AM1 Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 In true cheapskate style, I'm looking for some freebie bass lessons. Last time I checked my pockets, there were dead flies in there haha, so no chance of any coinage appearing for anyone mad enough to offer me some free bass lessons, but I might stretch to a beer. In some cheap rathole. HAHA. I'm crap, but ultra enthusiastic and hardworking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 So where in 'Earth' are you? I'm sure someone on here will be up for some hints and tips. 'Specially with the chance of a beer in the offing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 10, 2009 Author Share Posted May 10, 2009 [quote name='hubrad' post='484717' date='May 11 2009, 12:13 AM']So where in 'Earth' are you? I'm sure someone on here will be up for some hints and tips. 'Specially with the chance of a beer in the offing![/quote] Primarily based in Laaaahndan but I travel loads so anything's possible! Did I mention that the beer was a can of Special Brew, hahahaha. I'm not selling this very well, am I?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 Special Brew holds a hint of danger! Alternatively you could just tell BC as a whole what you're struggling with and see what comes up.. could be fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 10, 2009 Author Share Posted May 10, 2009 (edited) [quote name='hubrad' post='484722' date='May 11 2009, 12:23 AM']Special Brew holds a hint of danger! Alternatively you could just tell BC as a whole what you're struggling with and see what comes up.. could be fun.[/quote] Ha, you're not wrong! Plus it's cheaper than Stella! Yeah - it's not specifically one thing, there's loads of stuff ranging from a multitude of technique issues to improving versatility in terms of various music styles, gaining deeper understanding of chord "chemistry", which scales will work best over certain chords in certain contexts, improving my live sound, playing appropriate basslines in more complicated time signatures...groove playing...I could go on....basically I need to get better faster. It's mainly technique stuff at the moment though which is really beginning to slow progress, I can't make my fingers do what I want them to do on certain stuff, even with hours and hours of work on it. There's some great music opportunities around for stuff I am really interested in but I need to get my ass in gear and make much more progress than is happening currently. PS - I'm not looking for an overnight miracle and I will do whatever work it takes, I just need some pointers, there's only so much you can learn off YouTube! Edited May 10, 2009 by AM1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakenewmanbass Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 [quote name='AM1' post='484711' date='May 11 2009, 12:02 AM']In true cheapskate style, I'm looking for some freebie bass lessons.[/quote] I really have sympathy for your lack of funds situation but... At risk of pointing out the obvious, it's a bit like asking a taxi driver for a free ride, the guys really good enough to offer you some proper, experienced, useful tuition will generally be trying to make a living out of music (me included) pointers and posting on here are fine (and I've relayed tons of stuff) but there is nothing like a face to face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 Yeah, I think you'll struggle here for free. I would make one suggestion on the whole getting my fingers to be faster and so on thing. Get a hold of Michael Manrings old VHS video. He concentrates for the first 3/4 of the video on finger conditioning. He goes into a staggering amount of depth and provides a huge array of well constructed exercises. No they wont change anything overnight, but if you actually do them for 6 months you wont believe the difference they make! And they are very focused on not damaging yourself and good warm ups etc. There is virtually nothing he cant do with his fingers on a fretboard, so I'd say take his advice - it helped me no end.... As for a wide range of styles, thats not my bag at all, although I've played in many styles of music (though not jazz - bleeuugh!) and done fine, and can write a b-line to fit most stuff (my walking is so shocking that we wont go there), I certainly wouldnt say I can jump from style to style and be completely convincing these days. But I could at college (again jazz excluded) because I was in about 12 bands at one point. I think you need to really get into a band in every style you are interested in. The quick way to do this is to learn five songs in each style with as different sounding b-lines as you can find. Preferably the five classic songs in each style. Then go get the bands. Be that bass whore for a while and get in a cover band in each style you want to play in. It will very quickly get you good enough in each style. Other than that listen to a lot of each style. Have a week of evenings where you pick a style and work on that feel exclusively. Then move to the next style for a week, after going through each style a week at a time have a week with a different style each evening, then an evening with a different style each song. I did this to a certain extent when I was in college (instead of getting my reading and walking together I'm afraid) and it definitely works! Afterwards you can stylistically jump ship at the drop of a hat and be convincing. The ones than I think can be very hard