henry norton Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I've owned two MusicMan basses in my time - a pre-EB 4 string and a Stingray 5. The 5 had a perfect finish, beautiful birdseye maple neck and played perfectly whereas my old 4 string had an awful metalflake red finish that cracked and a truss rod that was really difficult to adjust. They both sounded very good but I don't understand (other than the usual age thing) why pre EB's are so coveted. Or is this a question everyone else in the world knows the answer to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 [quote name='henry norton' post='374432' date='Jan 8 2009, 08:59 PM']I've owned two MusicMan basses in my time - a pre-EB 4 string and a Stingray 5. The 5 had a perfect finish, beautiful birdseye maple neck and played perfectly whereas my old 4 string had an awful metalflake red finish that cracked and a truss rod that was really difficult to adjust. They both sounded very good but I don't understand (other than the usual age thing) why pre EB's are so coveted. Or is this a question everyone else in the world knows the answer to?[/quote] Firstly the SR5 and the SR4 are very different beasts so you can't compare them like-for-like. Secondly, you might simply have owned a great 5 and a crap 4, so again the comparison isn't too reliable. I've owned 7 'rays (yes, a little extreme I'll admit), two SR5s, two SUBs and two Bongos. One of the rays was a Pre EB and it blew all of the other EBs out of the water. Better tone, more powerful, better made, and beter to play. Still an unreliable analysis as there's only one Pre EB in the mix, but I'm sure others will lend their opinions below Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigthumb Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 You get some good Fenders and bad ones and its pretty much the same with Stingrays I guess. I thought that Beedster's pre EB was great and had quite different attributes to other Stingrays I've owned (6 I think). My personal favorite was a '86 (Ernie Ball). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obi 2 kenobi Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 Hi, I own a pre-EB (1978) and an EB (1987). Difficult to compare the two as the EB is 3EQ. That aside as people say there are good and bad ones from both eras out there. The EB rays are consistent, less likely to find a dog. A good pre-EB with the extra weight (from my experience pre EBs are significantly heavier than EBs), string thru' body (which gives a tighter feel compared to same strings on a standard bridge) and 2eq sounds and feels great. Personally you can't match it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 From my experience, the pre-EB Stingrays (and some of the very early EB ones) have a somewhat different colour to their tone on the 2-band EQ models - the older ones are a little more midrangey and punchy, where the newer ones are brighter with less mids. They both have that typical MM "thwack" to the tone, but, to my ears, the older ones seem to move more air. The newer ones are most definitely better made though, with the 6-bolt neck, body-end truss rod adjustment, etc. Plus, the finishes are far better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry norton Posted January 9, 2009 Author Share Posted January 9, 2009 Thanx for the replies - I still don't quite get it but maybe that's just me. I guess it's down to the old adage 'it's worth what people are willing to pay for it'. I loved both my MusicMan's (MusicMen????) and I might get me another one day although the range seems frighteningly big now. The Bongo looks quite good - asides from the name.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lateralus462 Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 [quote name='henry norton' post='375310' date='Jan 9 2009, 04:04 PM']The Bongo looks quite good - asides from the name....[/quote] ....and the fact that it's quite possibly the ugliest bass ever made!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutToPlayJazz Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 Nah, the Bongo is a really cool looking bass for me. Funnily enough, I was in electro and played a new 3eq Ray and it was truly dull! I've only played one I loved the sound of and that was a brand new 2eq with a matching painted headstock in gloss black. It really sang! Still never played a Bongo, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lateralus462 Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 [quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='375333' date='Jan 9 2009, 04:24 PM']Nah, the Bongo is a really cool looking bass for me. Funnily enough, I was in electro and played a new 3eq Ray and it was truly dull! I've only played one I loved the sound of and that was a brand new 2eq with a matching painted headstock in gloss black. It really sang! Still never played a Bongo, though.[/quote] I've heard a couple of Bongo's and they both sounded fantastic, I just can't get past the look - far too round. And my 3eq 'Ray is far from dull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delberthot Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 The were a lot of quality issues between CLF (Leo Fender's company) and Musicman where MM wasn't happy with what CLF were producing, this ultimately led Leo to give MM the Spanish Archer and start G&L in 1980 or thereabouts. Later ones were made by Grover Jackson's company using mainly left over CLF parts until Ernie Ball bought the company. Post-EB basses have been very consistent so unless there is a specific feature you want such as the Flea bridge or string mutes, there is little to choose between them - oh yeah, they got rid of those hellish flat cut pickup poles that scraped your fingers in favour of the bevelled ones. There have been various changes made to the EQ, most noticably going from the original 2eq to 3eq. There's all the info you need here including all the rare and one-off stuff: [url="http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/TOWN8019/"]http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/TOWN8019/[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB1 Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 (edited) [quote name='lateralus462' post='375313' date='Jan 9 2009, 04:08 PM']....and the fact that it's quite possibly the ugliest bass ever made!!!![/quote] MB1. +Twelvety! Looks like a Toilet Seat!. PRE EB....Think Louis Johnson....The Brothers Johnson! Edited January 9, 2009 by MB1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh3184 Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 I've always quite liked the bongo- especially the limited edition in dargie green. mmmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 [quote name='Delberthot' post='375500' date='Jan 9 2009, 06:25 PM']The were a lot of quality issues between CLF (Leo Fender's company) and Musicman where MM wasn't happy with what CLF were producing, this ultimately led Leo to give MM the Spanish Archer and start G&L in 1980 or thereabouts. Later ones were made by Grover Jackson's company using mainly left over CLF parts until Ernie Ball bought the company. Post-EB basses have been very consistent so unless there is a specific feature you want such as the Flea bridge or string mutes, there is little to choose between them - oh yeah, they got rid of those hellish flat cut pickup poles that scraped your fingers in favour of the bevelled ones. There have been various changes made to the EQ, most noticably going from the original 2eq to 3eq.[/quote] Leo was disappointed with how badly the Stingray guitars were selling and blamed Musicman for that. It has been suggested that he deliberately sabotaged the bass necks that CLF were sub contracted to make for Musicman, after the guitar was dropped from the range, by shipping them with un-anchored truss rods (essentially useless). There were also other supply issues which led to Musicman approaching a number of lesser known luthiers (including Wayne Charvel) to augment the production of bodies. Towards the eventual sale of Musicman to Ernie Ball, the bodies for the basses could have been made from ash, alder, poplar or even (in a couple of cases) mahogany! They were literally chucking instruments together and getting them out the door. There may well be some great basses from that 82-85 era but generally quality control was more than a little lax. IMO, basses from the late 80's are the best value. An 87 or 88 Stingray is better designed, with tighter and more stable neck joint, more consistent woods and finishes. Ernie Ball had something to prove in terms of the branding so the redesign and manufacture was way above the quality of the early 80's instruments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delberthot Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 (edited) IMO nothing better than a mahogany Stingray has growl coming out the wazoo Edited January 10, 2009 by Delberthot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayfan Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 [quote name='henry norton' post='374432' date='Jan 8 2009, 08:59 PM']I don't understand (other than the usual age thing) why pre EB's are so coveted.[/quote] Like anything, it's part nostalgia. The older ones weren't as well made (some of the later ones were slapped together out of the parts bin when Leo Fender has a big bust up with MusicMan) but people seem to think there's more heritage to them. A bit like old Fenders. Also there's a bit of snobbishness about Ernie Ball taking over and churning them out (albeit to a higher standard). If you pick up a good old one, they often have that 'worn in' feel which makes them better to play but that's true of any bass, I think. In the 80/90s, people apparently sniffed at the poor quality 70s Fenders, now they're coveted as vintage! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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