Struggling to keep the plucking hand above the P pickup

[nagasaki45]

Hi Basschat!

 

Long time lurker first time poster. Really enjoy reading and learning here. So thanks for that!

 

As the title says, I'm struggling to keep plucking, fingerstyle, over the P pickup. When concentrated on my tone while playing I usually like to stay over the P pickup as I find the sound more aggressive / gnarly as I like. But often while playing (exercises from a method book, for example) I find my plucking hand shifting towards the bridge to play over the bridge J pickup. A few possible reasons why:

 

- The sound of plucking over the bridge J pickup is tighter, so the better definition helps me hearing what's going on while playing exercises etc.

- It's a habit. I think I'm used to play over the bridge J pickup most of my life. This preference towards a more aggressive tone that I get over the P pickup is relatively new. Maybe I just need to re-wire my brain, e.g. maybe it's just practice.

- Third option, which is what I suspect: the string tension is easier for me to play over the bridge J pickup. The strings feel much tighter there under the plucking hand, which I find easier to play. So maybe it's not just a technique / practice thing, but something in my setup that pushes me to play in a sub-optimal position (for me).

 

I'm not sure which of these are the reason for making it hard to keep my hand planted over the P pickup. I guess it's a mixture of them. I would love to hear your advice, especially regarding the 3rd point, if you think it's a setup issue more than a technique issue. I was thinking, either to raise the action (it's quite low at the moment), or change strings from the nickel hybrid slinkies to heavier gauge (50-110) or to higher tension. Do you think something like that would help?

 

Hope this messy question makes any sense 🙂

 

Thanks,

Tom

[uk_lefty]

Just anchor your thumb onto the p pup itself. While practicing just try to keep consistency of tone and hand position and you'll get into the habit. 

[Baloney Balderdash]

1 hour ago, uk_lefty said:

Just anchor your thumb onto the p pup itself. While practicing just try to keep consistency of tone and hand position and you'll get into the habit. 

OP doesn't really specify this, but in case they currently are utilizing floating thumb technique I wouldn't advice to sacrifice this, beside loosing the general freedom this technique gives you having to completely relearn how to do things such as proper muting (as far as I can see sacrificing floating thumb technique in favor of a fixed anchor, if this would be the case, would create more issues than it would solve).

 

However if OP does in fact currently utilize a fixed anchor it would be the obvious answer and a sound piece of advice to just move that anchor to the P pickup.

 

And, yeah, as otherwise suggested, just practice, and keep correcting yourself and reposition your hand over the desired picking position over the P pickup whenever you find it drifting towards the position closer to the bridge over the J pickup out of old habit.

 

You might also want to experiment with the general position of your plucking arm, and see if there is possibly a way you can make adjustments that will make the desired picking spot over the P pickup feel easier/more natural to you.

 

Edited November 26, 2023 by Baloney Balderdash

[Paolo85]

Maybe it's just a matter of creating a new habit? Maybe you could put something like painter tape on the bass body and around your wrist, lose enough that you can move around the P pickup but no more. Just for a few days until you get the new habit.

If then you want to play over the bridge because your sound gets out more or because it is easier to play fast it's all good, but it would be a conscious decision. In an ideal world one would mive the plucking hand around all the time to get the best sound for each song/part.

I think Jaco once asked about his signature sound of playing over the bridge said that aming other things it helped him go faster. I personally always found the increased tension at the bridge to be just hard work. But I play with a soft touch so it's not like the strings bounce up and down toi much. Maybe you could try that?

[nagasaki45]

Thanks for the comments!

 

2 hours ago, uk_lefty said:

Just anchor your thumb onto the p pup itself.

Doing that already, but when moving to D or G strings my thumb goes up to the E string and from there I start to shift towards the bridge. To be honest, I think that what happens. When I concentrate on this I stay over the P pickup but when trying to follow a score or play something fast I suddenly find myself over the J pickup and not sure how I got there. Maybe I should video myself and see how this happens.

 

2 hours ago, Baloney Balderdash said:

in case they currently are utilizing floating thumb technique

Nope. The thumb is always resting somewhere. Either the P pickup or the E string. Maybe even the A string.

