Lowender

Scam. But so close to great publicity. Imagine if an established artist invited people to send a bass track or guitar track to one of their songs and then decided who's was best and gave them an audition? THAT would be cool. This is just insulting.

You're equating the being accomplished on an instrument which translates to others to a personal accomplishment which just serves oneself. But...okay.

It's the state of the economy in both the U.S and the U.K. It is no longer privately market driven. You can't blame the consumer for wanting the best price. Is it our responsibility to keep a small store in business? If they provide a service you can't get elsewhere I understand it, but that often isn't the case.

I would add Custom Shop and the Ibanez Prestige to the list. I just don't think they're all that much better than their counterparts at half the price. So yeah, in the end, if it's more a matter of expense and you find those minute improvements worth the cost, go for it. We all have to draw the line where we're comfortable. I guess what I should have said from the start was that I owned a Fodera and could afford it, and didn't really love it. Rics are expensive and I have one. I don't NEED it. But I like it because it's like nothing else. I can't justify the cost (though I got a great deal) but it's something that can't be defended or dismissed. It's all preference and these conversations are all just sharing of thoughts.

I like passive, I like active, I like humbucker , I like single coil. All have their advantages and disadvantages and their own character.

Also, the Dingwall is such an unique animal. I would think you either HAD to have one or would avoid it like the plague.

[quote name='Woodinblack' timestamp='1382598333' post='2254030'] I have a SR505 and a SR1000ewn prestige. The prestige is a lot better than my SR, and the price difference wasn't 4 times, closer to 2. And for that price, the prestige was better value for money than the SR. But maybe that is the difference between my two. I would not let the name and label decide what you were getting, I got them because I saw them and really wanted them, which is the decider. When I got my fretless I compared the squire and the fender while prepared to buy either, but preferred the squire so bought it. [/quote] What pups are in the SR500? I think that makes the biggest difference. There's also a model that si essentially an SR with fancy wood and norstrand pups and it sounds fantastic. I tried to find a sound example on Youtube but it';s amazing how many "reviewers" don't know how to set their amp. This is from the FB page of "Bass Magazine" I think it shows the "hi fi" clarity of the ibanez. Some may say it's "thin" though low end is easy to add. https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?id=111340148878929&story_fbid=673925699287035

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1382551836' post='2253602'] It's called 'art' he is expressing himself on his chosen instrument in the manner that gives him (and his many fans) greatest pleasure. Why climb Everest? [/quote][quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1382551836' post='2253602'] It's called 'art' he is expressing himself on his chosen instrument in the manner that gives him (and his many fans) greatest pleasure. Why climb Everest? [/quote] I get that. And I'm all for having fun and playing something that others enjoy. (Though I personally was bored by it after 30 seconds). But I don't see the analogy with climbing a mountain. That's a personal accomplishment, not art. And it isn't something you do very often. I have nothing against the e-bow or climbing a mountain, I'm just thinking in terms of practicality. Like with many effects, they're fun for minute and then the novelty wears off and you realize the band needs a bass player.

Ask yourself -- if you could get one for free...which one would you take? That's the bass you want more. And as an aside, I like Ibanez basses but feel the Prestige isn't much better than the SR -- which is a 1/4 of the price.

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1382572058' post='2253954'] But there's only one place in the world that they're made. Does that mean they should move to the middle of nowhere to reduce pricing? Or maybe outsource to China? I don't think you can compare a mass market product that's available in multi-locations with corresponding multiple price points to a custom built bass guitar that's only available from one place. Maybe we should be trying to work out what is over-priced relative to geographical location costs and overheads. Gut feel is it's probably the bottom end of the market where the greatest over-pricing is happening on mass produced, machine made, instruments and not the top where the man hours per bass are huge because of the labour intensive construction and attention to detail that's involved [/quote] Newsflash -- ALL basses and guitars are made in part by machines and in part by hand. And as stated, if you like them, play them. I also think Mercedes are overpriced. But if you want one and can afford one, buy it and enjoy it.