to get right (and again I am not including jazz cos thats a world of pain in and of itself) are reggae and funk. Country is pretty easy to cop, cos the b-lines are generally really simple, and the feel is like a 2/4 halftime thing. Rock can have a lot of notes, or not, but the feel is generally pretty easy, its more often than not slightly ahead of the beat and pushes the down beats with emphasis on 1 and 3. Punk is the same but simpler and more aggressive - even more ahead of the beat. But funk and reggae are a real struggle for some people. Its the laid back thing and the syncopation. My advice is to immerse yourself up to the gills in the stuff for a couple to six months and learn all the classic songs you can find. Play along to everything. Eventually it becomes second nature. Some people do this really fast and some people arent convincingly funky ever, however hard they try. They can play funk lines note perfect and sound completely unfunky. The danger with funk and reggae is that they are crystal meth for bassists, I got into funk and never got away, really. Everything I write now has a hint of funk in it, and most of the reggae I try and come up with sounds like ska Its is a powerful addiction! If I weren't ridiculously busy though I'd have a jam and offer some pointers, but I don't do structured teaching anymore, time etc etc.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 11, 2009 Author Share Posted May 11, 2009 Simon - hi If you don't ask, you don't get, so I thought it worthwhile to at least try! There's a guy that does free drum and bass lessons in West London, I've seen his adverts in the studio but I won't be back in that studio until later in the month. Maybe he's a serial killer though and the lessons are to lure his victims in! Anyway - yeah thanks for the really useful tips! The intention is definitely to join more bands in more styles once I can play those other styles more convincingly. I know exactly what you mean about funk, it's infiltrating into my fingers all the time, despite my best attempts to stop it! My fingers have got the funk! Anyway - a bit of diversity is definitely good to shake up the mix now and again. What you said about punk - there seems to be a really common misconception that punk is the easiest style to play - well it's as easy as you want to make it, there are some great punky bass players around that easily demolish that misconception. I personally prefer melodic punk basslines rather than typical 3 chord root note pick basslines but try playing flat out punk bass in that style for 4 hours! Not as easy as people think! I live in hope that there is someone who will give up some free time to help in my quest! Cheers AM [quote name='51m0n' post='484867' date='May 11 2009, 10:24 AM']Yeah, I think you'll struggle here for free. I would make one suggestion on the whole getting my fingers to be faster and so on thing. Get a hold of Michael Manrings old VHS video. He concentrates for the first 3/4 of the video on finger conditioning. He goes into a staggering amount of depth and provides a huge array of well constructed exercises. No they wont change anything overnight, but if you actually do them for 6 months you wont believe the difference they make! And they are very focused on not damaging yourself and good warm ups etc. There is virtually nothing he cant do with his fingers on a fretboard, so I'd say take his advice - it helped me no end.... I think you need to really get into a band in every style you are interested in. The quick way to do this is to learn five songs in each style with as different sounding b-lines as you can find. Preferably the five classic songs in each style. Then go get the bands. Be that bass whore for a while and get in a cover band in each style you want to play in. It will very quickly get you good enough in each style. The ones than I think can be very hard to get right (and again I am not including jazz cos thats a world of pain in and of itself) are reggae and funk. Country is pretty easy to cop, cos the b-lines are generally really simple, and the feel is like a 2/4 halftime thing. Rock can have a lot of notes, or not, but the feel is generally pretty easy, its more often than not slightly ahead of the beat and pushes the down beats with emphasis on 1 and 3. Punk is the same but simpler and more aggressive - even more ahead of the beat. But funk and reggae are a real struggle for some people. Its the laid back thing and the syncopation. My advice is to immerse yourself up to the gills in the stuff for a couple to six months and learn all the classic songs you can find. Play along to everything. Eventually it becomes second nature. Some people do this really fast and some people arent convincingly funky ever, however hard they try. They can play funk lines note perfect and sound completely unfunky. The danger with funk and reggae is that they are crystal meth for bassists, I got into funk and never got away, really. Everything I write now has a hint of funk in it, and most of the reggae I try and come up with sounds like ska Its is a powerful addiction! If I weren't ridiculously busy though I'd have a jam and offer some pointers, but I don't do structured teaching anymore, time etc etc....