Bilbo Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 [quote name='Rich' post='391774' date='Jan 26 2009, 02:06 PM']Yes, and a hell of a lot of people play simple thuggish music for the unwashed masses, for fun. I used to be in a pub blues-rock trio and had a whale of a time. Loved it. And I love jazz too. Please tell me you weren't serious when you wrote that, Bilbo..?[/quote] Fun is massively overrated Ok, I might have milked it a bit for effect.... but the spirit of it is what matters! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 [quote name='Cantdosleepy' post='391826' date='Jan 26 2009, 03:14 PM'][Complex jazz expert]'s music is, say Jodorowsky's Holy Mountain, compared to Spoon's Shotgun Stories. Simplicity if executed well can be staggering.[/quote] Totally agree - but when all you get is simplicity, it loses its impact. Just like the complex. Its all about tension and release, yin and yang, Scooby and Shaggy.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cantdosleepy Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 ...Howard and Vince? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobodysprefect Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 (edited) I'm going to chime in! Take cover! Like some others, started reading music at 7 or 8 I think and it's been invaluable for me as a way of developing as a musician as well as instrumental (gotcha?) in rendering the services required of me. An anecdote: we were hired to be the house band at a large-ish festival that is televised by the national TV company. Now, I'll admit right away that the festival is the biennal of our national church, not a rock festival or for profit (for prophet tho?) thing. They usually get the more spiritually-oriented or attention-whorish popular singers to do a bit and who gets to accompany the latter if not yours truly. Only it's not the attention whore, it's their daughter. Who has no concept of time or pitch. And the song is an awful piece of garbage that hasn't been recorded or performed anywhere before. And we get one rehearsal run. I challenge anyone to doing that by ear. This sound pretentious to you? Read my sigs. <-- what does this mean? Means I know a little about putting in the work and reaping the rewards. Means I appreciate studiousness, applying oneself, understanding and competence. If (the general) you don't, it's fine. It's all subjective. What is not subjective is the fact that as a rule, the skills attained by repeated applying of attention to attaining complex skills is rewarded and for the most part, the possession of those skills is seen as a desirable state by others as well as self. Also, it's a reference to Bill Clinton. Edited January 26, 2009 by nobody's prefect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBeefChief Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 [quote name='nobody's prefect' post='391917' date='Jan 26 2009, 05:01 PM']I challenge anyone to doing that by ear.[/quote] That's cool if you like playing those types of gigs. A lot of us don't. Your description of the (dreadful) gig in question hardly motivates me to learn to read! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBeefChief Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 [quote name='BigBeefChief' post='391927' date='Jan 26 2009, 05:08 PM']That's cool if you like playing those types of gigs. A lot of us don't. Your description of the (dreadful) gig in question hardly motivates me to learn to read![/quote] .........although, f*** it, I'll give it a go! Anyone know of any good, cheap/free resources for beginners like me? Don't recommend anything Jazz based as a smack in the mouth often offends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eight Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 (edited) [quote name='BigBeefChief' post='391945' date='Jan 26 2009, 05:28 PM'].........although, f*** it, I'll give it a go![/quote] That's pretty cool of you. I found this page a little while ago while looking for a flash game to quickly recap my knowledge of the bass clef. It looks pretty well written and could be good to get your started. I think you're safe on the jazz front [url="http://www.studybass.com/lessons/reading-music/"]http://www.studybass.com/lessons/reading-music/[/url] The first five lessons there should be good for you to run with. Then playing the Flash game a lot ( [url="http://www.studybass.com/tools/bass-clef-notes/"]http://www.studybass.com/tools/bass-clef-notes/[/url] ) should help you speed up recognising the pitches. With the notes down, learning to read the rhythms should be easier. Edit: that reminds me, I must put more time into learning where those notes are on the fretboard. Always seem to be bloody studying something. Edited January 26, 2009 by Eight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waynepunkdude Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 [quote name='BigBeefChief' post='391495' date='Jan 26 2009, 10:47 AM']Please point me in the direction of a formally trained musician who is currently producing great music.[/quote] [quote name='jakesbass' post='391506' date='Jan 26 2009, 10:57 AM']Barry Manilow[/quote] One of the funniest things I have ever read Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 [quote name='skankdelvar' post='391732' date='Jan 26 2009, 01:42 PM']The study of music theory and the ability to sight read clearly is not sufficient in itself to bring on staleness and w*nkery. Other conditions include: "Bass Player" hats[/quote] Oh sh*t, I just bought one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='EssentialTension' post='392207' date='Jan 26 2009, 10:12 PM']Oh sh*t, I just bought one. [/quote] As long as it's a pirate hat, that's fine. Or a WW1 German Spiked Helmet. Purple berets, leather pork pie hats, top hats - very difficult to carry off with aplomb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='BigBeefChief' post='391945' date='Jan 26 2009, 05:28 PM'].........although, f*** it, I'll give it a go![/quote] if you invest the same amount of time as you have in this thread, you'll probably have it sussed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cantdosleepy Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 