Black Crows Hard to Handle. I have been playing it wrong all these years.

[dave_bass5]

Recently got back in to playing bass and have a few gigs coming up. Ive had to relearn a lot of stuff, but surprised at how well I remember it. H2H is one of those ive played 1000's of times (we still do it in my main band where either play keys), but last nigh i isolated the bass from all the songs im learning to give me a chance to play along with the originals without a bass line there. When I listened to this bass line it sounded different to how ive been playing it. I check UGT and YT and everyone seems to play it the same way as I do. 

It's the run ups in the verses. E, F#, A, B that repeats at the end of every second bar. The isolated bass track sounds like he is playing G# instead of A. Cant believe it's taken me decades to realise this. It sounds wrong got me only because im used to playing the A. all the tabs and videos ive seen also play the A.

 

Can anyone confirm the above? I know the audience won't notice etc, but if it's wrong its wrong. 

 

This is the stem taken directly from the single version

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/7gqwmalcjdpxj099vzd4p/Untitled-4_1-02-Bass-.7.wav?rlkey=3ka7ez6kfprk6gbv9vcqkvok0&st=434zn5ji&dl=0

 

Edited 11 hours ago by dave_bass5

[warwickhunt]

From memory (and I don't have a bass to hand) I'm fairly sure playing the ascending riff it has a different note in, than the descending bit (if that makes sense).  We used to play it in a weird key to fit the singer so I've no idea what actual notes we played.  

[dave_bass5]

7 minutes ago, warwickhunt said:

From memory (and I don't have a bass to hand) I'm fairly sure playing the ascending riff it has a different note in, than the descending bit (if that makes sense).  We used to play it in a weird key to fit the singer so I've no idea what actual notes we played.  

No, im not talking about the intro, im talking about the verses. You are correct about the intro. 

[Misdee]

This happens to me quite a lot, ie realising I've been playing something very slightly wrong whilst being totally confident I had it right. One note can put a whole different complexion on things. 

[dave_bass5]

28 minutes ago, Misdee said:

This happens to me quite a lot, ie realising I've been playing something very slightly wrong whilst being totally confident I had it right. One note can put a whole different complexion on things. 

Well im not surprised i got it wrong, but more that so many YT videos seem to have as well. 

[dave_bass5]

When I first started playing bass in a covers band I had to learn about 40 songs quickly. It's only recently that ive had to play them again and cant believe how far off the mark some of my bass lines were in places (on the whole ok though). And I played with that band for 15 years. No one ever said anything. 

[Lord Sausage]

1 hour ago, dave_bass5 said:

When I first started playing bass in a covers band I had to learn about 40 songs quickly. It's only recently that ive had to play them again and cant believe how far off the mark some of my bass lines were in places (on the whole ok though). And I played with that band for 15 years. No one ever said anything. 

It's cos no one listens to the bass player!

 

 

Even bass players by the looks of things on this thread!😅

Edited 4 hours ago by Lord Sausage

[Sean]

I've played that song for years and it's one of those that in the verses I improvise. A bit different every time. My band are all over any harmonic anomalies and no one ever says a word.

[dave_bass5]

5 minutes ago, Sean said:

I've played that song for years and it's one of those that in the verses I improvise. A bit different every time. My band are all over any harmonic anomalies and no one ever says a word.

I guess my biggest surprise is all the tutorials over the past 30+ years have all been wrong. 

[Sean]

3 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

I guess my biggest surprise is all the tutorials over the past 30+ years have all been wrong. 

Right then, I'm going to play it that way at full rehearsal next week and see if I get a reaction. I'll let you know.

[dave_bass5]

1 minute ago, Sean said:

Right then, I'm going to play it that way at full rehearsal next week and see if I get a reaction. I'll let you know.

Me too. Probably get told its wrong (by the guitarist), and no one else will notice 🤣

[Sean]

26 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

Me too. Probably get told its wrong (by the guitarist), and no one else will notice 🤣

Let's compare notes. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Sean

[Misdee]

3 hours ago, dave_bass5 said:

Well im not surprised i got it wrong, but more that so many YT videos seem to have as well. 