 

1 hour ago, Paolo85 said:

Maybe you could put something like painter tape on the bass body and around your wrist, lose enough that you can move around the P pickup but no more.

Interesting idea! Will give it a shot.

1 hour ago, Paolo85 said:

But I play with a soft touch so it's not like the strings bounce up and down toi much. Maybe you could try that?

I've been trying to soften my touch in the past few months, to see if it improves my technique, not only for the issue in this thread, also for plucking hand speed. To be honest, I'm not sure I like the tone I get, and I don't think it made me faster. Will keep trying though.

 

You all suggested it's more of a habit / technique thing than a setup thing. That's good to know. Will try to improve this by practicing then.

 

BTW, maybe the thread can be moved to the technique sub-forum?

 

Thanks again for your help!

Tom

[neepheid]

Your arm is the length it is and will naturally fall where it's going to fall, depending on the geometry of the bass in question.  I normally anchor on whatever pickup is in the P position, but when I'm playing my Explorer, my hand naturally ends up on the bridge pickup due to the relative position of the bass when worn on a strap.  I'm lazy and ignorant so I don't fight it, but if you want to because you feel you must have your hand on the "P" pickup, then you've got some training/practice ahead of you.  There's no easy way to lose what it sounds like you perceive as a bad habit.

 

Presumably there is an actual, physical J pickup there, and not a phantom, imaginary one?  If this is happening on a plain P bass, then the BC answer is obvious - get a PJ bass, problem solved 

 

[Skybone]

It is a case of trying to retrain your self to play where you want. Create a new habit as Paolo said.

 

I did something similar about 10-15 years ago. I'd always been a pick player from when I started playing. Finger-style didn't work for me when I started, and playing with a pick allowed my to get my playing speed up. Anyway, I'd had a bit of a break from playing bass, and decided to get back into it again, but this time playing with fingers. It would have been easy to pick up a plectrum and start where I'd left off, but thought that it'd be worth the effort (it was).

 

Add to the fact that I was playing a Ric, which kind of demands a slightly different playing style to a P or J style bass. Just to add a bit more complication into the mix.

 

Anchor your thumb on the edge of the pickup, and use the thumb as a pivot.

 

There is also a lot to be said for moving your playing hand anyway, as you get a different type of sound when you play near the neck and near the bridge.

[acidbass]

Does the issue occur when you are sitting or standing, or both?  Perhaps adjusting strap length to adapt the ergonomics of your playing would be a consideration. 

[nagasaki45]

On 26/11/2023 at 15:00, neepheid said:

Presumably there is an actual, physical J pickup there, and not a phantom, imaginary one?  If this is happening on a plain P bass, then the BC answer is obvious - get a PJ bass, problem solved 

 

It's a Yamaha BB414, so yes, the J pickup is real 😄

The "get a PJ bass" suggestion actually made me think, maybe without the J it will be less comfortable to play over the J pickup, so I will stay over the P 🤔

 

5 hours ago, acidbass said:

Does the issue occur when you are sitting or standing, or both?  Perhaps adjusting strap length to adapt the ergonomics of your playing would be a consideration. 

 

I always play standing. Didn't think about changing the strap length. Will try!

 

BTW, yesterday and today I tried to notice a bit more what's going on while playing, and I can say that my thumb rests on the E string way more often than I initially thought. I would say, whenever I don't play the E string, the thumb is on it, or on the A string. It moves to the A string when there's a section that is only on D and G strings. From the moment I'm on the E string it's easier to move towards the bridge without noticing.

 

As everyone says, it's mainly breaking an old habit. I will try the suggestions here, or just slow down what I'm playing to concentrate more on my right hand until it will feel natural to stay where I want to stay.

[neepheid]

6 minutes ago, nagasaki45 said:

It's a Yamaha BB414, so yes, the J pickup is real 😄

The "get a PJ bass" suggestion actually made me think, maybe without the J it will be less comfortable to play over the J pickup, so I will stay over the P 🤔

 

Whichever answer leads to buying a new bass, that's the correct BC answer

[shoulderpet]

One of these over the bridge should help

[Dan Dare]

Put a thumb rest on the instrument? You can position it to suit where you want the hand to fall.