[/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 [quote name='AM1' post='484913' date='May 11 2009, 11:12 AM']Simon - hi If you don't ask, you don't get, so I thought it worthwhile to at least try! There's a guy that does free drum and bass lessons in West London, I've seen his adverts in the studio but I won't be back in that studio until later in the month. Maybe he's a serial killer though and the lessons are to lure his victims in! Anyway - yeah thanks for the really useful tips! The intention is definitely to join more bands in more styles once I can play those other styles more convincingly. I know exactly what you mean about funk, it's infiltrating into my fingers all the time, despite my best attempts to stop it! My fingers have got the funk! Anyway - a bit of diversity is definitely good to shake up the mix now and again. What you said about punk - there seems to be a really common misconception that punk is the easiest style to play - well it's as easy as you want to make it, there are some great punky bass players around that easily demolish that misconception. I personally prefer melodic punk basslines rather than typical 3 chord root note pick basslines but try playing flat out punk bass in that style for 4 hours! Not as easy as people think! I live in hope that there is someone who will give up some free time to help in my quest! Cheers AM[/quote] Hey AM, I hope you work something out! I've played enough noise to know punk can be very tricky - it was a very crude generalisation . My first band were very influenced by punk, Jon Zorn's Naked City, and all sorts of thrash stuff as well as funk and dissonant noise; but we had a flutist and two drummers so I don't think anyone knew what it was we played stylistically. It was very very fast and very complicated though so fast we never did a gig that lasted longer than 40 minutes! Just long enough to scare the punters away usually. You will get through this. If it works for you like it did for me, each style you get under you belt and each technique you nail will feel like another plateau, then you strive again for ages before getting up to the next plateau. It does take time. It is not always the case that more practice makes the time taken to reach the next level shorter. Often its practicing exactly the right thing in the right way for the right amount of time that gets the job done best. Working out what to practice, and how is very difficult to master. Break everything down. Easiest way to do this for pure technique and speed issues IMO, is to record yourself attempting to play whatever at a speed where you can do it perfectly. Now go to the point tempo-wise where its starting to go wrong and record yourself there. Listen and compare and take (mental) notes. Sometimes when playing you miss things you hear when just listening. Figure out exactly what the issue is. If its a string skip, a muted thump, your fingering getting out of shape. Now isolate that precise bit. Whatever it is, just slow down and only work on that part, very very slowly. Completely internalize that tiny part of the whole. This is tedious, but get really Zen-like in your approach. Over the course of half an hour by increments of just a couple of bpm, bring the speed up (you have a metronome dont you?). When you can get no faster go back down to the speed where you were originally going wrong and play the whole thing. Now speed up until you are fluffing another part (remember the recording again). Repeat until you are at Mach 10 and we all bow before AM1 the fastest most precise bassist on the site Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faithless Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 [quote name='51m0n' post='484867' date='May 11 2009, 12:24 PM']Get a hold of Michael Manrings old VHS video. He concentrates for the first 3/4 of the video on finger conditioning. He goes into a staggering amount of depth and provides a huge array of well constructed exercises. No they wont change anything overnight, but if you actually do them for 6 months you wont believe the difference they make! And they are very focused on not damaging yourself and good warm ups etc. There is virtually nothing he cant do with his fingers on a fretboard, so I'd say take his advice - it helped me no end....[/quote] Hey, matey, could you tell the exact name of that video? Can't find it anywhere.. Cheers, Faith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geek99 Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 I found it in my local library - they may be talking about "Michael Manring Bass Guitar Learn to play Tuition DVD" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 11, 2009 Author Share Posted May 11, 2009 Hi again Simon, thanks for taking the time to post all that, I really appreciate it! I know you are right about the tempo stuff - it has certainly worked in the past...you are right, I just need to be a bit more patient. Stylistically yes, I am hitting definite plateaus here and there but they do always get resolved with a bit of work, patience and time. But now it's my right hand technique - and this is not just a plateau, in that time and work will solve it, but seems more like a fundamental technique issue that needs a major overhaul. I have done a bit of recording and it's definitely that right hand technique that needs to be fixed. When I play with floating thumb, it does slow down the string crossing a bit, particularly coming back up the strings...but when I try and play with my thumb anchored, I can't damp the notes very well...so there's still ringing out of other notes (not massively but enough that I can hear it) - to me, it sounds like absolute