Danelectro and Hofner .

The Ibanez SR 505, Music Man SUB and the Squier J deluxe are all excellent basses in that price range.

[quote name='Clarky' timestamp='1382345743' post='2250763'] Scott LaFaro's reconstructed bass (as Danny Thompson won't be selling 'Victoria' any time soon!) [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fqQ9dCk9oU[/media] [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=I5-PgCFlx1k#t=10"]http://www.youtube.c...5-PgCFlx1k#t=10[/url] [/quote] I played that bass! It is UNGODLY good!

[quote name='Budbear' timestamp='1382495631' post='2252875'] In my humble opinion (as humble as we New Yorkers are with our opinions), the only overpriced basses are the ones that don't sell. You see them on the shop walls, dusty, poorly set up, with dead strings, priced reduced several times, and yet, not cheap enough for someone to buy. People will buy most anything if the price is right. I'm involved in the retail end of the industry and that's the reality of MI sales. Just a word about Fodera. The price list linked to above is mostly suggested retail, not selling prices. Dealers give discounts. Nonetheless, they are expensive. I know Vinnie and Joey personally, and, in fact, am quite friendly with Joey (BTW, his last name is Lauricella, not Fodera. That's Vinnie's name) so I may be a bit biased. I live 15 min. from the Fodera workshop in Brooklyn. All their instruments are handmade, with immense care & meticulous craftsmanship. All their components are top quality. It's a small business, but they treat their employees well with a fair wage and excellent benefits and great respect. No one in that shop is getting rich. They all live in middle income, working class neighborhoods. Overhead is high in NYC. Customer service is extraordinary, and every customer that goes to the shop gets either Vinnie or Joey's personal attention and time. All that stuff costs money. Every customer is treated alike and well, whether your name is Victor Wooten or Joe Schmoe. Nobody gets a *star* endorsement deal. The margin is too slim for that even if they had that mindset. They may or may not be your cup of tea, but there is no denying their quality and, seeing as how well their resale prices hold up and how quickly they're snapped up when flipped, their value. I have played several but I don't own one, not because I think they aren't worth it, but because I don't play out nearly enough anymore to justify such an expense even at dealer's cost. Although, you never can tell. I just might sell off most of my collection someday and use that to get a custom Monarch made to my specs and cross that off my bucket list. Last words: Play what you like. If it makes you happy, it was worth whatever you paid for it. Be groovy to each other. [/quote] I agree with everything said. Good people. Meticulous attention to detain. Fine instruments. High overhead. But that's the rub. I think this puts in in perspective. I was recently shopping for a sofa and found a nice on at a very trendy shop in an expensive part of town. Lots of personable attention with knowledgable salespeople. They served tea and crumpets while you peruse the store. The sofa cost 1200 quid. Then I went on line -- saw the same exact sofa (they even used the same picture). 400 quid. Moral of the story. I understand that privately businesses have higher overhead. I just don't want to be the one to pay for it.

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1381235500' post='2236123'] Ebow on bass sounds amazing if you are a genius with it, but its insanely frustrating to control.... Of course if you are a fiftieth level dark lord of bass madness you use two at the same time:- [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xx1RccwlF5g[/media] [/quote] That sounds nice, but I must say...I think it's the perfect reason why every musician should play some keyboards...[i]not[/i] necessarily to have piano chops, but just to do exactly what he's doing here. It would be quite easy and the end result would be the same. And after all, how often would you really need it? Unless you're playing on making recordings for massage therapists and yoga classes.

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1382477887' post='2252772'] I think the 'for me' is the most significant part of this post. I couldn't disagree more with the rest of it. I gigged a Fodera for years in a soul functions band and it was possibly the best tone I've ever had in a band situation. Able to sit perfectly in the mix and bags of tonal variation that allowed me to cover dirty funk, classic soul and more modern pop with ease. I recently sold it to a top session player who covers mostly jazz, funk and Latin and it can handle those genres just as easily. Sure Foderas cost a lot of money but all these top session guys don't buy them because they look pretty or so they can show off down the dog and duck. They buy them because they have the potential to sound fantastic in the right hands [/quote] That must be it. I have the wrong hands.

