SteveK

There are those that question the true perpetrators of 9/11. There are those that question the 1969 moon landing. And, as 16 pages show, there are even those that question the profound effect The Beatles had/have on popular music.

I'm currently a guest at Warwick Bass Camp, sitting in a room spending the day with the likes of Abraham Laboriel, Billy Sheehan, Lee Sklar etc, and thinking of this thread, asked them how important they felt The Beatles were to them and music in general? They all looked at me as if I was mad. A Laboriel said, "It all changed with The Beatles". That was pretty much the general consensus.

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1441196444' post='2856820'] Very good points. I am thinking that the problem isn't what I thought it was. It is the lack of an arrangement that is the issue. When I do function gigs, I am often presented with a chord chart that says F, Bb, C7 etc and then, occasionally, not always, something like 'Funky', or 'Shuffle'. The band never rehearses but just launches into a version that is based around some sort of shared consensus of what the thing kind of sounds like nearly. I have an idea of the bass part (from a distant recollection of hearing the tune once on a radio or even just on some concept of what 'Funky' or 'Shuffle' means) and everyone else has a nearly but not quite concept of the tune in their own mind. Because the end result is inevitably a poor approximation of the original, it sucks. [/quote] Sorry Bilbo, I'm missing your point! You seem to be saying that bands that don't rehearse and rely on charts only produce "a poor approximation of the original". Quite obviously, the same said band [i]that rehearse[/i] would a make a better fist of things! Are you just saying that the musicians that you're involved with don't rehearse, and that you're not enjoying it for that reason?

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1441206354' post='2856931'] [b]1.TBH I would have thought that most of the bass players on here have far more musical talent than me.[/b] [b]2. Also until people started to make a big deal about that part I wouldn't have considered it really important to the song, and so if I was playing it in a band that didn't have a keyboard player I probably wouldn't bother with the part at all.[/b] If you really think it needs to be included perhaps get the singer(s) to do it? [/quote] 1. Quite possibly! Yet they didn't feel the need to call the OP (or other contributors) out on it. 2. That all depends on the policy of the band... maybe their policy is to get as close as possible to the original - In which case, being a significant hook, the vocal tracking the bass is pretty important.. Or, maybe the band do their own interpretation, in which case maybe the da-do-dos wouldn't be so important.

Hows about actually singing the da-do-do, da-do-do's yourself? Shouldn't be too difficult, and (in theory) should be as tight as f***. Even if your voice isn't great, providing you step forward, do it confidence, and with a big smile on your face... punters can be very forgiving. Hey, maybe even get the audience to sing the part with/for you. Nowt wrong with a bit of audience participation. They'll love you for it. [quote name='FuNkShUi' timestamp='1441115400' post='2856131'] know what you are saying, but i just play it with no effects. P bass. Ive had no complaints. People definitely know what it is as soon as i play the main lick. Crowd only really care about the vocals anyway dont they?? [/quote]Ooh, controversial! I think in this case the da-do-do vocal sample tracking the bass is an important hook of the song.

There's probably all sorts of the normal, and not-so normal, studio jiggery pokery going on with the bass. However, the overiding audible effect, is the [i]"da-do-do, da-do-do" [/i]vocal tracking the bass - difficult to emulate from an FX unit. I used to have a Boss board that had vocal vowel fx - if yours has that feature, maybe give that a go.

Hazel O'Connor's little known 1981 cover of Lou Reed's [i]Men of Good Fortune [/i]has several basses: 2 simple contrasting basses in the verse, and instrumental sections that feature multi tracked basses. I'm not sure that they really helped the track

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1439653624' post='2844714'] Do you have to play "Rhythm Stick" in a gigging band? If not then why beat yourself up over not playing it properly? [/quote] [quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1439658157' post='2844771'] Find something else to play, move on and come back to it in a few months. [/quote] I've always lived my musical life by the philosophy, "nothing will beat me". IMV Twincam is right to agonise over it, he wants to be a "well rounded" musician. Stick with it Twincam, ambient's idea to break the bass line up into shorter segments is good. Start at a slow tempo and gradually increase. It may take several weeks to get it sounding anything like slick, but as you practice and generally improve your chops, so will your rendition of "Rhythm Stick".

My guess? It's either an attempt at dampening the open string to sound more like a fretted note, or to prevent the part of the string behind the fretted note from buzzing. Either way - bordering on the neurotic IMV

[quote name='Slipperydick' timestamp='1439054490' post='2839701'] Whether it was [b]great marketing or luck[/b], there was something for everyone on Beatles LPs. Yellow Submarine, When I'm 64 etc. [/quote] I think you may have ommited something... oh yeah... the hugest dollop of talent!

Slag off arguably the most important album of the last 50 years - mention the new album out in September - Job done! I don't believe for one second that Keef actually thinks that.

[quote name='MarkW' timestamp='1438727725' post='2836811'] I must admit I have never been able to stand Cilla Black's voice, and have often used the fact that my father-in-law thinks she's fantastic as the absolute benchmark of his abject lack of musicality. Seriously, I've heard more melodious noises when I've trodden on the cat. [/quote] Shame, that in a thread titled "Cilla Black RIP" you felt the need to post the above! [quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1438729149' post='2836822'] "Slipped and died love" ? [/quote] Disappointing! RIP Cilla

All the while there's testosterone and freedom of expression, there'll be rock n roll.

[quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1437813384' post='2829185'] Anybody watch this,what a dreadful programme, old men moaning about 'it ain't what it used to be' included Noel Gallagher. Inane questioning from Lauren Laverne, pitiful. [/quote] I never saw the programme. Were the "old men" really "moaning"? Or were they just stating the facts? The fact is, Rock n Roll aint what it used to be... and why should it? You'd expect to hear/see some changes in the 60 odd years that R&R (in the broader definition) has been around. [quote name='LayDownThaFunk' timestamp='1437915884' post='2829927'] Because that's the rules. Rock n' roll has no rules. [/quote] Good answer!

[quote name='LayDownThaFunk' timestamp='1437908255' post='2829834'] Why does rock n' roll have to involve a guitar? [/quote] Why does cricket involve a bat? Actually, in R&Rs early days a piano was often de rigeur.

By virtue of the fact that the 80's included this debacle means that the 80's win as worst decade, hands down! [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYFRFyvhGRY[/media] [quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1436908667' post='2822035'] For a terrible live band from the 80s. IMO you would have to try very hard beat the awfulness of A Flock Of Seagulls. Lumpen, pedestrian, turgid synth pop churned out by people who didn't really understand musically, or image-wise, what it was all about; but were transparently desperate to be successful. Someone at their record company must have had a lot of faith in them (and a massive promotional budget), because it seemed that they would turn up as second support for every other really good band that I went see. I must have had the misfortune to catch their live act on at least 6 separate occasions, most of the time without realising that they were on the bill until I turned up at the gig. [/quote] I was touring the US in 1981, and who showed up as support at one gig (can't remember the city)? Yep, AFOS!

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1436385310' post='2817808'] [color=#800080]The musician is playing..? Pay him/her. The musician is at home watching TV..? Paid for what..? So no, the people that made the product should have already been paid for it at the start, not at every play/download/whatever.[/color] [/quote] OK, so as I understand it, Dad3353 is saying that all musicians, agents, managers, record company execs etc should be paid an hourly rate. I'm guessing that after these hourly rates have been paid, any profits goes to the state

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1436370859' post='2817615'] I think musicians should be paid for playing music, not for people listening to it. [b]1. One doesn't pay every time one looks at an artist's painting or sculpture[/b]. Live performance, fine; the audience pays. [b]2. Recordings should be paid for on a 'one off' basis.[/b] To me, all this stuff about 'intellectual property' is a scam. [b]3. [/b][b]Actors in films get paid for their performance, not for the folks going to the cinema.[/b] Yes, I was a professional musician for some years. It's become a cow for milking, imo, where folks get money even when sitting by the pool or doing their shopping. An unpopular view, I know, but there it is. [/quote] 1. if you want to look at an artists painting or sculpture in the comfort of your own home, then you most certainly will pay. 2. How much? And by whom? 3. Not true, many actors will negotiate a % of the box office.

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1436205693' post='2815984'] From what I've read, he didn't like his tone either. Spent thousands of pounds and years of searching and never got it right. [/quote] Someone should've told him, "IT'S ALL IN THE FINGERS!"

[quote name='spectoremg' timestamp='1436109069' post='2814997'] You're right, they're using the copyright loophole. As a consumer I want the best deal, and let's not be naive here, we're talking about rich rock stars, not lowly musicians. And by the way I hope you apply the same high-mindedness to all the child labour clothing you're wearing. [/quote] It's that same old "justification" for getting something for nowt that occasionally gets discussed here, and never fails to disappoint me on a musicians forum.

[quote name='KevB' timestamp='1436084932' post='2814752'] It's an odd and uncomfortable looking rant but for someone else to think it worth filming is equally weird. Is it for real?, all that arm waving on his way out looks a bit am-dram. [/quote] It's particularly uncomfortable as the gentleman obviously can't handle stressful situations well, and possibly suffers from a degree of autism.

I think Roger Daltrey was asking the same question!

On the subject of Paul Jackson, you might want to check out some of these Youtube clips with my old mucker and bandmate Jimmy Copley on drums. Some lovely playing from Paul, Jimmy & Char [url="http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=paul%20jackson%20jimmy%20copley%20char&qs=n&form=QBVR&pq=paul%20jackson%20jimmy%20copley%20char&sc=0-0&sp=-1&sk="]Paul, Jimmy & Char[/url]

This is a very difficult question to answer! A lot depends on your setup. There are so many variables that usually compromise is needed. Are you and the band reliant on your backline to be heard? Or do you have a PA through which you all go? Either way, from where you're stood on the stage a "good mix" (as in overall balance) shouldn't be the priority. As a bass player drums should be clearly audible to you, particularly Kick, Snare & Hi-hat. You have to trust the judgement of someone out front, whether it's a FOH engineer or a friend that is at least a little knowledgeable as to how things should sound. A good sound and mix to you on stage will likely sound abysmal out front.

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1435745747' post='2811981'] I didn't think that you were being demeaning or patronising, just expressing an opinion based on experience of having played in other parts of the world [/quote] Thanks Pete.