trust gig, but I guess he is wealthy enough to do as he pleases ...or maybe people don't call him too much as they think he will do the one thing he is known for...which is reasonable thinking.. The two themes don't seem to have joiined up. Maybe he could be the driver for doing other things...and maybe he doesn't want to..?? I'm sure he could do it if he wanted...

Anyone popping in the next few days..?

Not sure of this 'town' thing either. Most bands round here spread across 4 or 5 towns in the county.

[quote name='paul_5' timestamp='1450284678' post='2931371'] A bad workman always blames his tools. Sounds like you need to move on. Life's too short to play in sh*t bands. [/quote] True....... I can't be doing something I'm passionate about if it doesn't cut it...from my standpoint-whatever that is. There are way too many things to get to you musically without such a fundemental thing being 'wrong' And if this guy sounds bad...you all sound bad by association. You are only as good as the weakest member. I'd have to be pretty brutal in this regard

[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1450274917' post='2931254'] The other common element that you may not have considered is that cab manufacturers who use neo speakers always put them in lightweight boxes. There might be one, but I don't know of any commercial neo cab that hasn't got a thinwall or balsawood-type box. I'd like to suggest that what you heard was not so much the sound of neo but rather the sound of insubstantial cabinet walls vibrating. Just a thought. [/quote] Fair point...but my introduction to NEO's was when I put 2510 deltalites in my Goliath Jnr box...and hated them. I'd looked around to see whether this conversion was common as PAS speakers were like gold dust in the U.K and no one had recone kits either. The conversion WAS common and people said they loved it.... well, I liked the weight save, but sold the boxes asap. So, the box was a decent SWR box..albeit maybe not tuned optimally for the NEO chassis but it wasn't the volume] that was the problem, it w as the sound. Anyway... it wasn't until I used Markbass with NEO that I got the idea that NEO wasn't working....and then onto all the others and same thought that these boxes weren't really happening for my ears. The only NEO cabs I got reasonable comments on were Berg AE112's .

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1450273356' post='2931227'] If he goes for the mini array system, let us know when he puts it up for sale. I'm always intrigued about how much time people are willing to give them before they figure that they aren't fit for their use. I think he could do himself a favour by staying with the Mackies... [/quote] 3 gigs and we had no alternative. Even though they were a free hire, we couldn't replace them quick enough. I recall them doing ok in a small boxy room but an open pub/largish bar...that did for them. We turned down carrying 4 subs and 8 tops... again free... as this wasn't going in the right direction...and that would have been a very expensive way of doing things Duo's and acoustic..? I think they'd be great, but anything with level, no, IMO.

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1450242515' post='2930848'] That's great, but not for those of us that do this to pay the mortgage and utilities. Blue [/quote] There was a time when I really wanted this..... and then I realised it is VERY hard to get enough good gigs to pay for that... and it was then I decided to do something that paid me well and often and on time rather than convince myself I was 'making' it doing something I love. Two 'mates' (read guys I know) are currently on World tours and one of them will gross over a £1m but too many guys I know struggle to make £30k p.a...or even £20k and that is where the fun disappears, IMO, as I know they work pretty hard for that sort of money. 'Hard' means up and down the country for gigs... and this country would fit into most U.S states a few times over..