[quote name='Ziphoblat' timestamp='1382471352' post='2252649'] True, but neck-through/bolt-on is a preference thing. I too prefer bolt-on, but I can see why somebody would prefer neck-through. I don't think they're advertising the neck-through as being a "better" instrument though, it's simply a choice you can make which requires more work and labour to produce, hence the increased price tag. A manufacturer might charge extra for a matching headstock, not because it's a better instrument, but because the process of doing so costs them more money, so if that's your preference you'll have to pay for it. [/quote] True.

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1382453364' post='2252318'] I'm pretty much sold to be honest... just got to wait for the right one to come along somewhere near where I live... [/quote] I'm not sure what the shipping is to the U.K. It's free in the U.S and NO TAX. They also run 15%off specials , which make this bass around 150 quid. [url="http://www.musiciansfriend.com/bass/sterling-by-music-man-s.u.b.-ray4-bass-guitar"]http://www.musicians...ay4-bass-guitar[/url] I'd recommend going used but they're relitively new and it seems whoever gets one, keeps it.

[quote name='crez5150' timestamp='1382456303' post='2252371'] The op said Bass......] [/quote] LOL!!! Harsh, but funny! They are their own animal. I like them for what they are, but not as a main instrument.

The tone control on a P is really just a treble cut. That's what you get and it's part of the reason they sound the way they sound. If you want to add extreme tonal variety you'd be better with some outboard gear.

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1382309600' post='2250576'] Foderas come with amazing, lovingly hand-crafted, finishes. [/quote] And what is that finish? Oil? They are not poly or nitro or any kind of gloss lacquer. That's all I meant. And I agree about the Laklands. Fender copies at twice the price.

To Sibob.... Nope . Not it at all. I missed you misunderstood the whole point. This is why I brought it up. To hopefully help others who fall into the same trap. Let me try again. Fodera's FEEL great -- very solid. But it's a bit of an illusion. One can make the comparison to a very EQ'd pre-amp. They may sound louder and sweeter but after a while you might start to hear a falseness to it. It's the same thing with the feel of a lot of these boutique basses. That "solidity " seems attractive for a while, but it can also be a bit stiff for some things. Fodera's also have a lot of sustain, but again, that isn't always preferable, yet at first it seems appealing. This is more the case with the more expensive neck-through basses. Oddly enough, Joey Fodera plays a bolt on. He says he prefers the sound. Funny how the guy who actually makes the specialty instruments prefers a less expensive version. As for the Fodera sound, they have a nice clean tone, but one that doesn't cut through a band or a recoding especially well. I think this is the reason they aren't embraced by a lot of recording artists. I always knew this but didn't want to fully accept it. After a while, I got tired of defending what was SUPPOSED to be a magnificent instrument. The one client who wasn't happy with the sound was simply representative of what I've been feeling. And the fact thjat it was totally unbiased confirmed what i've felt for a long time. Fodera's are a bit toneless. I don;t know if it's the combination of woods, or the design or the lack of finish. With 3 different pups, it was still weak and lacking in character. For me. MAYBE, if it were a cheapo instrument I'd keep it around for things that required a certain feel for which it worked well. But for the price of a piano, I thought it better off in someone else's hands.

There's almost no difference between the Fender and the Squier Jag. Personally, I find P/J combos seem to not quite be either. But they're nice basses and look cool as hell.

I have a 97 Sting Ray and a 2012 SUB Sting Ray. There may be differences in the internal make up but there's next to no difference in playability and sound. The only difference is the SUB cost a fifth of the price. Get one. You won't regret it.

A good example of busy playing that's still in the pocket.