It'd be interesting to compare how Johnny Colt plays it compared to Duck Dunn on Otis Redding's original version. Maybe( probably) Johnny isn't playing a faithful rendition.

[Terry M.]

I've never heard this cover of the Otis Redding classic before but you are indeed hearing a G# not an A as you suspected and weirdly enough it sounds "off" to me. Much prefer the A. As has been mentioned it could be that this version has strayed from the original somewhat.

 

IF the piece is in b minor then the G# is outside the key and explains why it sounds off to my ear. 

Edited 2 hours ago by Terry M.

[dave_bass5]

14 minutes ago, Terry M. said:

I've never heard this cover of the Otis Redding classic before but you are indeed hearing a G# not an A as you suspected and weirdly enough it sounds "off" to me. Much prefer the A. As has been mentioned it could be that this version has strayed from the original somewhat.

Yeah, it's the sounding off that made me listen a bit closer. 

IIR this came out after the Commitments movie, which prompted a lot of covers bands at the time to start playing Motown songs. I agree, I think he played it wrong and no one has picked up on this before. Now im aware of it I think it's ok to play this, even though in isolation it doesn't seem right. 

I think this version is probably the version a lot of pub bands do compared to the original. 

Edited 2 hours ago by dave_bass5

[tauzero]

9 hours ago, warwickhunt said:

From memory (and I don't have a bass to hand) I'm fairly sure playing the ascending riff it has a different note in, than the descending bit (if that makes sense).  We used to play it in a weird key to fit the singer so I've no idea what actual notes we played.  

 

I've always played the intro along with the guitarist (multiple bands), same notes going up as going down.

[dave_bass5]

4 minutes ago, tauzero said:

 

I've always played the intro along with the guitarist (multiple bands), same notes going up as going down.

That’s wrong. 

[tauzero]

4 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

That’s wrong. 

 

I feel remarkably relaxed about that.

[Terry M.]

10 minutes ago, tauzero said:

 

I've always played the intro along with the guitarist (multiple bands), same notes going up as going down.

Major 3rd up.minor 3rd down.

[Misdee]

Finally got to my bass tonight to have a crack at this. I can see how someone might assume it's an A, but G# is clearly right and sounds better to me. 

 

The verse is in a major key, and the turnaround bits use a minor third, but you can play a minor third over certain major chords, and vice versa.

 

Otis Redding version is essentially the same.

Edited 59 minutes ago by Misdee

[dave_bass5]

7 minutes ago, tauzero said:

 

I feel remarkably relaxed about that.

Think of the amount of punters that have gone home totally unimpressed 😂

[Geek99]

As long as the crowd are dancing/cheering/singing along/not killing each other 

does it matter ?

[dave_bass5]

1 minute ago, Geek99 said:

As long as the crowd are dancing/cheering/singing along/not killing each other 

does it matter ?

Not to them, but some of us might take a bit of pride in playing something the correct way, especially if the idea is to cover a certain version. Otherwise it’s becomes ‘our version’, which as we all know is musician speak for ‘couldn’t be bothered to learn it properly’  😂

 

 

 

[Terry M.]

10 minutes ago, Geek99 said:

As long as the crowd are dancing/cheering/singing along/not killing each other 

does it matter ?

A semitone won't alter the moon's orbit but I thought it was an interesting observation nonetheless 🤭

I definitely prefer the A over the G#.

Edited 48 minutes ago by Terry M.

[tauzero]

1 minute ago, dave_bass5 said:

Not to them, but some of us might take a bit of pride in playing something the correct way, especially if the idea is to cover a certain version. Otherwise it’s becomes ‘our version’, which as we all know is musician speak for ‘couldn’t be bothered to learn it properly’  😂

 

But for me to play it the right way, I'd also have to train the guitarist to play it the right way. And I think it sounds fine as it is.