A good super-intro book is Gary Willis' Ear Training for Guitar and Bass. It's very much the thin end of the wedge, theory-wise, but should have immediate practical application. The idea is that you develop 'relative' pitch - when you hear two notes one after the other you can say 'Ah, the second one is a minor third higher than the first.' The plan is to reverse engineer that knowledge, so that when you're writing a bassline in your band you can think to yourself "I want to play this 'bum du-du baaaaa' melody I just thought up" and you won't have to spend three minutes working out which frets to hit - you'll know in your head the relationship between the notes and can getit right the first time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcrow Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='BigBeefChief' post='391495' date='Jan 26 2009, 10:47 AM']Please point me in the direction of a formally trained musician who is currently producing great music.[/quote] john williams...its a big world out there old chap.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBeefChief Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='mrcrow' post='392861' date='Jan 27 2009, 04:10 PM']john williams...its a big world out there old chap.. [/quote] The film score dude? I'm afraid I'm not at the age where I'm gonna start creeping round the film score aisle of HMV trying not to piss my pants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 No idea who did it, but I tip my hat to whoever arranged Metallica's S&M album. Wonderful stuff. I love the marrying of traditional and contemporary in that way. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 Found it! Michael Kamen! Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='BigBeefChief' post='392864' date='Jan 27 2009, 04:14 PM']The film score dude?[/quote] Have you heard the Theme from Schindler's List? If that isn't great music, what is? There is a version of it on YouTube with Itzhal Perlman playing the solo. 4.14 of you life to see another way of moving people. Go on, you know you want to..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='Cantdosleepy' post='392446' date='Jan 27 2009, 09:45 AM']A good super-intro book is Gary Willis' Ear Training for Guitar and Bass. It's very much the thin end of the wedge, theory-wise, but ... you'll know in your head the relationship between the notes and can getit right the first time.[/quote] That sounds like the b*ll*cks. I'm having some of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBeefChief Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='bilbo230763' post='392878' date='Jan 27 2009, 04:30 PM']Have you heard the Theme from Schindler's List? If that isn't great music, what is? There is a version of it on YouTube with Itzhal Perlman playing the solo. 4.14 of you life to see another way of moving people. Go on, you know you want to.....[/quote] I'll check it out this evening. Never seen the film. I'm more of a Seagal man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 There's tons of great music out there written by people with classical musical training, BUT one persons idea of great music is different to someone elses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcrow Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='BigBeefChief' post='392864' date='Jan 27 2009, 04:14 PM']The film score dude? I'm afraid I'm not at the age where I'm gonna start creeping round the film score aisle of HMV trying not to piss my pants.[/quote] well you asked but didnt say a trained musician under the age of 18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBeefChief Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='mrcrow' post='393003' date='Jan 27 2009, 06:10 PM']well you asked but didnt say a trained musician under the age of 18 [/quote] I don't mind old musicians (I usually prefer them) I just always assumed it was only coffin-dodgers and train-spotters that listened to film scores. I just watch the film. The Score is usually included. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcrow Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='bilbo230763' post='392878' date='Jan 27 2009, 04:30 PM']Have you heard the Theme from Schindler's List? If that isn't great music, what is? There is a version of it on YouTube with Itzhal Perlman playing the solo. 4.14 of you life to see another way of moving people. Go on, you know you want to.....[/quote] have your heard the theme from death in venice it was written by a trained musician gustav mahler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBeefChief Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 [quote name='mrcrow' post='393020' date='Jan 27 2009, 06:22 PM']have your heard the theme from death in venice it was written by a trained musician gustav mahler[/quote] I'd probably enjoy half these things if I could get over the fact that deep down I see them as a being a pretentious, middle class pursuit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
risingson Posted January 27, 2009 Share Posted January 27, 2009 I'm still only fairly young but my take on reading is that it's not as important as getting your ears together, which I honestly think is infinitely more important. Every good musician should have a good understanding of harmony, melody and rhythm, if you can read then great, you'll get a lot of work doing it, but it's not the be all and end all. However... there is no doubting that the likes of Nathan East hasn't got by all these years on just ear training. Most of the big session guys like Will Lee, Nathan East, etc. can read like monsters, mostly because they've come from a classical background and then moved onto bass playing. Freddie Washington in particular is supposed to be more or less unearthly in this department. Pino Palladino is quite the opposite, saying he gets by more using his ear having never been a great reader, which is equally admirable. So it's probably not everything to be able to read... but it would help to learn if you want to be a serious player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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