crap when I record it - so even though I practice with a metronome and am seeing great improvements in my timing, it's kind of pointless if I can't clean up my playing. When I slow it down, it doesn't seem any easier to fix the damping issues. I know I can nail this, but it's just a bit frustrating. Anyway - thanks for the advice, very decent of you. [quote name='51m0n' post='485177' date='May 11 2009, 04:46 PM']Hey AM, I hope you work something out! You will get through this. If it works for you like it did for me, each style you get under you belt and each technique you nail will feel like another plateau, then you strive again for ages before getting up to the next plateau. It does take time. It is not always the case that more practice makes the time taken to reach the next level shorter. Often its practicing exactly the right thing in the right way for the right amount of time that gets the job done best. Working out what to practice, and how is very difficult to master. Break everything down. Easiest way to do this for pure technique and speed issues IMO, is to record yourself attempting to play whatever at a speed where you can do it perfectly. Now go to the point tempo-wise where its starting to go wrong and record yourself there.[/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 [quote name='AM1' post='484738' date='May 11 2009, 12:43 AM']Ha, you're not wrong! Plus it's cheaper than Stella! Yeah - it's not specifically one thing, there's loads of stuff ranging from a multitude of technique issues to improving versatility in terms of various music styles, gaining deeper understanding of chord "chemistry", which scales will work best over certain chords in certain contexts, improving my live sound, playing appropriate basslines in more complicated time signatures...groove playing...I could go on....basically I need to get better faster. It's mainly technique stuff at the moment though which is really beginning to slow progress, I can't make my fingers do what I want them to do on certain stuff, even with hours and hours of work on it. There's some great music opportunities around for stuff I am really interested in but I need to get my ass in gear and make much more progress than is happening currently. PS - I'm not looking for an overnight miracle and I will do whatever work it takes, I just need some pointers, there's only so much you can learn off YouTube![/quote] I have been called an 'Overnight Miracle' before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 11, 2009 Author Share Posted May 11, 2009 [quote name='ped' post='485298' date='May 11 2009, 08:07 PM']I have been called an 'Overnight Miracle' before.[/quote] There's a story here - kindly elaborate please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 I don't kiss and tell. And neither does Kiwi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 11, 2009 Author Share Posted May 11, 2009 [quote name='ped' post='485327' date='May 11 2009, 08:41 PM']I don't kiss and tell. And neither does Kiwi.[/quote] Haha....there's only one response to that: "It ain't me that's gay, it's my boyfriend". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 11, 2009 Author Share Posted May 11, 2009 [quote name='ped' post='485327' date='May 11 2009, 08:41 PM']I don't kiss and tell. And neither does Kiwi.[/quote] Hey Pedro, it's gone terribly quiet in here all of a sudden. Did you boys know that sometimes silence can be interpreted as guilt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-soar Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Stop spending money on beer and save for some lessons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 12, 2009 Author Share Posted May 12, 2009 [quote name='steve-soar' post='485546' date='May 12 2009, 07:41 AM']Stop spending money on beer and save for some lessons.[/quote] Haha, thanks for that constructive advice, that was really useful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-soar Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Glad to be of service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 12, 2009 Author Share Posted May 12, 2009 [quote name='steve-soar' post='485585' date='May 12 2009, 08:52 AM']Glad to be of service.[/quote] Yeah, being a knob was really helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-soar Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 .....and we're off again. I could say, stop being the Basschat troll but I won't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 12, 2009 Author Share Posted May 12, 2009 [quote name='steve-soar' post='485591' date='May 12 2009, 08:58 AM'].....and we're off again. I could say, stop being the Basschat troll but I won't.[/quote] Right, yes, I can quite see why a thread asking for constructive advice on improving bass playing, on a bass forum, is trolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-soar Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Troll. You been outed as a Troll, end of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted May 12, 2009 Author Share Posted May 12, 2009 [quote name='steve-soar' post='485599' date='May 12 2009, 09:03 AM']Troll. You been outed as a Troll, end of.[/quote] Ah right. Forgive me for being unaware of your role as the self-appointed Basschat Troll Spotter but could you kindly elaborate as to this apparent "outing"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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